Any of you real men want to call Scott Cochran a candy ass?

[Gamecockben1979]

Nice dodge.

You called Biles a "quitter" on her team - she was experiencing what others aptly described as a sort of vertigo in mid-air. The "twisties" as they are called, are a loss of equilibrium or spatial awareness during flipping, spinning, and somersaulting through the air, where the performer doesn't know up from down, nor left from right. You equating Urban Meyer with Scott Cochran has absolutely NOTHING to do with Simone Biles' situation.

My analogies of football coaches or players were not supposed to be towards Cochran or Meyer. They were towards Bile's situation - Biles WAS in danger of paralysis or death if she performed the more dangerous disciplines of her Olympics. Or at least, she certainly was concerned that she was....

I know I called her a quitter. No quotes needed. She quit. She “practiced” these moves in an effort to get back to competing so this idea of paralysis or death is being overly dramatic.

I posted in another thread and can even show you statistically she had a better chance of getting struck by lightning or her plane crashing than getting paralyzed or killed in gymnastics.

Some of you make it sound like she went through a Taliban infested area and pulled out some American school kids because she competed in a sport.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

That's stupid....

Bad day huh. My Monday sucked too. Hang in there.

 

[Flameout12]

Nice dodge.

You called Biles a "quitter" on her team -

Jerks gonna jerk...

I quit 5 different jobs because I got better ones. And I quit my last one because I quit working & retired.
I also quit going to school because I got my degree.
I also quit cutting grass because I don't have grass anymore.
I also quit going to the orthodontist because I got my braces off.

But....I'm a quitter.

Sucks to be me...but I'm just a low down low life quitter. I am what I am.

 

[Flameout12]

I know I called her a quitter. No quotes needed. She quit. She “practiced” these moves in an effort to get back to competing so this idea of paralysis or death is being overly dramatic.

I posted in another thread and can even show you statistically she had a better chance of getting struck by lightning or her plane crashing than getting paralyzed or killed in gymnastics.

Some of you make it sound like she went through a Taliban infested area and pulled out some American school kids because she competed in a sport.

Just stop it...you're already showing you azz as an internet jerk.

 

[BigWillieCock]

So a coach that finds out that he/she has a heart condition mid-season, where the stresses and excitement of a football season could result in them dying, choosing to stop coaching mid-season, is a quitter in your mind??

A football player that also discovers a heart condition, or a spinal condition in the middle of a season, that makes continuing to play in such a heavy-contact sport a risk of paralysis for the rest of his life, or even result in his death - choosing to stop playing immediately, is considered a "quitter" to you??

I didn’t write the definition.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Jerks gonna jerk...

I quit 5 different jobs because I got better ones. And I quit my last one because I quit working & retired.
I also quit going to school because I got my degree.
I also quit cutting grass because I don't have grass anymore.
I also quit going to the orthodontist because I got my braces off.

But....I'm a quitter.

Sucks to be me...but I'm just a low down low life quitter. I am what I am.

Did you cut the whole yard or mow a few rows and then stop?
Did you take the braces off a year early or was it time to come off?

 

[Conway Gamecock]

The issue in my opinion is that the media made her out to be a hero for it. There's absolutely nothing wrong with what she did if it was because of vertigo. But it didn't make her a hero. If it were truly a safety issue, there was nothing heroic about it. She just did what any normal person would/ should do. No one celebrates the people you've described in your post. The media simply acknowledges that its an unfortunate situation.

I think that there is a prevalent narrative going around in sports, that perhaps started with Naomi Osaka's choice to remove herself from the French Open and Wimbledon, to defend - not celebrate as some sort of hero - athletes looking out for their mental health, and not just jumping through the fiery hoops as entertainers simply because the public demands it of them.

You think Biles wanted to miss out on those events? In the 2016 Olympics, she won 5 medals, with 4 of them being gold medals. She came into the Tokyo Olympics in VERY strong fashion, expecting to light the world on fire. It didn't turn out that way for her - because the "2020" Olympics were held in 2021, the next Olympics will only be 3 years away, and she'll be 27 yrs old, and STILL capable of writing new chapters. She may try it all again.

But much like Osaka, when Biles wasn't able to compete there were A TON of negative social media vibes thrown Biles' way - much like how many on THIS site has done, with calling her a "quitter", etc. And with Osaka, international media played a huge role in that negative narrative, because Osaka's situation involved how that media interacted with her. I think in Biles' case the media were just trying to counter that negative narrative, and try to make themselves come out of it all smelling a little better than they did with Osaka....

 

[BigWillieCock]

i think that some of these guys on this board who mock mental illness, view someone dealing with mental issues in an extremely ignorant and distorted way. these people aren’t saying, “nah i don’t feel like it today, i’m gonna sleep in and do whatever i want, cuz fuggit.” simone didn’t quit, treat it like an injury and move on.

And maybe you’re right, I can’t speak for what anyone else is feeling. There has been so pretty serious mental illness in my family over the decades. Some very bad outcomes. So I understand it’s not bullshit.

However, when you get paid well (Biles has a net worth of $6 Million) to do one thing and you quit you are not a hero.

Quit conflating the two things as if they are mutually exclusive, they are not. Being mentally ill does not automatically make you a quitter and every quitter isn’t mentally ill.

She took the money, she quit the job. The items are facts.

We can debate until infinity on if that is good or bad because we are debating personal opinions.

 

[sickoftryingtothinkofausername]

I’ve never heard of Scott Cochran, but your initial point is idiotic. Simone Biles took time “to focus on her mental health” and was then good to go a week later?? That’s an insult to all people with legitimate mental health issues. My 15 year old has dealt with mental health issues since before she could even walk. She’s been to more psychiatrists and psychologists than I can even remember at this point. So this whole “look at me, I’m a hero for taking care of my mental health” and then 5 days days later “I’m good to go, totally cured and ready to compete again” is a total joke and total bullshit. Being too mentally weak to do the job you get paid millions for isn’t a legit “mental health” problem.

 

[Bubbaglide]

So you've ever been happy when you were mad, or sad? How does that work?? She was there cheering her teammates on. That's not enough for you?

She's already performed in past Olympics and won gold for her country. She's the most decorated Olympic and World Games athlete in United States history. Some Olympic athletes only get to win a gold medal ONCE in their lives, many don't EVER achieve that. But again, that's not enough for you......

Go back and look at the footage. She wasn't cheering her teammates on. She looked like she was only there for the optics. Check out her golf clap after Lee's routine. That was anything but cheering her on.

 

[midline]

I have a feeling in Cochrans case that as some others have suggested, that there is more to this story than him just him suddenly having a mental issue. Could be, but we will see. And who knows what is causing the problem? While many times legitimate, and should be respected, claiming mental health issues becoming the cover for just about any problems some find themselves confronted with.

 

[BigWillieCock]

I’ve never heard of Scott Cochran, but your initial point is idiotic. Simone Biles took time “to focus on her mental health” and was then good to go a week later?? That’s an insult to all people with legitimate mental health issues. My 15 year old has dealt with mental health issues since before she could even walk. She’s been to more psychiatrists and psychologists than I can even remember at this point. So this whole “look at me, I’m a hero for taking care of my mental health” and then 5 days days later “I’m good to go, totally cured and ready to compete again” is a total joke and total bullshit. Being too mentally weak to do the job you get paid millions for isn’t a legit “mental health” problem.

Right!!!

Here’s a famous quitter for you. John Daly. He did so much crap he became a punchline. Hollywood Henderson had to talk Daly out of killing himself. So where was all the mental heroism then?

 

[BigWillieCock]

I have a feeling in Cochrans case that as some others have suggested, that there is more to this story than him just him suddenly having a mental issue. Could be, but we will see. And who knows what is causing the problem? While many times legitimate, and should be respected, claiming mental health issues becoming the cover for just about any problems some find themselves confronted with.

It’s like the old “undisclosed medical condition” when the spotlight gets to bright.

 

[Lurker123]

I think the OP is saying its okay for Biles to quit because someone else did? And it's okay for him to quit because he's big and strong and can beat people up? Or it was just that he's a quitter too, but no one will call him on it to his face because he'll beat them up? Weird logic either way.

I didn't know until I read this thread that Biles competed a week after dropping out of the team event. Is that true? If so, it strikes me as very odd, and kind of makes her quitting seem worse.

 

[The Doctors Back]

Simone Biles really faced the onslaught of testosterone on this Board when she prioritized her health notwithstanding arguments here about "what a champion is" from the keyboard warriors. Well, what say you men here?
https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/...oritize-his-mental-health-and-well-being.html

For me it wasn’t a criticism of Simone, it was criticism of the media for calling her “brave.” While I can respect her watching out for her mental health, I don’t think it was brave. Especially since she continued to compete in the same Olympics that she withdrew from when she wasn’t doing well. Simone is the best gymnast EVER, but withdrawing for “mental health” reasons isn’t particularly brave.

 

[GreatestCock]

huh? no not what i’m saying, i was arguing that she didn’t seem to be a bucket of sunshine compared to her teammates is due to the fact she couldn’t compete due to the “twisties”, as opposed to her teammates were weren’t dealing with that and were able to give it their best. i’d be disappointed as well, but i’d do the same as her and show up in support regardless of how i’m viewed by fat old men.

Be careful calling them fat old men. They will start listing how they are 6'4" 225 lbs and former MMA fighters

 

[Bubbaglide]

I actually am a fat old man AND i watch MMA. Does that count for anything ?

 

[JGH 35]

i think that some of these guys on this board who mock mental illness, view someone dealing with mental issues in an extremely ignorant and distorted way. these people aren’t saying, “nah i don’t feel like it today, i’m gonna sleep in and do whatever i want, cuz fuggit.” simone didn’t quit, treat it like an injury and move on.

No, I don't think that is the issue at all. The issue is not one of mental illness, but one of honesty. You cannot see mental illness so you can only go by what the person says. Does she have a mental illness or was that just an excuse because she was doing poorly? I think probably the later. She quit but then came back and competed again. I don't believe that Mental illness is something that just comes and goes, nor is it cured in a matter of a few days. This would leave one to believe this was not the real reason for her quitting.

 

[uscg1984]

He's not strength coach. Cochran is special teams at Georgia.

Yes, I got confused about who was who and where. Still, is it common for S&C guys to make the switch to on-field coaching positions? I assumed they were more specialized.

 

[uscg1984]

You called Biles a "quitter" on her team - she was experiencing what others aptly described as a sort of vertigo in mid-air. The "twisties" as they are called, are a loss of equilibrium or spatial awareness during flipping, spinning, and somersaulting through the air, where the performer doesn't know up from down, nor left from right. You equating Urban Meyer with Scott Cochran has absolutely NOTHING to do with Simone Biles' situation.

My analogies of football coaches or players were not supposed to be towards Cochran or Meyer. They were towards Bile's situation - Biles WAS in danger of paralysis or death if she performed the more dangerous disciplines of her Olympics. Or at least, she certainly was concerned that she was....

I'd never heard of the twisties before a couple of weeks ago, but your description of it makes sense and sounds legitimate. But it doesn't sound like a mental illness or mental health issue. I agree entirely with the idea that sometimes you have to step away and get refocused, especially when you are trying to do precision maneuvers that could leave you seriously injured if done incorrectly. What I'm uneasy about is calling it a mental health issue. As mentioned above, not only does it minimize true mental health issues, but it conveys victimhood status that isn't warranted.

 

[DeBoer31]

Why’d he ever leave Alabama? He had it made there under Saban. I understand he wanted to be an on field coach but it’s not like strength coaches make chicken scratch.

yep....and as usual....Saban was right again.
Maybe he (Saban) knew better than anyone else what appeared to be the case....Cochran was a perfect fit, and at the time in his perfect job. Also...you can't bring that kind of intensity to every meeting, practice, interaction as a coach. You burn out quickly. I think most coaches with Saban's tenure know this.....but to me the story is how remarkable his decision making is, and how accurate he is with this hires, movements and staying ahead of the curve. If NS caves and gives Cochran the job he covets....who knows maybe UA is out an assistant coach and they're left scrambling to fill with a GA two weeks before a hopeful NC run.

 

[vacock#]

I'd never heard of the twisties before a couple of weeks ago, but your description of it makes sense and sounds legitimate. But it doesn't sound like a mental illness or mental health issue. I agree entirely with the idea that sometimes you have to step away and get refocused, especially when you are trying to do precision maneuvers that could leave you seriously injured if done incorrectly. What I'm uneasy about is calling it a mental health issue. As mentioned above, not only does it minimize true mental health issues, but it conveys victimhood status that isn't warranted.

My wife had a inner ear balance problem that was very real. That might be the same.

 

[bigsirspur]

Why, with no more information than what is out there, are some of you saying "there must be something more to this Cochran thing," but with Biles so many (equally uninformed people) know for a fact she is just a "quitter"? Why does there need to be more to the Cochran thing? Because it's football and he is a manly man? That doesn't fit your image of what mental health issues can do as it does with a woman? I was hoping the post would raise some awareness and cause people to re-think their preconceived notions about strong/weak and "heart of a champion" sheet. But some just rationalize their beliefs with "there must be something more" when it comes to a football man. This is why people don't get help when they need it. They worry about exactly this kind of perception.

 

[Cackdiesel]

Why, with no more information than what is out there, are some of you saying "there must be something more to this Cochran thing," but with Biles so many (equally uninformed people) know for a fact she is just a "quitter"? Why does there need to be more to the Cochran thing? Because it's football and he is a manly man? That doesn't fit your image of what mental health issues can do as it does with a woman? I was hoping the post would raise some awareness and cause people to re-think their preconceived notions about strong/weak and "heart of a champion" sheet. But some just rationalize their beliefs with "there must be something more" when it comes to a football man. This is why people don't get help when they need it. They worry about exactly this kind of perception.

Seems to me that the people you're talking about are saying neither of them have mental health issues.

They're saying Biles quit for a different reason and Cochran quit for a different reason. They may be wrong, but they're not entirely inconsistent.

I'm not one of the people saying that btw.

 

[coolcock2001]

My deddy taught me don't quit!!!!1!!

 

[Lurker123]

My wife had a inner ear balance problem that was very real. That might be the same.

My wife had the same. It didn't clear up in a week though. And no one, including her Dr, called it a mental illness.

So is that the story now? Vertigo? I have barely been keeping up with olympics, but saw a headlines that said it was injury, then it was stress (which apparently then became mental illness). Is the story now vertigo, and not mental illness?

 

[SweetgrassVodka]

Simone Biles really faced the onslaught of testosterone on this Board when she prioritized her health notwithstanding arguments here about "what a champion is" from the keyboard warriors. Well, what say you men here?
https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/...oritize-his-mental-health-and-well-being.html

Mental health is something people do not appreciate. There are disorders that affect so many people’s lives without discrimination on age, race, gender, etc. We need more awareness and more focus on helping people with mental illness. I’ve dealt with it my entire adult life. It’s very tough!

 

[Cackdiesel]

Mental health is something people do not appreciate. There are disorders that affect so many people’s lives without discrimination on age, race, gender, etc. We need more awareness and more focus on helping people with mental illness. I’ve dealt with it my entire adult life. It’s very tough!

And also more money for it. Cha-ching.

 

[bigsirspur]

Seems to me that the people you're talking about are saying neither of them have mental health issues.

They're saying Biles quit for a different reason and Cochran quit for a different reason. They may be wrong, but they're not entirely inconsistent.

I'm not one of the people saying that btw.

Very interesting point, but not quite what I was saying. Two people. Both have performed at the top of their profession. Both stop suddenly. Word on both is the same: They are taking time out to take care of their mental health. That is almost verbatim the reason given for both initially. Although the message morphed somewhat as to Ms. Biles, that was not the focus of what I was saying. My point is that with those parallels, the initial response to both initial announcements was very different here. Did anyone here say "I bet there is something else" with regard to Ms. Biles? I don't recall it if it happened. People assumed what she said was correct and some criticized her. I believe (and I am always right) that the difference in reaction is attributed to some notion that an intense, successful football coach probably is not tapping the breaks for mental health issues because it does not fit with a notion of what "strong" is. Back to your point, if you are correct that there are people here who would dismiss or deny that either has issues, that is another cause for concern.

 

[Cackdiesel]

Very interesting point, but not quite what I was saying. Two people. Both have performed at the top of their profession. Both stop suddenly. Word on both is the same: They are taking time out to take care of their mental health. That is almost verbatim the reason given for both initially. Although the message morphed somewhat as to Ms. Biles, that was not the focus of what I was saying. My point is that with those parallels, the initial response to both initial announcements was very different here. Did anyone here say "I bet there is something else" with regard to Ms. Biles? I don't recall it if it happened. People assumed what she said was correct and some criticized her. I believe (and I am always right) that the difference in reaction is attributed to some notion that an intense, successful football coach probably is not tapping the breaks for mental health issues because it does not fit with a notion of what "strong" is. Back to your point, if you are correct that there are people here who would dismiss or deny that either has issues, that is another cause for concern.

You could look at that in a number of different ways. Maybe people trust women more and they think most men are liars because we've seen a lot of men athletes/ coaches say one thing and then find something else out later. That's not fair to men. Why do we just assume they're lying?

Or maybe our society has put unreasonable expectations on men to the point that they feel the need to lie about mental health issues. Why are we treating men like this?

I'm obviously just playing devils advocate here but we really have seen this a lot with men coaches. Its not fair to Cochran, but unfortunately people just don't trust what many of them say anymore.

 

[Lurker123]

Very interesting point, but not quite what I was saying. Two people. Both have performed at the top of their profession. Both stop suddenly. Word on both is the same: They are taking time out to take care of their mental health. That is almost verbatim the reason given for both initially. Although the message morphed somewhat as to Ms. Biles, that was not the focus of what I was saying.

You bring up a point though, that cackdiesel also points out. The initial story (or was it the second story) was biles was quiting for mental health issues. Now it's changed to vertigo.

The football coach stepping down for mental health issues is assumed to be followed shortly by a story about his drinking, or banging a coed.

Biles's story morphing just adds to the distrust of using mental health as the reason.

 

[king ward]

Never has the discretionary aspect of sports board participation exhibited its value in a better way.

 

[USC2USC]

Like another poster, i think there is more to the story. There are many instances where people have left positions of their own volition or not citing health when other issues were the actual cause. Watching Sun Lee medal on the bars showed Simone in the stands with the other girls who were cheering wildly. Simone gave the obligatory golf clap with a bored look. I found that interesting

Huh? I dont know what you were watching because what I watched showed clips form the stands of Biles jumping up and down in her support for her team. And her actual teammates commented many times during the games how supportive and important she was throughout.

 

[MookieBlaylock9]

Huh? I dont know what you were watching because what I watched showed clips form the stands of Biles jumping up and down in her support for her team. And her actual teammates commented many times during the games how supportive and important she was throughout.

The extent to which these guys will go to search for evidence that supports their already determined opinion is interesting.

 

[Bubbaglide]

The extent to which these guys will go to search for evidence that supports their already determined opinion is interesting.

I didn't search for anything. I saw it on the NBC replay and commented. Maybe she clapped other times, maybe she didn't. I commented on the one instance i saw. In that one she did the golf clap thing. Search for it if you'd like. I don't GAS
The extent to which some folks will go to to justify their predetermined opinion is interesting and very consistent.

 

[MookieBlaylock9]

I didn't search for anything. I saw it on the NBC replay and commented. Maybe she clapped other times, maybe she didn't. I commented on the one instance i saw. In that one she did the golf clap thing. Search for it if you'd like. I don't GAS
The extent to which some folks will go to to justify their predetermined opinion is interesting and very consistent.

I have no opinion on the matter, because I can't guess what is going on in someone's head that I do not know. Trying to analyze someone's body language seems even more pointless.