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At what point?

psmith5532

Active Member
Sep 14, 2008
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At what point does economic survival outweigh deaths? It's a damn if you do damn if you don't situation. With the billions generated by fall sports I find it hard that the NCAA and Collage Presidents will leave all that money on the table. And will you go to the games?
 
Actually it is lives vs money. Georgia is making that gamble as we speak. And if they show no increase in deaths every state will follow suit

You need to prove your point. Exactly HOW is it lives versus money?

If you were a small business owner who had spent the last 20 years building your business, just to see it wiped out or nearly wiped out in a matter of weeks b/c the government closed your doors, you might feel a tad different about this.
 
Actually it is lives vs money. Georgia is making that gamble as we speak. And if they show no increase in deaths every state will follow suit

There will be an increase in infections and deaths, which is to be expected. We are going to end up doing what Sweden did, except we're doing it twice, and have destroyed our economy and millions of lives in the process.
 
Actually it is lives vs money. Georgia is making that gamble as we speak. And if they show no increase in deaths every state will follow suit

Disagree. Its not about lives vs. money. Its about putting people back to work so they can support themselves and their families.

The idea behind the lock-down was to 'flatten the curve' (remember that everywhere a couple of weeks ago) so that hospitals didn't become overwhelmed. Now that we've done that, its time to look at the next step.

In addition, preliminary research is showing that lock-downs don't actually prevent spreading any more efficiently than incorporating social distancing guidelines in to our daily activities and work places. If true, there's no real reason to continue hurting people by taking away their incomes. It does more damage than good.
 
Disagree. Its not about lives vs. money. Its about putting people back to work so they can support themselves and their families.

The idea behind the lock-down was to 'flatten the curve' (remember that everywhere a couple of weeks ago) so that hospitals didn't become overwhelmed. Now that we've done that, its time to look at the next step.

In addition, preliminary research is showing that lock-downs don't actually prevent spreading any more efficiently than incorporating social distancing guidelines in to our daily activities and work places. If true, there's no real reason to continue hurting people by taking away their incomes. It does more damage than good.

lives vs lives
 
You need to prove your point. Exactly HOW is it lives versus money?

If you were a small business owner who had spent the last 20 years building your business, just to see it wiped out or nearly wiped out in a matter of weeks b/c the government closed your doors, you might feel a tad different about this.
I am a small business owner for the past 15 years and I am about to see everything I've worked for wiped out. And I am for opening up businesses now...IMO, if you are ill or susceptible to the virus then stay home. I'm keeping a keen eye on Georgia that's for sure.
 
Disagree. Its not about lives vs. money. Its about putting people back to work so they can support themselves and their families.

The idea behind the lock-down was to 'flatten the curve' (remember that everywhere a couple of weeks ago) so that hospitals didn't become overwhelmed. Now that we've done that, its time to look at the next step.

In addition, preliminary research is showing that lock-downs don't actually prevent spreading any more efficiently than incorporating social distancing guidelines in to our daily activities and work places. If true, there's no real reason to continue hurting people by taking away their incomes. It does more damage than good.
I agree...so please tell that to the Government and the Healthcare professionals.
 
But, but, but.....polls show 75% of Americans still say we should be locked down! News flash - those are the people who are still working and feeding their families, the other 25% is the millions out of work, money, and food to feed their family.
 
There will be an increase in infections and deaths, which is to be expected. We are going to end up doing what Sweden did, except we're doing it twice, and have destroyed our economy and millions of lives in the process.



THIS!!! There is going to be an uptick when the stay at homes are removed, but we are currently killing off lives/businesses as we speak by being shut down. What people have worked all their lives, is being taken away from them day by day. For many who get government handouts, this is business as usual... they are still going to get their money. But for those who aren't able to work because of furloughs, business closed, etc "are bleeding a slow death by a thousand paper cuts.
 
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One of the problems with shut-down "orders" is that they treat every business of a certain type the same. Give entrepreneurial ingenuity a chance. Maybe most restaurants can't operate in a way that includes appropriate social distancing, but maybe some can. Restaurants that have large banquet rooms or outdoor dining areas may find it much easier to implement social distancing. And, just because a business is "open," doesn't mean people are going to flock back to it in the same numbers as before. The low-demand for sit-down dining may result in social distancing anyway. But some business is better than none.

As for the "deaths vs. deaths" equation, it's a choose-your-poison scenario for the country. Yes, people will die from the virus and those numbers are fairly easy to quantify. Unfortunately, deaths from a severe worldwide economic recession are very difficult to quantify, at least initially. Increases in child and domestic abuse, suicides, drug use, alcoholism, and other intangible dangers of poverty will lead to deaths too. We'll have a better feel for those costs a year from now as we look back on this time period.
 
I don’t see any reason that all of these things should have been closed to begin with. It’s also a bit of a false narrative that the government made any of these decisions as many large businesses made the decision to close down long before any of the stay in place orders were given. Based on that there is little reason to believe some of these places will just magically reopen because a local governor says it’s time.

I do think it is wise for people and businesses to proceed cautiously in terms of just letting mass amounts of people in and I don’t know that it’s particularly wise to just pile 60,000 people in a bowl and hope for the best.
 
