Things I learned from the sunshine pumpers….

[Gamecockben1979]

1. Ray Tanner knows more than you
2. We want coaches with heart that want to be here.
3. Gradual improvement is reason to be excited, even if it’s in the tallest midget conference. So let’s roll with that mid major hire even if history says that’s a disaster here.

We seriously could have had a dolphin swim around rocks with names or faces on it and let them pick one. I’d roll with the dolphin to pick better candidates than what we have in most sports. Maybe we should do that for our next baseball hire. I have zero faith in our AD to do it.

 

[Cock-a-Doo]

C'mon now Ben - you've really gone negative these past several weeks.
I can see how you'd be a little frustrated with the basketball hire but I certainly don't buy that its a guaranteed failure.
Baseball needs a change - and quick, i think that's evident to all.
Football we did go with the "guys with hear that wants to be here" but surely you cant be anything but excited with what beamer has done so far.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

C'mon now Ben - you've really gone negative these past several weeks.
I can see how you'd be a little frustrated with the basketball hire but I certainly don't buy that its a guaranteed failure.
Baseball needs a change - and quick, i think that's evident to all.
Football we did go with the "guys with hear that wants to be here" but surely you cant be anything but excited with what beamer has done so far.

Normally I would subscribe to the 2 out of 3 ain’t bad. But when 2 out of 3 are bad…..that’s a problem. The mood has definitely soured lately. Baseball is bad. Mens basketball seems like a downgrade. I am cautiously optimistic about football.

 

[bernie1312]

Despiration: Hiring a coach just to fill a position.
Tanner = ______________?

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Despiration: Hiring a coach just to fill a position.
Tanner = ______________?

Tanner reminds me of the ugly college guy going to the bar to get lucky. He sees a girl way out of his league and get rejected. College guy then starts eyeing another girl and her boyfriend comes back from the bathroom right about the time courage kicked in. So now it’s 2 am. The lights are on. There’s one ugly fat chick at the bar. It’s now or never. Ray Tanner is that guy. He takes the lonely fat girl home and tries to pretend in his mind it’s a supermodel.

 

[67gamecock]

Tanner reminds me of the ugly college guy going to the bar to get lucky. He sees a girl way out of his league and get rejected. College guy then starts eyeing another girl and her boyfriend comes back from the bathroom right about the time courage kicked in. So now it’s 2 am. The lights are on. There’s one ugly fat chick at the bar. It’s now or never. Ray Tanner is that guy. He takes the lonely fat girl home and tries to pretend in his mind it’s a supermodel.

Tanner just wasn't the man for the job. Pastidis took the quick and easy way out with the Tanner selection for AD. Someone on the BOT should have called him (Pastidis) on it but he (the Trustee) was probably too busy eating his free lunch!

 

[sclawman77]

C'mon now Ben - you've really gone negative these past several weeks.
I can see how you'd be a little frustrated with the basketball hire but I certainly don't buy that its a guaranteed failure.
Baseball needs a change - and quick, i think that's evident to all.
Football we did go with the "guys with hear that wants to be here" but surely you cant be anything but excited with what beamer has done so far.

Jury is still out on Beamer. Still has a lot to prove. Mens major sports are still dismal overall. We're hoping to just make the SEC tournament in baseball these days. Mens basketball is an embarrassment. Thanks Ray.

 

[Cock-a-Doo]

I don’t know that Tanner was someone we shouldn’t have taken a chance on, but at this stage the new has more than worn off and the CWS titles are becoming a distant memory.
Time to go another direction - Tanner would probably do fine at a smaller institution.

 

[rogue cock]

I don’t know that Tanner was someone we shouldn’t have taken a chance on, but at this stage the new has more than worn off and the CWS titles are becoming a distant memory.
Time to go another direction - Tanner would probably do fine at a smaller institution.

Surprisingly being a former coach, Tanner is much better at the job responsibilities that are outside the coaching selection area. In fact, he is very good at those job responsibilities and he gets along with the coaches very well. He absolutely needs a better batting average on his coaching selections though.

 

[PC31]

One thing is for sure. Regardless of who Tanner hired, the usual suspects here on SCOOP! would complain. Tanner just no longer gets the benefit of the doubt with them.
If he hired Miller they would have cried.....CHEATER. Miss on Miller and they cry FAILURE....
We all know that is true. They know it is true.

