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Do you still haggle on car prices?

BattleshipTexas

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2001
38,753
2,778
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Yep, full MSRP now. No incentives. Salesmen can't make any bank right now with the inventory this low. I also noticed the absence of the obnoxious radio ads that normally pollute classic rock stations. This is not only bad for dealers and mfrs, but the entire supplier industry suffers as well.
Some high demand vehicles are even having +$10,000 or +$20,000 over MSRP.
 
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GarnetBeamer

Active Member
Dec 7, 2020
1,477
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Yep, we put our car search totally on hold. Though we are only buying used, the whole market is just bonkers now. I can't imagine any buying unless absolutely necessary. We've just decided to gut it out with what we have. It was tough, but I found a 3-across car seat format that just barely works in our vehicles.
 

chief2791

Member
Mar 27, 2012
122
204
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I got a call last week from the dealer I bought my 2019 GMC Canyon from (V6, crew cab). Paid 25.2K out the door, they offered me 30k on a trade with 39k miles on the vehicle. Problem is, you're just moving money from one hand to the other, I really wouldn't come out ahead if I bought another new one.

Similar to real estate right now. Yes, I can get a premium for my house, but buying/building I'm going to pay a premium. Literally moving money from one hand to the other.

I wouldn't buy a car or a house right now unless I had no other choice.
 

GarnetBeamer

Active Member
Dec 7, 2020
1,477
1,811
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Drove by a Toyota dealership here the other day. Lot was maybe 1/2-2/3 full of cars. It's typically been completely filled with cars also on the sides and grass. I thought maybe they'd shut down and were moving inventory out b/c it was so sparse. Tough market out there right now.
 

Woodrow on Greene

Active Member
Gold Member
Jun 27, 2016
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Here's what I have done to get the best price. First I select a bunch of dealers within around 200 miles max from where I live. I chose 9 dealers for my last Toyota. Then I go to each dealer's website and write the following: I plan to purchase a certain color Toyota xxx vehicle with this color interior by the end of xx month. I live in South Carolina in this county and will be transferring an existing license plate and will pay cash. (If you don't have the case, make preliminary arrangements with a bank ahead of time.) What is your best out the door price? On each dealer's website you will fill out all information which will include your cell number and email address. Then you sit back and wait for emails and phone calls. I have used this method for the last 2 cars that I have bought and have gotten very good reduced prices. DO NOT GO TO THE DEALER AND HAGGLE. Make the dealers come to you on email or cell phone. Not necessary and they have you at their place where you can see the new cars and smell the new cars and you know the rest. The dealers want you to come in so you will be on their turf.

By the way, I prefer a Toyota because of their quality and they hold their value about as good as any car and there are Toyota dealerships everywhere. The market is very bad now because of low inventories due to shortage of micro chips. The micro chip manufacturers are well behind in production. If you can wait, I would recommend waiting. We are in a sellers market, not a buyers market. I understand that used vehicles are at a premium too.
 

GarnetBeamer

Active Member
Dec 7, 2020
1,477
1,811
113
Here's what I have done to get the best price. First I select a bunch of dealers within around 200 miles max from where I live. I chose 9 dealers for my last Toyota. Then I go to each dealer's website and write the following: I plan to purchase a certain color Toyota xxx vehicle with this color interior by the end of xx month. I live in South Carolina in this county and will be transferring an existing license plate and will pay cash. (If you don't have the case, make preliminary arrangements with a bank ahead of time.) What is your best out the door price? On each dealer's website you will fill out all information which will include your cell number and email address. Then you sit back and wait for emails and phone calls. I have used this method for the last 2 cars that I have bought and have gotten very good reduced prices. DO NOT GO TO THE DEALER AND HAGGLE. Make the dealers come to you on email or cell phone. Not necessary and they have you at their place where you can see the new cars and smell the new cars and you know the rest. The dealers want you to come in so you will be on their turf.

By the way, I prefer a Toyota because of their quality and they hold their value about as good as any car and there are Toyota dealerships everywhere. The market is very bad now because of low inventories due to shortage of micro chips. The micro chip manufacturers are well behind in production. If you can wait, I would recommend waiting. We are in a sellers market, not a buyers market. I understand that used vehicles are at a premium too.

I have known some people who have had good luck with your approach as well. It's never really worked for me though...wish it did! I just get canned replies or they just give the price that's shown online and I have to beg and plead to get an out-the-door price. I've had them quote me an out-the-door price and then I email back to confirm there are no other fees etc. They reply with "the only other fee would be...." And I'm like "what part of out-the-door" did you not understand?

