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Daughter wants to drop out of USC after junior year.

Gamecock Lifer

Well-Known Member
Oct 8, 2008
10,027
6,875
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Two concerns for her-
1. Real estate does not pay much the first 6 months-year or so. You have to get licensed and get some deals moving, then closed before you get your first check. She will need savings or a part time job or financial support during that time.
2. I don’t like to recommend timing any markets as I cannot predict the future, but we are headed for a housing bubble correction IMO. With the covid relief bills propping up renters and borrowers and moratoriums on foreclosures and evictions, there will be a wave of people losing their homes once those bills end… This will affect housing availability, demand and pricing- potentially a double whammy if rates ever truly go up as that will have it’s own impact on housing. If you ar ein and established as a realtor you could be fine. A new realtor with no connections, no books of clients… It could be a high wash out rate.
 

titaniumspur

Active Member
Sep 16, 2006
1,949
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There are more metrics than money. She has ambition and a good relationship with you, so she will most likely be fine either way. I have two daughters, one has an accounting degree, the other dropped out of college to be a part time massage therapist. She also has two children so part time works well for her. The accountant makes more money but I really think the massage therapist is happier.
 

mavcock

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2002
6,017
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Mauldin, SC
I'm a real estate attorney, so I hear from people all of the time who want to be a lawyer or a real estate lawyer. I ask them to follow me around for a day if they think that they want to be a real estate lawyer. Long days, exposure to liability, stress, etc. Some people want to go into law just to say that they are a lawyer. I know several who borrowed hundreds of thousands of dollars to go to crappy law schools who now are looking for the government to forgive their loans since they can't find jobs that pay the bills.
The same goes with real estate. She needs to shadow a realtor for a summer to see if she really wants to put up with all of the BS. It is a lot more than listing a house and collecting a check. In fact, I know several listing agents who do just that - list a house and wait for it to sell (which happens fast in this market). They do absolutely nothing to get the deal to the table, then show up at closing for their check. Once the bubble bursts, these people will go away.
Someone above mentioned that "all she needs is a buyer or a seller" in a post that I otherwise agree with - about 80-90% of the closings I have had with realtors on their first closings have been disasters. You simply cannot adequately represent your client with such limited knowledge of the field. It takes about a year of constant study and experience in the field to even have a basic knowledge of what to do.
I have several "investors" that are young and think that they can make a ton of money because they have been to seminars or have watched some real estate flipping shows. These people learn really fast that the real estate world does not revolve around them and their cocky attitudes and that their idea of making a bunch of money quickly from flips/assignments is quickly extinguished. In facts, actual rehab deals are now in the minority, with more people just buying a piece of crap and assigning the contract to an end buyer in hopes of making some money.
As an aside, I also have an MBA and I use the knowledge I got from it to help me do my taxes - other than that, it is just three more letters on my business card. Working for two years in a business environment would have given me exponentially more knowledge of business that the time I wasted in the classroom getting it. But it was fully paid for and it did come with some perks I enjoyed.
Whatever your daughter chooses, I hope she finds what she is looking for - personally I think she can finish her degree and dabble in real estate at the same time.
 

sgacock

Well-Known Member
Jun 4, 2000
27,696
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Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?
Tell her you agree with her decision to drop outof the psych progrm and chase a real estate degree. However, encourage her to take one more semester (1) accounting 101, (2) real estate finance and (3) whatever computer tech course takes her to a higher level, and a real estate license prep course.
 

lostcock

Active Member
Sep 28, 2006
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Cola Town
It would be one thing if she was going to start school, and decided not to to pursue it to go into RE. SC does not require a degree, at least they’ve never asked me, and I’ve taken both unit(s). But anyway, if you’ve come this far, you definitely finish it any way you can. She won’t know until she’s faced with it, but there will be jobs which have nothing to do with a Bachelors (or her major) but will require one because they can. And, networking, always networking.

Best of luck to you all.
 

section907

Well-Known Member
Sep 16, 2000
4,879
1,951
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Real Estate is primary a relationship type of business. Most leads come from people you know or their referrals . I have always believed the # 1 asset to going to college is the diverse lifetime of friends and people you get to know. —— If she is set on starting her career now. She can take a different approach to school and make it more of a business opportunity. Join different groups , attend different events. Use the last year as a networking learning experience, after all , that will be her priority as a Realtor. In addition. Have her join a developer or home builder company as an assistant or intern for her last year. They work open house on weekends , etc so should fit her schedule. Plus it’s an opportunity to learn the “whole” business of Real Estate. PS. In Today’s market, the track home builders are crushing it. Builders are taking down new developer lots in 1years timeframe. Whereas they usually would take down 4-8 lots a quarter to build out and could take 2-4 years to close out a subdivision. The #1 reason for this is inventory followed by buyers demand. I’d imagine being a new agent with limited supply of inventory available would be a tough start.
Best of luck to her and you .
 

alston

Well-Known Member
Jun 26, 2001
5,196
987
113
Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?