 

[ToddFlanders]

I consider myself somewhat of a sunshine pumper, but I don't need a coach that "wants to be here." I need a coach that can win here. And if he wins enough he can leave and he wants to, then let ‘‘em go! Bring in another guy that can win here. I’d rather be known as a stepping stone for a coach than a gravestone (which is where USC stands at the moment).

 

[Lurker123]

One thing is for sure. Regardless of who Tanner hired, the usual suspects here on SCOOP! would complain. Tanner just no longer gets the benefit of the doubt with them.
If he hired Miller they would have cried.....CHEATER. Miss on Miller and they cry FAILURE....
We all know that is true. They know it is true.

Does Tanner really still deserve the benefit of the doubt?

 

[PC31]

For me.......yes.
He is the one doing the hiring and I can only hope he gets it right. I don't pretend to know more about hiring coaches at Carolina than Tanner does, unlike the many experts we have here on SCOOP
He hires Lamont Paris, I have to give him the benefit of the doubt that Coach Paris is the best coach available for our job.

 

[Lurker123]

For me.......yes.
He is the one doing the hiring and I can only hope he gets it right. I don't pretend to know more about hiring coaches at Carolina than Tanner does, unlike the many experts we have here on SCOOP
He hires Lamont Paris, I have to give him the benefit of the doubt that Coach Paris is the best coach available for our job.

I understand the thinking, and it has its merit to some.

If I may paraphrase, you're saying though that he deserves the benefit of the doubt simply because he currently has the AD job.

Imho, not everyone who has a job is necessarily good at it. But I also note you added "hope" in there. I would expect everyone hopes it will work out, but that's different from believing it will.

 

[stu1cocks]

I agree Beamer still has a lot to prove but there is also a lot to like there and reason for cautious optimism. I feel like he is building a culture and that will take some time. What is refreshing to see is his enthusiasm and promotion of a family environment. The MBB and baseball programs appear to be DOA on the other hand.

 

[stu1cocks]

I understand the thinking, and it has its merit to some.

If I may paraphrase, you're saying though that he deserves the benefit of the doubt simply because he currently has the AD job.

Imho, not everyone who has a job is necessarily good at it. But I also note you added "hope" in there. I would expect everyone hopes it will work out, but that's different from believing it will.

Ted Knight as Judge Smails in Caddyshack: "The world needs ditch diggers too."

 

[Gamecockben1979]

For me.......yes.
He is the one doing the hiring and I can only hope he gets it right. I don't pretend to know more about hiring coaches at Carolina than Tanner does, unlike the many experts we have here on SCOOP
He hires Lamont Paris, I have to give him the benefit of the doubt that Coach Paris is the best coach available for our job.

You don’t have to be an expert to see when he hires coaches with losing conference records or close to it, then it shouldn’t be surprising when you get the same thing here.

If Ray Tanner we’re a .500 baseball coach at NC State, I doubt he ever would have set foot in a Carolina dugout…..unless Ray Tanner the AD was hiring him.

 

[rogue cock]

You don’t have to be an expert to see when he hires coaches with losing conference records or close to it, then it shouldn’t be surprising when you get the same thing here.

If Ray Tanner we’re a .500 baseball coach at NC State, I doubt he ever would have set foot in a Carolina dugout…..unless Ray Tanner the AD was hiring him.

Similar arguments as I heard against Lemonis. Pretty much it was that he took over a team that finished 1st in the conference the previous two years and made it to the CWS and after he took them over finished basically 5th or 6th in the conference, a "non-baseball" conference.

In case you were wondering about Lemonis' "successful predecessor, he was hired at Arizona State and was fired last year. You just simply never know who will be successful and who won't.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Similar arguments as I heard against Lemonis. Pretty much it was that he took over a team that finished 1st in the conference the previous two years and made it to the CWS and after he took them over finished basically 5th or 6th in the conference, a "non-baseball" conference.

In case you were wondering about Lemonis' "successful predecessor, he was hired at Arizona State and was fired last year. You just simply never know who will be successful and who won't.

Fair enough. But I do think you have to at least have a track record for success. I do think it’s harder in college baseball to make a great hire than any of the other sports. The reason I say this is that you could sign a good class and lose them to MLB. You could sign a good class and lose some to the transfer portal before they develop. It’s also challenging given the lack of funding in baseball scholarships compared to other sports. Virginia and Vanderbilt have it figured out by funneling money through “foundations”.