But, yeah, we have put our search on hold as you suggested. We can limp by with what we have until the end of the year. The Carmax CEO said he anticipates the market starting to return to normal by the end of this year or early next. Nobody's getting a deal right now...even if it might seem like it. It's the worst car market for buyers in 2 decades or more.

I've known a couple people who recently bought houses and they weren't in a situation where they had to buy. My nephew was one and he was insistent he found a good deal, but the numbers don't lie. It might look like a good deal compared to comps in the area, but nothing's a good deal for buyer's right now compared to what you would have paid 18 months ago.
 

Woodrow on Greene

Active Member
Gold Member
Jun 27, 2016
1,397
2,939
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Just looked at Toyota recalls. This is 2020 recalls only. Looks like they have an expanding fuel pump issue. Apparently not as reliable as believed, at least recently. All makes have recalls, Toyota in particular this past year.

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is Conducting a Noncompliance Recall Involving Certain Toyota Vehicles

November 25, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota and Lexus vehicles

October 28, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain 2020 model year Toyota Highlander and Highlander Hybrid vehicles

October 14, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a noncompliance recall involving certain Tundra vehicles

July 15, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Prius and Prius v vehicles

June 24, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain RAV4 vehicles

May 20, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota vehicles

April 08, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota vehicles

March 19, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota and Lexus vehicles

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota and Lexus vehicles

February 06, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota vehicles

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota Corolla, Matrix and Avalon vehicles

January 21, 2020

VOLUNTARY RECALLS
Toyota is conducting a safety recall involving certain Toyota and Lexus vehicles

PLANO, Texas (October 28, 2020) – Toyota is recalling certain Lexus and Toyota vehicles produced between July 2017 through December 2019 due to the same fuel pump issue for which Toyota announced a safety recall in the U.S. in January 2020.

In the U.S., Toyota is adding approximately 1.53* million newly identified vehicles to the safety recall originally announced in January 2020. The total number of vehicles involved in this safety recall is now approximately 3.34* million vehicles. The models and model years that have vehicles included in this recall are certain:

2013-2015 Model Year Lexus LS 460;
2013-2015 Model Year Lexus GS 350;
2014 Model Year Toyota FJ Cruiser, Lexus ISF;
2014-2015 Model Year Toyota 4Runner, Land Cruiser; Lexus GX 460, IS 350, LX 570;
2015 Model Year Lexus NX 200t, RC 350;
2017 Model Year Lexus IS 200t, RC 200t GS 200t;
2017-2019 Model Year Toyota Highlander; Lexus GS 350;
2017-2020 Model Year Toyota Sienna and Lexus RX 350
2017-2020 Model Year Toyota Tacoma*
2018-2019 Model Year Toyota 4Runner, Land Cruiser; Lexus GS 300, GX 460, IS 300, IS 350, LS 500h, LX 570, NX 300, RC 300, RC 350;
2018-2020 Toyota Avalon, Camry, Corolla, Sequoia*, Tundra*; Lexus ES 350, LC 500, LC 500h, LS 500, RX 350L
2019 Model Year Toyota Corolla Hatchback and Lexus UX 200
2019-2020 Model Year Toyota RAV4
The subject vehicles are equipped with a fuel pump which may stop operating. If this were to occur, warning lights and messages may be displayed on the instrument panel, and the engine may run rough. This can result in a vehicle stall, and the vehicle may be unable to be restarted. If a vehicle stall occurs while driving at higher speeds, this could increase the risk of a crash.

For all involved vehicles, Toyota and Lexus dealers will replace the involved fuel pump with an improved one at no cost to customers.

Owners of vehicles included in the recall in October*, that were not included in the recall population as of April 9, 2020, will be notified by late December.

Information about automotive recalls, including but not limited to the list of involved vehicles, is current as of today’s filing date and is subject to change thereafter. To see if your vehicle is involved in a safety recall visit Toyota.com/recall or nhtsa.gov/recalls and enter your Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) or license plate information.

For any additional questions, customer support is also available by calling the Toyota Brand Engagement Center (1-800-331-4331) for Toyota vehicles and Lexus Brand Engagement Center (1-800-255-3987) for Lexus vehicles.

