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OT: status of the pandemic, per Dr. Fauci

bucketdad

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From what I’ve read, teachers weren’t consulted on how to run the school. They were consulted on practices in their classroom, the cafeteria, and other places they spend all day with kids.
When their demands have been met, the goalposts move. This has happened several times before these cdc contacts. It should have already been less about what teachers want and more about what it takes to actually open schools from those interested in doing so. At this point, they should be taking advise from a more admirable education entity.
 

Lurker123

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What it sounds like, reading this thread, is that everyone should listen to the scientists and follow the scientist's advice in their daily lives except teachers. For teachers, all the scientists should listen to them.

Seriously, anyone who doesnt think politics played a role in a democrat administration capitulating to teachers unions is fooling themselves.
 

Bubbaglide

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On the road again
What it sounds like, reading this thread, is that everyone should listen to the scientists and follow the scientist's advice in their daily lives except teachers. For teachers, all the scientists should listen to them.

Seriously, anyone who doesnt think politics played a role in a democrat administration capitulating to teachers unions is fooling themselves.
Exactly my point. The teachers know what works logistically. But they have no more idea on the science of being back in school than anyone else. So why did the CDC listen to them? Union voters who vote Democratic. Keeping the base happy. Teachers by now should be fully immunized. Supposedly kids are not affected Unless the custodian is infecting someone, there should be no issue. Sorry, i forgot the cranky old lunchroom lady
 
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SixStringCock

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The science and experts recommendations don’t mean anything if what they suggest can’t be practically implemented in a school setting. That’s why the teachers union was involved- not sure how that can be stated any simpler
Based on what research had/has shown about transmission from,to, or between children, anything could be practically implemented. There are people capable of filling in if the primary teachers didn’t feel safe. They’re called substitutes and those have been around for quite a while. You don’t punish the masses because of the few that are vulnerable/ afraid. A school is no different than any workplace. Grocery stores, Walmart, government buildings, hospitals. If you can successfully run those you can successfully run a school. They stay home, the rest of us get back to our lives. Not sure how that can be stated any simpler.
 

feeble2001

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Based on what research had/has shown about transmission from,to, or between children, anything could be practically implemented. There are people capable of filling in if the primary teachers didn’t feel safe. They’re called substitutes and those have been around for quite a while. You don’t punish the masses because of the few that are vulnerable/ afraid. A school is no different than any workplace. Grocery stores, Walmart, government buildings, hospitals. If you can successfully run those you can successfully run a school. They stay home, the rest of us get back to our lives. Not sure how that can be stated any simpler.
Yes running a Walmart is absolutely identical as running a school with 1700 children - that is completely reasonable assertion
 

Garnet chicken

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It's all about power and control. The longer they perpetuate it, the more they control all the people. Are the deaths now really natural deaths that are called Covid in order to fill their coffers with Covid cash?
 

SixStringCock

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Yes running a Walmart is absolutely identical as running a school with 1700 children - that is completely reasonable assertion
I’d say it’s perfectly reasonable for over 1700 customers to stroll in and out of a Walmart any given day without you knowing who they are, where they’re from, who they have and haven’t been in contact with, what they have and haven’t touched in the store including fresh produce. Identical? No. Equally to more challenging? Yes. In a school kids are sitting down roughly 75% of the day in a controlled environment. I’m assuming you’ve seen how customers act in a walmart. Take your poor attempt at sarcastic condescension somewhere else. Idiot.
 

feeble2001

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I’d say it’s perfectly reasonable for over 1700 customers to stroll in and out of a Walmart any given day without you knowing who they are, where they’re from, who they have and haven’t been in contact with, what they have and haven’t touched in the store including fresh produce. Identical? No. Equally to more challenging? Yes. In a school kids are sitting down roughly 75% of the day in a controlled environment. I’m assuming you’ve seen how customers act in a walmart. Take your poor attempt at sarcastic condescension somewhere else. Idiot.
Yes those customers sit side by side in a room with 25 other people for 7 hours? Is there 25 to 1 adult child ratio? Every hour does 1700 students walk through a 10 foot wide hall? Do they have to figure out where all 1700 eat at the same time when it’s raining? Distribute the food? Bus them too and from?