 

[rogue cock]

Fair enough. But I do think you have to at least have a track record for success. I do think it’s harder in college baseball to make a great hire than any of the other sports. The reason I say this is that you could sign a good class and lose them to MLB. You could sign a good class and lose some to the transfer portal before they develop. It’s also challenging given the lack of funding in baseball scholarships compared to other sports. Virginia and Vanderbilt have it figured out by funneling money through “foundations”.

It's not easy for any sport....unless it is someone like Pitino, Spurrier, etc. It is simply a roll of the dice.

As far as Virginia and Vanderbilt, they are fortunate to have endowments that allow them to fund the tuition for all students....including baseball players. Very, very few schools have that size of an endowment or would choose to use it in the way they do. Vanderbilt has their tuition assistance program on their website for all to see.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

It's not easy for any sport....unless it is someone like Pitino, Spurrier, etc. It is simply a roll of the dice.

As far as Virginia and Vanderbilt, they are fortunate to have endowments that allow them to fund the tuition for all students....including baseball players. Very, very few schools have that size of an endowment or would choose to use it in the way they do. Vanderbilt has their tuition assistance program on their website for all to see.

No but it’s easier in the other two sports although the transfer portal is making the other sports more like college baseball and build for now.

You’re right that not every school has these type of set ups but we can definitely connect it’s creation to the rise of Vanderbilt baseball. I guess the million dollar question is why it has not benefited them in the other two major sports.

Pitino and Spurrier are good examples of solid hires you know will work. These people are not a dime a dozen but they are out there. Heck I’d argue the Frank Martin hire was a success. Much like Spurrier it may not have ended pretty, but also like Spurrier it gave us the highest highs our program has ever had.

I just think these mid major hires don’t work here because we already have a lot of built in disadvantages. If we’re going to win, we need a name brand at the top. Holtz was that guy. Spurrier was that guy. Staley was that woman long before she won a game here. It’s hard to land these hires but I think they’re absolutely necessary. Even to some extent Beamer has this bc of his dad. Every recruit’s parents in the country know who his dad is. That’s an advantage.

 

[rogue cock]

No but it’s easier in the other two sports although the transfer portal is making the other sports more like college baseball and build for now.

You’re right that not every school has these type of set ups but we can definitely connect it’s creation to the rise of Vanderbilt baseball. I guess the million dollar question is why it has not benefited them in the other two major sports.

Pitino and Spurrier are good examples of solid hires you know will work. These people are not a dime a dozen but they are out there. Heck I’d argue the Frank Martin hire was a success. Much like Spurrier it may not have ended pretty, but also like Spurrier it gave us the highest highs our program has ever had.

I just think these mid major hires don’t work here because we already have a lot of built in disadvantages. If we’re going to win, we need a name brand at the top. Holtz was that guy. Spurrier was that guy. Staley was that woman long before she won a game here. It’s hard to land these hires but I think they’re absolutely necessary. Even to some extent Beamer has this bc of his dad. Every recruit’s parents in the country know who his dad is. That’s an advantage.

Don't disagree at all.

 

[Stewart.H]

Here is the important question....Did we improve our basketball prospects by firing Frank Martin?
Lamont ? remains to be seen...
Do you feel we are better now?
You reap what you sew....

 

[cockofdawn]

Here is the important question....Did we improve our basketball prospects by firing Frank Martin?
Lamont ? remains to be seen...
Do you feel we are better now?
You reap what you sew....

we shall see, It couldnt get much worse, aside from one magical season... I feel it isnt any worse IMO..

 

[SLODAWG]

Tanner reminds me of the ugly college guy going to the bar to get lucky. He sees a girl way out of his league and get rejected. College guy then starts eyeing another girl and her boyfriend comes back from the bathroom right about the time courage kicked in. So now it’s 2 am. The lights are on. There’s one ugly fat chick at the bar. It’s now or never. Ray Tanner is that guy. He takes the lonely fat girl home and tries to pretend in his mind it’s a supermodel.

That may not be a good analogy. The scenario as you describe it is still a sucess. An available fat, ugly girl still beats the alternative.

 

[midline]

I think the frustrating part about Tanner is that he seemingly has no plan in regards to a coaching search. Well he does, but then when option 1,2,3, that weren't realistic anyway, don't pan out, then he is left scrambling just to find somebody, anybody, that will take the job. That was illustrated by the recent basketball hire. Same thing happened with the Muschamp hire. The last football hire, it was obvious that the focus was to hire on the cheap. And even at that Napier made demands that could not be tolerated. Of course, he knew that down the road he would have better opportunities. So they hire Beamer. But in what led to Muschamp and the Paris hire, apparently Ray doesn't have people that work the back channels, etc., to figure out if a possible candidate is just posing to lure another job, or using USC as leverage.

