ADVERTISEMENT

They Are an Elite Group

Clemons is good but not elite. When we had JD he was the difference. Watson is their difference. After their 2 year run here the only difference now is Dablo is younger and won't lay down like SOS did. If they beat bama then I'll believe they are legit. It does seem that when they do play a great team everything goes their way. Not every game,but I saw a lot of open receivers with a clear jersey pull that kept them from catching a pass and saved touchdowns that would have changed a few games.
 
Clemons is good but not elite. When we had JD he was the difference. Watson is their difference. After their 2 year run here the only difference now is Dablo is younger and won't lay down like SOS did. If they beat bama then I'll believe they are legit. It does seem that when they do play a great team everything goes their way. Not every game,but I saw a lot of open receivers with a clear jersey pull that kept them from catching a pass and saved touchdowns that would have changed a few games.
You and I must have different definitions of what elite means. After back to back appearances in the national title game, and 5 or 6 straight ten win or more seasons, if that isn't elite, I sure as heck would like to know what is. Please name somebody other than Alabama.
 
When you sqeek by, by teams missing field goals and hold your breath in several other games that you should have really lost that's not elite. Ask anyone other than a tater and they will say Clemons should have lost at least 2 more games. Yea their good but not elite.
 
Clemson's defensive line is definitely elite, and that makes a huge difference. We used to be like that with Clowney, Taylor, Quarles, and a few others, then Spurrier quit on us.
 
I hope you're right, but twisting ourselves into knots to try to diminish what clempson has accomplished doesn't change anything. I still hear the "they don't play anybody" excuse.

I just pulled up the final CFP rankings. When it's all said and done, they will have played #1 Bama, #3 Ohio St, #11 FSU, #13 Louisville, #14 Auburn, #22 Va Tech, #23 Pitt.

Plus...Ga Tech (crushed KY in bowl), NC State (crushed Vandy in bowl), Wake won their bowl, Troy was 10-3, etc. And they made us look like a Jr High team.

Let me guess - ALL of those teams were overrated, right? LOL
This guy gets it...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Trap Game
When you sqeek by, by teams missing field goals and hold your breath in several other games that you should have really lost that's not elite. Ask anyone other than a tater and they will say Clemons should have lost at least 2 more games. Yea their good but not elite.
Should have and could have don't matter. Have you seen them the last 3 games ? Take off the garnet colored glasses.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
If taters do win, I won't be back here for a few months. This place is already invested with taters and if they win you might as well call it tater central.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rogue cock
If taters do win, I won't be back here for a few months. This place is already invested with taters and if they win you might as well call it tater central.
The consolation prize would be the forthcoming Full Dabo exhibition!
 
Coulda shoulda been us. We were poised and spurrier lazy old ass quit 3 years before he actually quit. And we took it like beaches as fans and hung his damn banner up like a bunch of idiots like he was bigger than the program. Eff spurrier.
Yeah we had them in the palm of our hands and our coach couldn't keep his mouth shut about being here 2 or 3 more years and quitting, although he was still getting paid. His 3 11 win seasons are nothing now because of the way he left this program. Good riddance ole ball sack and thanks for nothing.Go play some more golf.
 
They have built an Empire up here and we have watched it happen! Meanwhile we change or loose coaches like changing under ware! I've been a Gamecock for 47 years and was told a long long time ago that "it cannot be done here"! I'm beginning to wonder about that statement being true! This is about football!

Bama has built a tradition for decades and it shows.

Clemson has rebuilt a winning tradition and it shows.

For ages, USC didn't care about winning FB games and only recently tried to build something akin to a lasting tradition in 1999 and it shows.

Let's be honest here. Schools with winning FB traditions care more about winning FB games than anything else associated with the school. Bama runs their team like an NFL organization and Clemson has kept up. Bama employs a small army of QC assistants and analysts who just observe and report. The reason they beat Clemson last year is likely because one or more of the analysts noticed Clemson was lax on the kickoff and ripe for an onsides kick. They'll pay anything to win and if you don't follow suit you won't keep up or catch up. That's the nature of the game now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
Bama has built a tradition for decades and it shows.

Clemson has rebuilt a winning tradition and it shows.

For ages, USC didn't care about winning FB games and only recently tried to build something akin to a lasting tradition in 1999 and it shows.