they aren’t similar at all and there is no way you actually believe that

there is no way you believe 1700 throughout the day is similar logistics to 1700 the entire dayb
 
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BigWillieCock

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I’d say it’s perfectly reasonable for over 1700 customers to stroll in and out of a Walmart any given day without you knowing who they are, where they’re from, who they have and haven’t been in contact with, what they have and haven’t touched in the store including fresh produce. Identical? No. Equally to more challenging? Yes. In a school kids are sitting down roughly 75% of the day in a controlled environment. I’m assuming you’ve seen how customers act in a walmart. Take your poor attempt at sarcastic condescension somewhere else. Idiot.
I like “feeble” though we disagree. But you have to understand the debate will never end. I mean it “feeble”, I like ya but you’re maddening.
 

SixStringCock

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Yes those customers sit side by side in a room with 25 other people for 7 hours? Is there 25 to 1 adult child ratio? Every hour does 1700 students walk through a 10 foot wide hall? Do they have to figure out where all 1700 eat at the same time when it’s raining? Distribute the food? Bus them too and from?

they aren’t similar at all and there is no way you actually believe that

there is no way you believe 1700 throughout the day is similar logistics to 1700 the entire dayb
Once the exposure is there, it’s done. Either you catch it or you don’t. I’m not sure you understand how viruses work... or more importantly how THIS virus works. Kids are close to immune. 100% no. But they also aren’t 100% immune to the common cold, the flu, viral bronchitis, lice, but all can and are transmitted by the smallest encounter with the other... the transfer of lice doesn’t happen while consistently pressing heads or clothes together for 8 hours, the same as the other illnesses I mentioned. Your circumstances are very extreme and presented in your bias rather than logic. The 25-1 child to adult ratio would help my point. Not hurt it.
1700 DIFFERENT PEOPLE.. every day.. it’s just like herpes dude.. you have sex with the same person every day and you’re good. You have sex with different people every day you continuously increase the odds that a germ of any kind is brought into the environment/ equation.
You’re right. There’s no way I believe they’re similar... idiot.
that’s why restaurants limit capacity... Not for distancing purposes but for the sake of having less traffic thus lowering the possibilities of running into someone who has been exposed.

Your whole premise is based on kids/students being just as susceptible to Covid as the elderly or those with underlying conditions and that’s just not the case. This isn’t an opinion. It’s scientifically wrong. You’re wrong. Period.
 
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feeble2001

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Once the exposure is there, it’s done. Either you catch it or you don’t. I’m not sure you understand how viruses work... or more importantly how THIS virus works. Kids are close to immune. 100% no. But they also aren’t 100% immune to the common cold, the flu, viral bronchitis, lice, but all can and are transmitted by the smallest encounter with the other... the transfer of lice doesn’t happen while consistently pressing heads or clothes together for 8 hours, the same as the other illnesses I mentioned. Your circumstances are very extreme and presented in your bias rather than logic. The 25-1 child to adult ratio would help my point. Not hurt it.
1700 DIFFERENT PEOPLE.. every day.. it’s just like herpes dude.. you have sex with the same person every day and you’re good. You have sex with different people every day you continuously increase the odds that a germ of any kind is brought into the environment/ equation.
You’re right. There’s no way I believe they’re similar... idiot.
that’s why restaurants limit capacity... Not for distancing purposes but for the sake of having less traffic thus lowering the possibilities of running into someone who has been exposed.

Your whole premise is based on kids/students being just as susceptible to Covid as the elderly or those with underlying conditions and that’s just not the case. This isn’t an opinion. It’s scientifically wrong. You’re wrong. Period.
Depends on the age and study some say children are half as likely some say teenagers are the same.

here is why it is different.

student takes a bus packed of other students up to about 40.

gets out and eats breakfast. Between every class, passes hundreds of students in close proximit

That single student goes to 8-16 classes every two days. That’s 10 classes worth of possible exposures.