 

[bucketdad]

I think the frustrating part about Tanner is that he seemingly has no plan in regards to a coaching search. Well he does, but then when option 1,2,3, that weren't realistic anyway, don't pan out, then he is left scrambling just to find somebody, anybody, that will take the job. That was illustrated by the recent basketball hire. Same thing happened with the Muschamp hire. The last football hire, it was obvious that the focus was to hire on the cheap. And even at that Napier made demands that could not be tolerated. Of course, he knew that down the road he would have better opportunities. So they hire Beamer. But in what led to Muschamp and the Paris hire, apparently Ray doesn't have people that work the back channels, etc., to figure out if a possible candidate is just posing to lure another job, or using USC as leverage.

You would think that of all people, him being a former baseball coach, he would understand all about options 1, 2 or 3 not working out given the possibility of your best recruits bypassing college. The fact that there doesnt appear to be a plan after that points more to laziness if you ask me.

 

[cockofdawn]

You would think that of all people, a baseball coach would understand all about options 1, 2 or 3 not working out given the possibility of your best recruits bypassing college. The fact that there doesnt appear to be a plan after that points more to laziness if you ask me.

EXACTLY, i personally (based on resulTA) do not think Kingston can develop talent. These kids all were pretty amazing in high school. Then they come here and are very inconsistent at best.

 

[gamecock stock]

1. Ray Tanner knows more than you
2. We want coaches with heart that want to be here.
3. Gradual improvement is reason to be excited, even if it’s in the tallest midget conference. So let’s roll with that mid major hire even if history says that’s a disaster here.

We seriously could have had a dolphin swim around rocks with names or faces on it and let them pick one. I’d roll with the dolphin to pick better candidates than what we have in most sports. Maybe we should do that for our next baseball hire. I have zero faith in our AD to do it.

Don't believe that my number one choice in any sport has been hired to be the Head Coach here at Carolina. But, in life, you don't always get what you want. Thus, I always, then, try to look at the bright side and positives of a situation that does not go my way. Does that make me a "sunshine pumper"? That's how I deal with such events. How do YOU deal with them?

 

[gamecock stock]

I’d argue the Frank Martin hire was a success. Much like Spurrier it may not have ended pretty, but also like Spurrier it gave us the highest highs our program has ever had.

I would not equate the Frank Martin era with the Steve Spurrier era. It's not even close. Martin had one really good year here. Spurrier had 3 national Top 10 seasons here, plus winning the SEC East once and beating Clemson 5 straight years.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Don't believe that my number one choice in any sport has been hired to be the Head Coach here at Carolina. But, in life, you don't always get what you want. Thus, I always, then, try to look at the bright side and positives of a situation that does not go my way. Does that make me a "sunshine pumper"? That's how I deal with such events. How do YOU deal with them?

I pay for tickets and support my team but that also doesn’t relieve my alma mater from their end of the bargain which is putting a product on the court/field/etc…worthy of me spending it on.

A sunshine pumper continues to beat the drum for the university even in the worst of circumstances.

For instance, if you watch our baseball team play and you think we’re in great shape that makes you a sunshine pumper. Why? Because we’re in the bottom of the conference. We continuously kick ourself in the butt. But then to come on here and talk about how great things are would make you a pumper. See how it works?

You may think they don’t exist bc of course our baseball team sucks. Go back and look at the posts after the Texas and Vandy series. The “Who wants Kingston fired now” posts are from the most easily identifiable sunshine pumpers.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

I would not equate the Frank Martin era with the Steve Spurrier era. It's not even close. Martin had one really good year here. Spurrier had 3 national Top 10 seasons here, plus winning the SEC East once and beating Clemson 5 straight years.

Spurrier did a better job and did some things that hadn’t been done, but you can’t argue that Frank Martin had us one game from a national title. Football is a little different and we had some top 5 finishes, but we were never 2 days away from a national title in football. If Sindarius is healthy that game, we probably ended up in the championship. Even without it we were close. We’ve never been that close to going to a national title game even in Spurriers best years. Spurrier was more consistent and it is football so it gets more attention.

 

[gamecock stock]

I pay for tickets and support my team but that also doesn’t relieve my alma mater from their end of the bargain which is putting a product on the court/field/etc…worthy of me spending it on.