After going this far, she should punch that ticket and finish. She will regret not finishing if she doesn't. I've known several people who eventually went back and finished after dropping out because it was an issue in trying to get a better job. I hire a lot of people and I would wonder about someone who went three years and didn't finish. It would make me question their work ethic and desire.
 
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gamecockengineer2011

Active Member
Mar 29, 2012
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You failed her by not talking her out of the psychology route to begin with, but at this point it's better to at least have the 4 year degree finished. She will have debt either way.

She will have more employment opportunities having a college degree than without. It's not real likely the real estate agent gig will be long term either. There's a lot of competition and from what I've seen the work sucks.
 

uscg1984

Well-Known Member
Mar 9, 2006
5,977
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SW Montana
I'm a real estate attorney, so I hear from people all of the time who want to be a lawyer or a real estate lawyer. I ask them to follow me around for a day if they think that they want to be a real estate lawyer. Long days, exposure to liability, stress, etc. Some people want to go into law just to say that they are a lawyer. I know several who borrowed hundreds of thousands of dollars to go to crappy law schools who now are looking for the government to forgive their loans since they can't find jobs that pay the bills.
The same goes with real estate. She needs to shadow a realtor for a summer to see if she really wants to put up with all of the BS. It is a lot more than listing a house and collecting a check. In fact, I know several listing agents who do just that - list a house and wait for it to sell (which happens fast in this market). They do absolutely nothing to get the deal to the table, then show up at closing for their check. Once the bubble bursts, these people will go away.
Someone above mentioned that "all she needs is a buyer or a seller" in a post that I otherwise agree with - about 80-90% of the closings I have had with realtors on their first closings have been disasters. You simply cannot adequately represent your client with such limited knowledge of the field. It takes about a year of constant study and experience in the field to even have a basic knowledge of what to do.
I have several "investors" that are young and think that they can make a ton of money because they have been to seminars or have watched some real estate flipping shows. These people learn really fast that the real estate world does not revolve around them and their cocky attitudes and that their idea of making a bunch of money quickly from flips/assignments is quickly extinguished. In facts, actual rehab deals are now in the minority, with more people just buying a piece of crap and assigning the contract to an end buyer in hopes of making some money.
As an aside, I also have an MBA and I use the knowledge I got from it to help me do my taxes - other than that, it is just three more letters on my business card. Working for two years in a business environment would have given me exponentially more knowledge of business that the time I wasted in the classroom getting it. But it was fully paid for and it did come with some perks I enjoyed.
Whatever your daughter chooses, I hope she finds what she is looking for - personally I think she can finish her degree and dabble in real estate at the same time.
As a former real estate attorney and a pretty experienced buyer and seller of real estate, I second virtually everything Mavcock said above.

The real estate industry is a worthwhile one, but I wouldn't drop out of college with one year left to pursue it. I'd try to get some experience in it while finishing my degree - whether that means finishing it at USC or a more affordable option. If she eventually discovers real estate isn't what she thought it would be, at least she will have a degree.

As others have said, talk with her and see if there are other factors in her life leading her to this decision. There may be other "middle ground" options.
 

rgamecock1

Member
Apr 19, 2003
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Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?
I will say this, being a real estate agent only requires that they get licensed to be an agent. With the current influx on people moving to the south and all the new homes being built there is a lot of money to be made in the real estate profession. I know a lot of people who have done well in the real estate profession. Those student loans can be paid for with one commercial real estate transaction. This may be Gods way of telling you and her that the psychology is not the field intended for her. Just my two cents. I wish nothing but the best for you and your daughter.
 

GarnetBeamer

Active Member
Dec 7, 2020
1,118
1,354
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Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?

Could be best to just let her take that step and see what happens. Maybe she'll excel in real estate and avoid accruing more debt for a degree she won't end up using. If the real estate gig doesn't work out, she can go back and finish her degree.
 

JohnnySolo

Member
May 6, 2011
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Continue education and work PT as RE office admin or attend RE classes
I know at least 5 people that do real estate part time - and actually do just fine. If she's so passionate about real estate now, she can start getting her feet wet in the industry while finishing up school. All she needs is a client - buyer or seller and she is on her way. If she doesn't think she's ready to do it all herself and needs to learn in a real estate office - then she can work in one all next year while she finishes up school. Either way, going cold turkey on school this close to the finish line seems short-sighted when there are so many options out there.
Completely agree.
 

TopHook

Active Member
Gold Member
Jun 11, 2019
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Tell her to go to a trade school. She's going to need it.
 

wolverine 2

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Gold Member
Dec 27, 2009
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Woodruff, SC
Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?
Nice boat! I've fished in one very similar!
 

CtownNat1ve

Member
Mar 17, 2020
286
332
63
Two concerns for her-
1. Real estate does not pay much the first 6 months-year or so. You have to get licensed and get some deals moving, then closed before you get your first check. She will need savings or a part time job or financial support during that time.
2. I don’t like to recommend timing any markets as I cannot predict the future, but we are headed for a housing bubble correction IMO. With the covid relief bills propping up renters and borrowers and moratoriums on foreclosures and evictions, there will be a wave of people losing their homes once those bills end… This will affect housing availability, demand and pricing- potentially a double whammy if rates ever truly go up as that will have it’s own impact on housing. If you ar ein and established as a realtor you could be fine. A new realtor with no connections, no books of clients… It could be a high wash out rate.
There are some reasons to think we may be headed for a bubble but there's also a lot of reasons to think we are not and these increases are here to stay. We dont have many of the same factors as there were in 2008 and a lot of positives. I, for one, dont think we are but what do I know. Those foreclosures could also be seen as a wave of supply to hit the market w/ such a drastic housing shortage and high numbers of interested buyers we have right now.

Lot of interesting points against to consider.
 
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slufstuff

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Aug 12, 2001
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I went through a similar experience with my son. He was majoring in education (school teacher), got through his junior year, but decided he was not a good fit after doing his first round of student teaching. I pressured him into finishing using the same arguments I see here (3 years in, any degree will help even if not teaching, etc.) He did struggle through and got his degree, but has never used it. The down side is he has a certain level of resentment towards me for pressuring him to finish. If I had to do it over, I would have helped him find another degree or alternative that he felt better about.

Based on my experience, I would let OP's daughter go do her RE thing. At least if she fails, it will be her decision. not yours. Worst case is she goes back to school a year or so behind her peer group. Best case, maybe she makes a lot of money.
 
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lowcountry_cock13

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Oct 12, 2017
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I'll take that as a yes.
Part of the housing boom is that people are moving out of cities, or moving south to buy more for less, because you can do most jobs remotely. My friend who works in construction said all his clients are moving from New York and can buy way more for less even on places like Kiawah or HHI.
 

Gamecock Lifer

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Oct 8, 2008
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There are some reasons to think we may be headed for a bubble but there's also a lot of reasons to think we are not and these increases are here to stay. We dont have many of the same factors as there were in 2008 and a lot of positives. I, for one, dont think we are but what do I know. Those foreclosures could also be seen as a wave of supply to hit the market w/ such a drastic housing shortage and high numbers of interested buyers we have right now.

Lot of interesting points against to consider.
I do not think this will be anything like 08, it is being caused by different pressures. 08 was the result of government forced sub-prime loans being packaged and resold as bundled investments given erroneous A ratings… it became a cascade if shit as the foreclosures on the sub prime market started to pile up (we were literally letting people buy houses they could not afford, it HAD TO catch up!!).. suddenly rampant price growth stopped and suddenly prices started to drop when inventory was out pacing demand… So all the people who were leveraged 110%-120%+ LTV and had not even so much as provided i come statements to get approved for obscenely priced loans they could barely afford to pay the interest only payments on had their interest only periods expire (which converts it yo a principal and interest payment), meaning they could
Not afford the house any more, yhey owed more than it was worth and could not sell it- the foreclosures just continued to spiral on…

They have eliminated all of the loans an lending practices that lead to that particular crash, but the government is artificially propping up the housing market with housing subsidies for low income people, direct stimulus payments and moratoriums on foreclosures and evictions… As they stop (can’t go on forever right?) these measures, there are an estimated 10MM+ people who are on the verge of foreclosure or eviction. If we have 10M extra homeless people/empty houses all in a short span… Hell, HALF that much would be BAD…
 
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NYC_Gamecock

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Jun 16, 2007
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Since your daughter has already completed 3 years, I strongly suggest that she finish the 4th year to get her undergraduate degree once and for all. When you are 75% into the journey, you must cross the finish line someway somehow. Tell her not to postpone this mission because going to school gets a lot harder due to aging, marriage, children, and work. Her senior year will come and go in a flash.
 

pisgah

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May 28, 2006
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My experience with psychology: At the end of my sophomore year I planned to major in religion, but after working at a church camp that summer I decided against religion and switched to psychology first semester junior year, hated it as I took statistics and experimental psychology and earned Ds in both; immediately I switched to sociology, made good grades, graduated.

Five years later( after working in a state government social service agency} I entered the MBA program at USC with the goal of wanting to become a CPA. I earned the MBA and later the CPA certificate. i was working full time in state government while pursuing the MBA and CPA. We had our daughter during that time and lived in university apartments off of Beltline some of that time.

So your daughter will probably find her way , although maybe the hard way like I did.
 

uscedge21

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Mar 5, 2019
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My experience with psychology: At the end of my sophomore year I planned to major in religion, but after working at a church camp that summer I decided against religion and switched to psychology first semester junior year, hated it as I took statistics and experimental psychology and earned Ds in both; immediately I switched to sociology, made good grades, graduated.

Five years later( after working in a state government social service agency} I entered the MBA program at USC with the goal of wanting to become a CPA. I earned the MBA and later the CPA certificate. i was working full time in state government while pursuing the MBA and CPA. We had our daughter during that time and lived in university apartments off of Beltline some of that time.

So your daughter will probably find her way , although maybe the hard way like I did.
Lived there as well in '75-'76. Next door neighbor was on the football team and they had their first child while living there. We are still friends to this day. I am guessing those apartments disappeared long ago??
 

world famous 3rd base hecklers

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Sep 25, 2011
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Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?

It's not the end of the world... Listen to her and let her tell you her plans and if it doesn't work out, she can always come back to school... Sounds like she has everything figured out...

Sometimes you need a break from school and the last year has been hard on students...

Bottom line, she can always go back to school...
 

Sumptacock

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Dec 22, 2005
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Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?
My daughter finally "graduated" after I met with her dean and told him she had more majors than the British Army, and we wanted a "been there, done that" degree of any description...utilizing any of her 160+ hours. She went on to get her M.A.T and has been a teacher in the middle/high school field, and is only a couple of hours shy of her PhD. Guess my advice was right. This was in 1992. STEER YOUR DAUGHTER in the right direction...finish her degree requirements...never regret it!
 

pisgah

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May 28, 2006
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Lived there as well in '75-'76. Next door neighbor was on the football team and they had their first child while living there. We are still friends to this day. I am guessing those apartments disappeared long ago??
We lived there in 1977 and 1978. I don't think they disappeared, as they seemed to do some remodeling as rent them out, but my understanding is that they do not belong to the university anymore.
 
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Elgringo

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Oct 11, 2004
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Is it possible this is a ploy to get you to pay for her schooling again? I say that making no assumptions whatsoever about her personally. I just know how well-schooled millennials are in getting their way and jerking at the heart strings of their well-intentioned parents. If there's a history of this behavior, then....

If not, it sounds like she may have a genuine interest in real estate and if possible, I'd encourage that. As other posters have commented, maybe point out the connection between a psychology degree and how beneficial that could be in a people-oriented field like real estate.
 

pisgah

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May 28, 2006
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I don't know if any of the prior posters were being condescending toward trade schools. I feel that the technical colleges like Midlands Technical College are the best buy around. I have taught 10 years in a technical college and 20 years in a four year college. My experience with technical colleges are that there are some excellent instructors where many of the courses are transferrable to the four year college.
 
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lowcountry_cock13

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Oct 12, 2017
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Is it possible this is a ploy to get you to pay for her schooling again? I say that making no assumptions whatsoever about her personally. I just know how well-schooled millennials are in getting their way and jerking at the heart strings of their well-intentioned parents. If there's a history of this behavior, then....