That’s nothing like Walmart, they just are not at all similar.

a Walmart employee, almost never has to be within a customer within 6 feet. Cashiers stay in one place and can use plexiglass. Rarely needs to work side by side with coworker. Lots of space.

wow those two look very similar to me

and no exposure and stds don’t work like that, you can have sex with someone with herpes and get it on the tenth time. You can be around someone with covid and get it passed on an hour after being around them. Jesus dude. Wow.
 

SixStringCock

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Depends on the age and study some say children are half as likely some say teenagers are the same.

here is why it is different.

student takes a bus packed of other students up to about 40.

gets out and eats breakfast. Between every class, passes hundreds of students in close proximit

That single student goes to 8-16 classes every two days. That’s 10 classes worth of possible exposures.

That’s nothing like Walmart, they just are not at all similar.

a Walmart employee, almost never has to be within a customer within 6 feet. Cashiers stay in one place and can use plexiglass. Rarely needs to work side by side with coworker. Lots of space.

wow those two look very similar to me

and no exposure and stds don’t work like that, you can have sex with someone with herpes and get it on the tenth time. You can be around someone with covid and get it passed on an hour after being around them. Jesus dude. Wow.
Lol your examples are to extremes. You’re assuming they all take busses and eat breakfast. I went to Dreher in the mid 2000s and very few people road busses or ate breakfast. Or even cafeteria lunch for that matter. Your numbers are based on a very extreme version of school, which it’s obvious you haven’t been a part of for a very long time.
Man, we’re not talking about just a Walmart employees.. and even if we were, who stocks the shelves? Receives shipments? People don’t walk around in a plexiglass box dipshit.
If we ARE talking about people being IMO I’m behind plexiglass then students are doing the same thing.. and socially distancedWe’re talking about allllll of the customers in the building.
that’s open to the thousands of homes than use that particulars walmart...
Again.. the same enrollment of students in zoned school districts..
vs
The same number of different people everyday of the week including tourists, passerbyes, homeless, the ill going to the pharmacy...
you’re an absolute idiot.

also.. if masks work... why the need for the rest?
 
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Blackland

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Balwiles

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Regarding masks, it's not mutually exclusive.

There's a chance masks *might* provide some low level of benefit {data is all over the place}, but they also can be detrimental to the the person wearing them - CO2 toxicity, Low VO2 max issues, etc. Everyone's breathing function {capacity} varies. This is increasingly evident when people are in heat and moving/exercising. I've mentioned previously, but I'm a co-owner in a restaurant and have seen employees develop symptoms such as heavy skin breakouts (atopic) that don't resolve in the short term, nose bleeds and ear bleeds. Most have also been much lower moods (and higher irritation) which is indicative of lower oxygen intake. The consequences of longer term mask wearing are another great unknown.

The vast majority of masks have chemicals in the fabric (like most clothes.) Your face is much more sensitive than other areas of the body, plus your are breathing it in. Best to find an organic cotton mask if you are using for any length of time.

Risk = volume of exposure + duration of exposure

Being indoors in a poorly ventilated space for several hours with a large number of people who are not wearing masks would logically be higher-risk because the volume of viral particles would be high, and the duration of exposure would be long.

We have no idea how to quantify the mental/social impact of wearing mask or lockdowns. The data clearly shows there has been much higher levels of suicide, divorce etc. since this "pandemic" began. Humans are social beings and typically require human connections/interaction, facial recognition, etc - especially kids. It could be one of the most important aspects in good health there is. Masks change that dynamic and this is probably why you are seeing people reach their limit. The higher risk now have options available - Vaccines, Ivermectin, Vitamin D, HCQ, Remdesivir, JAK inhibitors, Antibiotic Cocktails, etc. and they are further refining/learning daily.

One thing is clear. Unless people start making alot of noise (which they have), masks aren't going anywhere fast, as most evidence supports the idea that COVID will be here - mostly seasonal like the flu.
 

GarnetBeamer

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I'm staunchly pro-vaccine across the board, including the covid vaccine. As commentators on both sides of the aisle have noted, though, the messaging has been muddled. On the one hand, we're being told the vaccine is >90% effective. On the other, we're told that even with the vaccine, we need to use caution and social distance and wear face masks and all that. People are seriously hyperparanoid about the vaccine, but I think rightfully confused on the messaging. They're telling people the vaccine is the path back to normalcy (and I agree), but then restrictions are kept in place.

In areas where they can be more clear, they just need to be. People just want clarity. No matter how I try to explain it, my dad still can't let go of "first they told us not to wear facemasks, and now they say we need facemasks."
 
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WingchunCock

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I'm staunchly pro-vaccine across the board, including the covid vaccine. As commentators on both sides of the aisle have noted, though, the messaging has been muddled. On the one hand, we're being told the vaccine is >90% effective. On the other, we're told that even with the vaccine, we need to use caution and social distance and wear face masks and all that. People are seriously hyperparanoid about the vaccine, but I think rightfully confused on the messaging. They're telling people the vaccine is the path back to normalcy (and I agree), but then restrictions are kept in place.

In areas where they can be more clear, they just need to be. People just want clarity. No matter how I try to explain it, my dad still can't let go of "first they told us not to wear facemasks, and now they say we need facemasks."
And let’s not forget Dr. Fake telling us to wear two masks..... the directions are literally all over the map. Maybe Fauci is BiPolar....seems like it with all the flipping.
 

GarnetBeamer

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And let’s not forget Dr. Fake telling us to wear two masks..... the directions are literally all over the map. Maybe Fauci is BiPolar....seems like it with all the flipping.

I'm not sure that's accurate. I believe he was asked whether wearing 2 masks was good and he basically opined that, sure, common sense would tell you if one mask helps some, then 2 masks would help even more. That's a fairly self evident observation. But he never actually recommended wearing 2 masks that I recall. He later said that the data did not show any benefit from wearing 2 masks as opposed to one. I assume he made the first statement based on natural common sense assumptions, but the latter statement was made after he had seen the data. In any event, he never actually recommended for people to wear masks.

Again, I think this is an area where messaging could be more clear. I think he should have just outright acknowledged "Hey, the other day I said it made common sense that 2 masks would offer more protection than one, but now I've seen the data and the data do not support 2 masks, so I stand corrected on that."
 

Balwiles

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I'm staunchly pro-vaccine across the board, including the covid vaccine. As commentators on both sides of the aisle have noted, though, the messaging has been muddled. On the one hand, we're being told the vaccine is >90% effective. On the other, we're told that even with the vaccine, we need to use caution and social distance and wear face masks and all that. People are seriously hyperparanoid about the vaccine, but I think rightfully confused on the messaging. They're telling people the vaccine is the path back to normalcy (and I agree), but then restrictions are kept in place.

In areas where they can be more clear, they just need to be. People just want clarity. No matter how I try to explain it, my dad still can't let go of "first they told us not to wear facemasks, and now they say we need facemasks."


Respect your position. That's the thing - no one knows how effective or safe it is. And when you look at the numbers in SC (likely less politicized figures) and the US, they don't support vaccinating people outside of *maybe* high risk groups. (Their body, their choice.) And there's now many more options that we have much more data available. This is brand new tech and new is not always better - and sometimes can be much worse. Only the future holds that answer.

We always believe we're on the bleeding-edge of technology....our knowledge of the human body changes at lightspeed. This is a big part of the reason you see a Personal Injury Lawyer commercial/billboard everywhere you look.

And if medicine is that great at infectious disease, why is it one of the leading causes of death year after year? The CDC itself has currently estimated that 2 million people in the US are infected annually by hospital-acquired infections, resulting in 99,000 deaths per year.