A sunshine pumper continues to beat the drum for the university even in the worst of circumstances.

For instance, if you watch our baseball team play and you think we’re in great shape that makes you a sunshine pumper. Why? Because we’re in the bottom of the conference. We continuously kick ourself in the butt. But then to come on here and talk about how great things are would make you a pumper. See how it works?

You may think they don’t exist bc of course our baseball team sucks. Go back and look at the posts after the Texas and Vandy series. The “Who wants Kingston fired now” posts are from the most easily identifiable sunshine pumpers.

Anyone who read my posts prior to and during football season, it would be seen that I was against the hiring of Beamer (who supposedly, we were told "wanted to be here"), warmed up to him prior to the start of the season, was critical of him during the season, and supported giving him a contract extension and pay raise after the season. Thus, I put my concerns behind me after a hire and then wait for "A" (winning) to happen before "B" (rewarding). That's the way I roll.

The bottom-line is that Paris was not on my short list to be hired as our basketball coach, much less my top choice. And yes, he is the one from a "mid-major" school, whose team conference record and overall record improved every year. But, you won't find me bitching about the hire, just like I did not after Beamer was hired. But, that's me.

Regarding baseball, you won't find one post from me about baseball. In fact, you won't find a post from me about baseball in years, because, frankly, I have not kept up with baseball for years.

 

[gamecock stock]

Spurrier did a better job and did some things that hadn’t been done, but you can’t argue that Frank Martin had us one game from a national title. Football is a little different and we had some top 5 finishes, but we were never 2 days away from a national title in football. If Sindarius is healthy that game, we probably ended up in the championship. Even without it we were close. We’ve never been that close to going to a national title game even in Spurriers best years. Spurrier was more consistent and it is football so it gets more attention.

I PREVIOUSLY said that Martin gave us one really good year (out of 10). If an employee is going to produce really well 10% of the time and be mediocre the rest of the time, he would not work for me for long. But, that's me.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

I PREVIOUSLY said that Martin gave us one really good year (out of 10). If an employee is going to produce really well 10% of the time and be mediocre the rest of the time, he would not work for me for long. But, that's me.

If your company was a complete $hit show for the 5 years prior to said employees arrival, you might have to factor that into the 10 year plan.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Anyone who read my posts prior to and during football season, it would be seen that I was against the hiring of Beamer (who supposedly, we were told "wanted to be here"), warmed up to him prior to the start of the season, was critical of him during the season, and supported giving him a contract extension and pay raise after the season. Thus, I put my concerns behind me after a hire and then wait for "A" (winning) to happen before "B" (rewarding). That's the way I roll.

The bottom-line is that Paris was not on my short list to be hired as our basketball coach, much less my top choice. And yes, he is the one from a "mid-major" school, whose team conference record and overall record improved every year. But, you won't find me bitching about the hire, just like I did not after Beamer was hired. But, that's me.

Regarding baseball, you won't find one post from me about baseball. In fact, you won't find a post from me about baseball in years, because, frankly, I have not kept up with baseball for years.

You’re free not to bitch about the hire but this happens to be a message board. A free one. Where opinions are expressed. You can like it or not like it. You can scroll. You can argue. You can ignore. You can bitch about the fact that I’m bitching. It’s your prerogative.

 

[Flameout12]

"we'll be fine"

 

[gamecock stock]

If your company was a complete $hit show for the 5 years prior to said employees arrival, you might have to factor that into the 10 year plan.

10 years for Martin to get the job done right? LMAO. Well, it doesn't matter now because he is thankfully gone, to my delight and that of most Gamecock fans.

 

[gamecock stock]

You’re free not to bitch about the hire but this happens to be a message board. A free one. Where opinions are expressed. You can like it or not like it. You can scroll. You can argue. You can ignore. You can bitch about the fact that I’m bitching. It’s your prerogative.

Show me where I said you don't have the right to bitch. You won't because you can't. You can't because I did not. I only contrasted my approach to yours when things don't go the way I want. Once I became an adult, I stopped concerning myself with things I have no control over because it would be a waste of time.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Show me where I said you don't have the right to bitch. You won't because you can't. You can't because I did not. I only contrasted my approach to yours when things don't go the way I want. Once I became an adult, I stopped concerning myself with things I have no control over because it would be a waste of time.

Then as an adult why do you come to message boards where opinions are freely exchanged. If that’s your stance, why not stick to reading box scores.

So you react differently? Should we award you with the golden cookie or what?