Let's be honest here. Schools with winning FB traditions care more about winning FB games than anything else associated with the school. Bama runs their team like an NFL organization and Clemson has kept up. Bama employs a small army of QC assistants and analysts who just observe and report. The reason they beat Clemson last year is likely because one or more of the analysts noticed Clemson was lax on the kickoff and ripe for an onsides kick. They'll pay anything to win and if you don't follow suit you won't keep up or catch up. That's the nature of the game now.
That sounds good in print, but I disagree. While Bama isn't thought of as a prestigious academic institution, it's law school is highly ranked. And in more than one publication Bama is (embarrassingly) ranked higher than SC. Have you been to their campus recently? It's beautiful. I don't know where their money is coming from, but it's one continuous construction site, and they're doing a terrific job. It's an impressive campus.

Clemp is a similar story except they are highly ranked academically in a number of publications. We can debate all we want how they "cheated" but the fact remains that years after the facts came out how Clemp manipulated the numbers, they are still highly ranked. So, the manipulation apparently doesn't matter. Same for UNC.

UGA brought in Adams as Prez in 1997. At the time it was similarly ranked as SC. By the time he left in 2016 UGA became a highly respected public university. They are now highly ranked. So, it can be done relatively quickly, and it can be done without negatively impacting athletics.

That's my beef with Pastides. On a personal level I like him very much. But, as Prez he has NOT gotten the job done. Our academic ranking has actually slightly fallen under his leadership. Donations have increased to be sure, but they have pretty much increased everywhere else too, especially since the economic recovery started.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
That sounds good in print, but I disagree. While Bama isn't thought of as a prestigious academic institution, it's law school is highly ranked. And in more than one publication Bama is (embarrassingly) ranked higher than SC. Have you been to their campus recently? It's beautiful. I don't know where their money is coming from, but it's one continuous construction site, and they're doing a terrific job. It's an impressive campus.

Clemp is a similar story except they are highly ranked academically in a number of publications. We can debate all we want how they "cheated" but the fact remains that years after the facts came out how Clemp manipulated the numbers, they are still highly ranked. So, the manipulation apparently doesn't matter. Same for UNC.

UGA brought in Adams as Prez in 1997. At the time it was similarly ranked as SC. By the time he left in 2016 UGA became a highly respected public university. They are now highly ranked. So, it can be done relatively quickly, and it can be done without negatively impacting athletics.

That's my beef with Pastides. On a personal level I like him very much. But, as Prez he has NOT gotten the job done. Our academic ranking has actually slightly fallen under his leadership. Donations have increased to be sure, but they have pretty much increased everywhere else too, especially since the economic recovery started.

I'm not knocking their academics or exalting SC's. But if you gave Alabama a choice between anything and FB success, they'd choose FB. It's well documented how they cheated more than everyone else to build the tradition in the first place. That has been replaced by money spent on facilities and staff. As for where the money at Bama comes from, I was told by a coworker that Bama has more out of state students from TX than they have from AL. I guess that wouldn't hurt.
 
I'm not knocking their academics or exalting SC's. But if you gave Alabama a choice between anything and FB success, they'd choose FB. It's well documented how they cheated more than everyone else to build the tradition in the first place. That has been replaced by money spent on facilities and staff. As for where the money at Bama comes from, I was told by a coworker that Bama has more out of state students from TX than they have from AL. I guess that wouldn't hurt.
Yes, you may be correct. I want both for SC.
 
I'm not knocking their academics or exalting SC's. But if you gave Alabama a choice between anything and FB success, they'd choose FB. It's well documented how they cheated more than everyone else to build the tradition in the first place. That has been replaced by money spent on facilities and staff. As for where the money at Bama comes from, I was told by a coworker that Bama has more out of state students from TX than they have from AL. I guess that wouldn't hurt.

That is not a true statement .. they received a five yr probation in 2002... since then , nothing major.

From 2003-2007 The probation years Alabama was 28-30 record...hardly taking advantage of "cheating"

They win because Saban became coach in 2008 ...they have a great coach and a great program.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
Wilkins, Ferrell, Cain, Feaster, Dex Lawrence, Renfrow, Hyatt, and most of our starters are either freshmen or sophmores

Clemson is losing 6 starters on offense, including 5 of it's most productive skill position players (Watson, Gallman, Scott, Williams, Leggett, Guillermo).
Also losing 4 starters on defense (Boulware, Johnson, Tankersley, Watkins).

That much production on either side of the ball will be tough to replace.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
Clemson is losing 6 starters on offense, including 5 of it's most productive skill position players (Watson, Gallman, Scott, Williams, Leggett, Guillermo).
Also losing 4 starters on defense (Boulware, Johnson, Tankersley, Watkins).

That much production on either side of the ball will be tough to replace.

Dabo Swinney is 69-13 since 2011 with his recruits .. they've been losing good players every year.....its called re loading
 
That is not a true statement .. they received a five yr probation in 2002... since then , nothing major.