I agree with most of the sentiments here. The curve has been flattened. The narrative appears to have shifted to preventing any and all deaths from coronavirus. In an ideal world, that would be a noble goal. However, people die everyday from a host of theoretically preventable causes, whether its car accidents, infections, the flu, cancer, disease, homicide, workplace accidents, drugs and alcohol abuse, etc. An indefinite quarantine would theoretically prevent many of those deaths as well--but at the cost of our personal freedoms. Until now, Americans haven't been willing to make that compromise. Fear-mongering by the media has convinced the majority of the country that we are imminently preparing to confront our own mortality if we don't shelter in place forever. The numbers simply don't back that up. Make no mistake, the coronavirus CAN kill you, regardless of your age or current state of health. The world has changed because of that reality, and I accept that. Wearing a seat belt is annoying, but it is a mitigation strategy to at least make a necessary yet inherently dangerous activity safer. The same analogy applies to social distancing measures--life is a bit more dangerous than it was pre-COVID, and we may need to implement minor inconveniences to keep us as safe as possible without sacrificing our God-given freedoms. To put it plainly, I support reopening businesses, reopening churches, reopening schools, etc. to the extent possible while implementing appropriate mitigation strategies--whether that is limiting capacities, providing handwashing stations and hand sanitizer, offering PPE to employees who want it.
 
We have 50,000+ deaths. Go ahead and let businesses open up. Businesses will be slow to reopen anyway (out of fear of lawsuits) and people will be slow to go out to these businesses (out of fear of catching this virus) , as long as there's no vaccine and the death total rises. That's just a fact of business and of human nature. Why should I go to the stadium and put myself at risk, when I can easily enjoy the game in front of my big screen TV?
 
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You need to prove your point. Exactly HOW is it lives versus money?

If you were a small business owner who had spent the last 20 years building your business, just to see it wiped out or nearly wiped out in a matter of weeks b/c the government closed your doors, you might feel a tad different about this.
Dishnell you hit the nail on the head! When is this enough? If everyone wore a mask outside of their home (at grocery stores, at the gas station and so on) for 30 days....this is OVER! Simple solution.
 
This thing is very contagious, but more prevalent and less lethal than originally thought. I say open up gradually, starting now. If you don`t have a significant health problem, you don`t have a compromised immune system and you`re not in a hot spot, I don`t think there is much to fear. I wear no mask(except in a nursing home), have not used hand sanitizer one time. Not bragging(it may get me!), but S.C. is not New York City. I`m more concerned frankly, about more depression/suicides, etc. than the spread of Covid. There is still a lot of hype and hysteria out there, imo, and I think people should pay more attention to ulterior motives as to why anyone would not want things to change back to the way they were soon. Again, the hotspots are different, but frankly there doesn`t seem to be a lot of them.
 
At what point does economic survival outweigh deaths? It's a damn if you do damn if you don't situation. With the billions generated by fall sports I find it hard that the NCAA and Collage Presidents will leave all that money on the table. And will you go to the games?

Here is your answer...

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If your business is taken away from this shutdown after investing all your money and hard work for 10, 15, 20 years or more, you don't lose your live but you lose your livelihood. You may lose everything that you have worked so hard to be successful. Also, you lose the ability to support your family. Yes, you are alive, but you aren't really living.
 
If your business is taken away from this shutdown after investing all your money and hard work for 10, 15, 20 years or more, you don't lose your live but you lose your livelihood. You may lose everything that you have worked so hard to be successful. Also, you lose the ability to support your family. Yes, you are alive, but you aren't really living.

Yes. That's why this is a lives vs lives decision.

Only a fool believes this is lives vs money.
 
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This is not lives vs money.

It is lives vs lives.
You have no facts to support that statement. There is no evidence that anything we have done has changed the course of this virus, but there is plenty of evidence to support that our policy has destroyed the economy and lives. Sweden took a hands off approach and didn’t lock down and has a Covid mortality rate of .02%. Spain had the most strict lock down in Europe and has a Covid mortality rate of .05%. So tell me how you know it’s lives vs lives.
 
You have no facts to support that statement. There is no evidence that anything we have done has changed the course of this virus, but there is plenty of evidence to support that our policy has destroyed the economy and lives. Sweden took a hands off approach and didn’t lock down and has a Covid mortality rate of .02%. Spain had the most strict lock down in Europe and has a Covid mortality rate of .05%. So tell me how you know it’s lives vs lives.

That is exactly what I am saying. See post #s 23 and 24.
 
I agree with most of the sentiments here. The curve has been flattened. The narrative appears to have shifted to preventing any and all deaths from coronavirus. In an ideal world, that would be a noble goal. However, people die everyday from a host of theoretically preventable causes, whether its car accidents, infections, the flu, cancer, disease, homicide, workplace accidents, drugs and alcohol abuse, etc. An indefinite quarantine would theoretically prevent many of those deaths as well--but at the cost of our personal freedoms. Until now, Americans haven't been willing to make that compromise. Fear-mongering by the media has convinced the majority of the country that we are imminently preparing to confront our own mortality if we don't shelter in place forever. The numbers simply don't back that up. Make no mistake, the coronavirus CAN kill you, regardless of your age or current state of health. The world has changed because of that reality, and I accept that. Wearing a seat belt is annoying, but it is a mitigation strategy to at least make a necessary yet inherently dangerous activity safer. The same analogy applies to social distancing measures--life is a bit more dangerous than it was pre-COVID, and we may need to implement minor inconveniences to keep us as safe as possible without sacrificing our God-given freedoms. To put it plainly, I support reopening businesses, reopening churches, reopening schools, etc. to the extent possible while implementing appropriate mitigation strategies--whether that is limiting capacities, providing handwashing stations and hand sanitizer, offering PPE to employees who want it.


Me too Johnny. We have to get this behind us & move forward!
 
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