*This statement was updated on November 2 (to correct the production date range of the vehicles being added to the recall on October 28, 2020) and December 18 (to include approximately 8,000 Toyota Sequoia, Tacoma and Tundra vehicles added to this recall on December 18, 2020). Owners of the vehicles added in December 2020 will be notified by January 29, 2021.
I bought a 2019 Toyota RAV4 hybrid and first thought I had a fuel tank issue. I did an experiment to find out exactly what was going on, so I put a container of one gallon of gas in the rear of the vehicle with a funnel etc. For the last several gas tank fillips, I have gone beyond where it says that you are now on empty and your range is 0 miles. I have progressively driven well beyond empty and the last tank I went over 2 gallons of gas beyond empty which was based on miles per gallon. Some Toyota RAV4s have a problem with the gas tank not being able to be filled and Toyota will fix that. I've owned a Honda CRV and it also would allow you to go well beyond the 0 mile limit. If you are willing to carry a one gallon of gas in a container in your car you can experiment to see about how far you can go (based on your MPG) beyond the 0 mile notice. I know, I'm a geek, but I wanted to know the answer. So, now I do know that I can drive well past the 2 gallon beyond empty.
 

Boom4life

Active Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,049
887
113
I have known some people who have had good luck with your approach as well. It's never really worked for me though...wish it did! I just get canned replies or they just give the price that's shown online and I have to beg and plead to get an out-the-door price. I've had them quote me an out-the-door price and then I email back to confirm there are no other fees etc. They reply with "the only other fee would be...." And I'm like "what part of out-the-door" did you not understand?

But, yeah, we have put our search on hold as you suggested. We can limp by with what we have until the end of the year. The Carmax CEO said he anticipates the market starting to return to normal by the end of this year or early next. Nobody's getting a deal right now...even if it might seem like it. It's the worst car market for buyers in 2 decades or more.

I've known a couple people who recently bought houses and they weren't in a situation where they had to buy. My nephew was one and he was insistent he found a good deal, but the numbers don't lie. It might look like a good deal compared to comps in the area, but nothing's a good deal for buyer's right now compared to what you would have paid 18 months ago.
That’s not happening. There is still going to be a chip shortage by then. Ford is so far behind they will still be producing 2021 then to meet orders. I know someone who ordered an f150 in January and still has not received it. Also dealers make more of financing the vehicle than they do a cash price. I use to sell cars and my clients that are willing to finance with my dealership got the best deals in the end.
 
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chief2791

Member
Mar 27, 2012
122
204
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If you're in a position to haggle, go for it, but do your research on what things are worth and be confident in it. If you know it's a good deal, jump on it, don't haggle.

Just last week, I bought a 1977 CJ-5 (unplanned purchase) that a guy was haggling over $200 (private sale, wasn't advertised anywhere). When I heard the vehicle was for sale, I did a quick value search, went over and looked it/drove it, and an hour later it was at my house. It was more than worth the asking price. So original dude was haggling over $200 for almost a week on a vehicle that was worth $2-3000 more than what the owner was asking. That's easy math, and pretty stupid IMO.

Bought a good amount of things like this over the years. Guns, guitars, all sorts of things. Alot of people think they've got to haggle when it's already a good deal, and they lose. Bought an American Fender Telecaster for $400 about 10 years ago that another guy was haggling for an additional $50 off. Just really, really stupid.
 
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jedi_mike

Active Member
Gold Member
Mar 29, 2008
1,237
772
113
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I bought a 2019 Toyota RAV4 hybrid and first thought I had a fuel tank issue. I did an experiment to find out exactly what was going on, so I put a container of one gallon of gas in the rear of the vehicle with a funnel etc. For the last several gas tank fillips, I have gone beyond where it says that you are now on empty and your range is 0 miles. I have progressively driven well beyond empty and the last tank I went over 2 gallons of gas beyond empty which was based on miles per gallon. Some Toyota RAV4s have a problem with the gas tank not being able to be filled and Toyota will fix that. I've owned a Honda CRV and it also would allow you to go well beyond the 0 mile limit. If you are willing to carry a one gallon of gas in a container in your car you can experiment to see about how far you can go (based on your MPG) beyond the 0 mile notice. I know, I'm a geek, but I wanted to know the answer. So, now I do know that I can drive well past the 2 gallon beyond empty.
This had me thinking about the Seinfeld episode where Kramer and the salesman went for drive to see how far they could get past empty.hilarious.I had to go get my wife’s tire fixed a few weeks ago and when I got in it,it was sitting on 0 miles,I was pissed.I still got to the station about 4 miles away.