From 2003-2007 The probation years Alabama was 28-30 record...hardly taking advantage of "cheating"

They win because Saban became coach in 2008 ...they have a great coach and a great program.

You picked my response to Atlanta Cock to disagree with.

I didn't say Saban cheats and I don't think that. He just uses every possible edge he can get without breaking the rules. Paul Bear Bryant was once a coach at Bama and he paid the most to the best players. It was common practice in that era and how they built the tradition. Saban didn't start the winning tradition known as Bama FB. They won a few games before he got there. If you reread my post, you'll see how I said they now run the org better than anyone else and it shows.
 
Last edited:
I didn't say Saban cheats. Bear Bryant was once a coach at Bama and he paid the most to the best players. It was common practice in that era and how they built the tradition. Saban didn't start the winning tradition known as Bama FB. They won a few games before he got there. If you reread my post, you'll see how I said they run the org better than anyone else.

Lets deal in this century... Alabama was terrible in the first part of this century, so at that time tradition meant nothing.

Saban is the reason Alabama is thriving and he has had no major violations
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
Clemson is losing 6 starters on offense, including 5 of it's most productive skill position players (Watson, Gallman, Scott, Williams, Leggett, Guillermo).
Also losing 4 starters on defense (Boulware, Johnson, Tankersley, Watkins).

That much production on either side of the ball will be tough to replace.
I agree, they don't lose many players. But the ones they do lose are some of the greatest to play at the school including the greatest .
 
Lets deal in this century... Alabama was terrible in the first part of this century, so at that time tradition meant nothing.

You're right, previous national and conference championships count for nothing in terms of TRADITION. My bad. You're pretending Bama had to start from nothing. Even Spurrier said it was easier for Saban to win at Bama than a place with less of a tradition.
 
You're right, previous national and conference championships count for nothing in terms of TRADITION. My bad. You're pretending Bama had to start from nothing.

Even Spurrier said it was easier for Saban to win at Bama than a place with less of a tradition.

that would be a true statement , but not everyone's won at Bama
What Saban has done in this era of football surpasses Bryant and most football people would agree with this...again no major violations
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
that would be a true statement , but not everyone's won at Bama
What Saban has done in this era of football surpasses Bryant and most football people would agree with this...again no major violations
Agreed. But he couldn't do that just any old place. He couldn't do it here. There's a reason he went to Bama. They will pay for what he says, who he hires and what he wants built. They had enough of a name to recruit on. I give him all the credit he's due but there are only a handful of schools that can spend like that. It's symbiotic.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
Agreed. But he couldn't do that just any old place. He couldn't do it here. There's a reason he went to Bama. They will pay for what he says, who he hires and what he wants built. They had enough of a name to recruit on. I give him all the credit he's due but there are only a handful of schools that can spend like that. It's symbiotic.

agree with most of your statement
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheReelEss
Another thing to remember about our Fanbase is the fact that those who post on FGF, that are legitimate Gamecock fans, are a small percentage of the overall Fanbase. My question is does our Fanbase, as a whole, have the same expectations as Alabama or the taters? I would venture to say no. I love Ray Tanner and I am so grateful for the two national championships he gave us in baseball. But is he in A.D. that can bring our athletic program to an elite status? I'm not sure if he has the skill set to do that. I am not in the athletic department so truly do not know. And I don't know what type of accountability Ray gives our coaches in terms of expectations and wins. Perhaps Ray's emphasis is on the graduation rate of our athletes. I do know we excel in that category and we certainly kill the taters in that respect. But let's be honest, the average fan doesn't give graduation rates a very high priority. We want wins! And it seems that in order to be elite, and to get the wins, you're going to have to do some things that are borderline unethical. Are we willing to do those things? It is clear that our rivals in the upstate will do anything to win. Should we adopt that same mindset? If we're going to compete it seems we have no choice. Sorry for the long post and semi – rant, just getting a few things off my chest to my Gamecock brothers and sisters.
 
Some people act like Tanner is the first AD SC has ever had.. history shows no matter who the AD is, SC has been at best average over 100 + years of football

So why blame it on Tanner...after all, Tanner was in charge for 2 of the 3 best years in SC football history... in charge when the basketball team won the most games in schools history... can another SC AD say that...nooooo
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
Some people act like Tanner is the first AD SC has ever had.. history shows no matter who the AD is, SC has been at best average over 100 + years of football

So why blame it on Tanner...after all, Tanner was in charge for 2 of the 3 best years in SC football history... in charge when the basketball team won the most games in schools history... can another SC AD say that...nooooo

2 things.
1. I am not talking about history, I am talking about here right now. Things have changed a lot in the last 20, 10, or heck even the last five years. I don't care about history, nothing can be done about history. What I care about is the here and now and the future.
2. It was clear that Spurrier wanted to coach college football again. That's why we got him. It wasn't because of anything extraordinary Ray Tanner did. Florida passed on him. If Florida would have wanted him back, he would've went there.
 