If not, it sounds like she may have a genuine interest in real estate and if possible, I'd encourage that. As other posters have commented, maybe point out the connection between a psychology degree and how beneficial that could be in a people-oriented field like real estate.
Dude millennials have been out of college for a few years. Youngest millennials are about 25
 

king ward

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Aug 10, 1999
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I don't know if any of the prior posters were being condescending toward trade schools. I feel that the technical colleges like Midlands Technical College are the best buy around. I have taught 10 years in a technical college and 20 years in a four year college. My experience with technical colleges are that there are some excellent instructors where many of the courses are transferrable to the four year college.
My brother rode a tech school degree to a brilliant career as a systems architect for more than 40 years. He survived innumerable cuts during that time, and only retired when he was ready - in order to spare the job of a younger man with a growing family. If a person has aptitude and ambition, a tech school education can equip that person to leave a large segment of the working population behind.
 

uscnoklahoma2

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Apr 16, 2017
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I could be way off but I swear one of realtor friends posted 2 weeks ago that there were over 4k realtors in the midlands and only 800 listings. I could be wrong but that's a recipe for disaster.
 

Balwiles

Member
Nov 20, 2020
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Her first year her scholarships and her mom and I paid for her tuition. The last two years have been on her. This has come as a shock to me. I’m thinking of how and what I should/shouldn’t say. I feel like, with one year left, even a degree she maybe doesn’t plan to use (psychology)will be worth more than two years of student loans with nothing to show.
She wants to get into real estate by the way. And I do think she has a personality that would do well in that. But it takes more than that to excel.
Any advice?

There's so much to say here. The video clip below (recorded this week) truly encapsulates a healthy thought process on this topic - individually customized. Polymath and Chainlink CEO, Sergey Nazarov, is one of a kind and within five years, you'll likely hear his name mentioned along side of Musk, Bezos, etc.

 

CtownNat1ve

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Mar 17, 2020
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I do not think this will be anything like 08, it is being caused by different pressures. 08 was the result of government forced sub-prime loans being packaged and resold as bundled investments given erroneous A ratings… it became a cascade if shit as the foreclosures on the sub prime market started to pile up (we were literally letting people buy houses they could not afford, it HAD TO catch up!!).. suddenly rampant price growth stopped and suddenly prices started to drop when inventory was out pacing demand… So all the people who were leveraged 110%-120%+ LTV and had not even so much as provided i come statements to get approved for obscenely priced loans they could barely afford to pay the interest only payments on had their interest only periods expire (which converts it yo a principal and interest payment), meaning they could
Not afford the house any more, yhey owed more than it was worth and could not sell it- the foreclosures just continued to spiral on…

They have eliminated all of the loans an lending practices that lead to that particular crash, but the government is artificially propping up the housing market with housing subsidies for low income people, direct stimulus payments and moratoriums on foreclosures and evictions… As they stop (can’t go on forever right?) these measures, there are an estimated 10MM+ people who are on the verge of foreclosure or eviction. If we have 10M extra homeless people/empty houses all in a short span… Hell, HALF that much would be BAD…
I have not seen numbers anywhere near that high. The latest I saw (NAR/Forbes) was 3.7M in forbearance at the beginning of April, with 2M set to expire in a month and 350K of those have started making payments again. Ive seen other services that are between 1.8-2.7. 3.7 is the highest I could find. Would love to know where the 10M came from.
 

Gamecock Lifer

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Oct 8, 2008
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I have not seen numbers anywhere near that high. The latest I saw (NAR/Forbes) was 3.7M in forbearance at the beginning of April, with 2M set to expire in a month and 350K of those have started making payments again. Ive seen other services that are between 1.8-2.7. 3.7 is the highest I could find. Would love to know where the 10M came from.
I was not just talking homeOWNERS- I was referring to foreclosures and eviction dangers… It was at 10MM last I checked the middle of last year.

This article from the end of the year mentioned figures well north of 20MM renters alone who are (were?) or rather WOULD BE in danger of eviction without the moritorium. “An estimated 23 million people are at risk of getting evicted.” You add that to millions of homeowners substantially behind on mortgage payments and we could see an absolute catastrophy when the government stops propping people up.
Before someone asks- Yes, it would hurt real estate values if we had say 20 Million people evicted in a short period of time. The people who spend money on investment properties would take a huge hit, those evicted can’t oay rent and damn sure could not go BUY, when investors lose liquidity and income, the market stagnates… This is a powder keg right now and I don’t see an easy way out especially if we have enough of the population believing Facebook science instead of listening to health professionals and deciding not to get vaccinated so we can move past this thing and get back to normal. We need the economy to right itself and for that to happen, restrictions have to be lifted and (except for Florida and Texas) we know that won’t be allowed to happen as long as we have 50,000 or so bew cases a day!
 
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