It should never be a mandate, and when they are bombarding you with "You need take this right now" - it might be time to pause and zoom out.

It's a risk management decision. It's a personal decision.
 

Flameout12

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Just read this. I hope the people who thought they were voting for “moderate” Dumbocrats come to their senses and do not vote for any more communists in the near future.
The alternative was to vote for an pathologically lying autocrat with mental problems.
Lest we forget....
im-283177
 

Balwiles

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And the polio vaccine?
This is not the COVID vaccine. Nothing like it at all.

I hope this is beneficial for the ones who take it. And I'm talking about today, in 2023, in 2025 and beyond.

Only time holds that answer.
 

Balwiles

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Pales in comparison to trump...

Quick Question: What's up with you and Trump? The vast majority of the comments I read from you involve him, even though he's been gone for months...You clearly despise him. Why continue to interject into conversations that are not even on the topic?

I have zero interest in politics at all. If you want to make a change - start with yourself, your family and your community. National politics are nothing more than political theater. They are all in it for themselves.
 

Carolina Doc

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Respect your position. That's the thing - no one knows how effective or safe it is. And when you look at the numbers in SC (likely less politicized figures) and the US, they don't support vaccinating people outside of *maybe* high risk groups. (Their body, their choice.)
Can you think of any other medicines/treatments/surgical procedures that are 100% safe and effective?
 

Balwiles

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Can you think of any other medicines/treatments/surgical procedures that are 100% safe and effective?

Absolutely none. Not even close. But that's the point - Individual risk analysis.

Unless you're in the higher risk categories - why risk?
 

Gamecockben1979

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So you think this isn't politically driven? It seems the National Teachers Union was consulted about CDC Guidelines for reopening schools and their comments were included almost verbatim in the CDC Guidelines. So the head of the National Teachers Union president is a medical scientist too?

Blaming the teachers. Happy Teacher Appreciation week, huh?
 
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Carolina Doc

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Absolutely none. Not even close. But that's the point - Individual risk analysis.

Unless you're in the higher risk categories - why risk?
I wouldn't necessarily disagree with that choice, but I believe the risk is low and worth taking. Like everything else, its weighing risks vs benefits.
 

Flameout12

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Quick Question: What's up with you and Trump? The vast majority of the comments I read from you involve him, even though he's been gone for months...You clearly despise him. Why continue to interject into conversations that are not even on the topic?

I have zero interest in politics at all. If you want to make a change - start with yourself, your family and your community. National politics are nothing more than political theater. They are all in it for themselves.
How many comments in this and other threads are politics? How many of those are from trump people?
Some of us are sick of the trump sh_t....maybe the forum mods will wake up and do their jobs?
 

Flameout12

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Absolutely none. Not even close. But that's the point - Individual risk analysis.

Unless you're in the higher risk categories - why risk?
Why risk taking a vaccine that is effective? Why risk not taking it?
Why risk not taking the polio vaccine?
Why risk taking any shot for that matter?
 

Flameout12

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This is not the COVID vaccine. Nothing like it at all.

I hope this is beneficial for the ones who take it. And I'm talking about today, in 2023, in 2025 and beyond.

Only time holds that answer.
It's a vaccine....don't make this into something it is not.
 

Balwiles

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I wouldn't necessarily disagree with that choice, but I believe the risk is low and worth taking. Like everything else, its weighing risks vs benefits.

Exactly. Personal decision, however you choose to evaluate.

My only issues have been the marketing to the entire population (especially kids) as if they need it, and the threat of mandates (passports, etc.) IF the reports are correct, they just embarked on a 3 billion ad campaign to market to kid's parents. That's disingenuous and exactly the reason Pfzier got hit with one of their thousands of lawsuits a few years ago - deceptive marketing. In that case, they had to shell out 2.9 billion in fines. Also, I have no idea why are government allows them full indemnity. That's a total conflict of interest.