Last edited:
2 things.
1. I am not talking about history, I am talking about here right now. Things have changed a lot in the last 20, 10, or heck even the last five years. I could care less about history, nothing can be done about history. What I care about is the here and now and the future.
2. It was clear that Spurrier wanted to coach college football again. That's why we got him. It wasn't because of anything extraordinary Ray Tanner did. Florida passed on him. If Florida would have wanted him back, he would've went there.

ok fine... but when some bash Tanner since he became AD in 2012, maybe those people need to take a step back and look at the last 4 years...better than most years for football and BBall... and I doubt you will see moving forward, better than say 8-4, 9-3 if GOD was the AD
 
ok fine... but when some bash Tanner since he became AD in 2012, maybe those people need to take a step back and look at the last 4 years...better than most years for football and BBall... and I doubt you will see moving forward, better than say 8-4, 9-3 if GOD was the AD

I disagree with the notion that we can't do better than 8-4 or 9-3. We have so much more to offer than the taters do and yet they seem to pull it off. If you throw enough money at the right AD and the right coach and let them do what they have to do to win, You will get stellar results. It will not happen overnight. It certainly didn't happen for Diablo Sweeney. Now hear me I'm not saying we should or shouldn't. To sell out the integrity of the University and to do things that you know are not above board is a big price to pay. All I'm saying is we can if we really wanted to.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rogue cock
[QUOTE="mUSCle Gamecock, post: 3073562, member: 1826"... I love Ray Tanner and I am so grateful for the two national championships he gave us in baseball. But is he in A.D. that can bring our athletic program to an elite status? ...[/QUOTE]

He is a huge improvement over the previous AD.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
I disagree with the notion that we can't do better than 8-4 or 9-3. We have so much more to offer than the taters do and yet they seem to pull it off. If you throw enough money at the right AD and the right coach and let them do what they have to do to win, You will get stellar results. It will not happen overnight. It certainly didn't happen for Diablo Sweeney. Now hear me I'm not saying we should or shouldn't. To sell out the integrity of the University and to do things that you know are not above board is a big price to pay. All I'm saying is we can if we really wanted to.

Well that could be said at most every power 5 school... whenever a school signs a AD and a HC at that time they believe they have signed the right guy.
SC has thrown millions at coaches, money is not a problem at SC
I believe SC fans need to be satisfied with 8-4 , 9-3 and maybe an occasional 10-2
 
To assume Clemson football will not continue to flourish is foolish

Sure, replacing a 2 time Heisman finalist QB, probably the best that's ever played at Clemson, will be easy.
Also, replacing the best WR duo since Watkins/Hopkins will be easy.
Also, replacing the starting RB, who is probably in the top 5 to play at Clemson, will be easy.
Also, replacing the starting TE, that's arguably top 2 or 3 TE in the country, will be easy.
Yep, that's all just a piece of cake.
 
They have built an Empire up here and we have watched it happen! Meanwhile we change or loose coaches like changing under ware! I've been a Gamecock for 47 years and was told a long long time ago that "it cannot be done here"! I'm beginning to wonder about that statement being true! This is about football!
Come on man. Dabo has managed to land some top talent players the last two years, got past FSU and caught us in a down cycle. To say Swinney has built an Empire is very premature. He has built a cult but after he gets soundly whipped by Bama and Williams, Watson , Gallman and others leave him, he reverts right back into the Tajh Boyd type teams. Clemson cannot consistently beat teams like Auburn, FSU OR South Carolina There will be seasons when Dabo won't even be able to match talent with these type programs. Clemson squeezed in to very good years no doubt but lets not get carried away.
 
Williams, Watson , Gallman and others leave him, he reverts right back into the Tajh Boyd type teams
They didn't have the D or the oline with Boyd that they have now. Not saying they will still be a playoff team but they won't be a bad team.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jpcooper
Come on man. Dabo has managed to land some top talent players the last two years, got past FSU and caught us in a down cycle. To say Swinney has built an Empire is very premature. He has built a cult but after he gets soundly whipped by Bama and Williams, Watson , Gallman and others leave him, he reverts right back into the Tajh Boyd type teams. Clemson cannot consistently beat teams like Auburn, FSU OR South Carolina There will be seasons when Dabo won't even be able to match talent with these type programs. Clemson squeezed in to very good years no doubt but lets not get carried away.

2 very good years....you need to research back to 2011
 
  • Like
Reactions: BillyMcCocky
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT