What if Dawn Staley thought way? Clemson didn’t even win an acc championship from 1992-2010. They watched powerhouses like BC, Wake, and Maryland win though. That defeatist attitude gets us nowhere. It excuses crap performance.
Unacceptable
- Thread starter johnnohj
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What if Dawn Staley thought way? Clemson didn’t even win an acc championship from 1992-2010. They watched powerhouses like BC, Wake, and Maryland win though. That defeatist attitude gets us nowhere. It excuses crap performance.
It's just reality my man. Clemson's jump to the elite level has certainly been amazing, but they are a .600+ win team over their history. They did have a previous national title already as well. But they were mostly one of those teams was always on the hump but not quite able to get over it. A Top 25 team most years, Top 15 sometimes. For the most part good, but never great. Dabo just got them over the hump. We're a tick over .500 for our history with no period of sustained success. Clemson's won more bowl games than we have played in. Using their jump to the elite level is no basis whatsoever to suggest we can do the same. Apples and oranges.
We're just trying to get to the hump. You have to be a realist. Objectively, I realize NOTHING has really changed with Gamecock football since I was a kid in the 80s. ALL the discussions that are had on this forum, and others, about what needs to be done to make us relevant are the EXACT SAME conversations people were having back in the 80s. We have ALWAYS been that team just trying to make it. Hence "wait til next year."
Of course, I'm not suggesting we throw in the towel and quit trying. I'm a realistic optimist.
That's above my paygrade. One way, tho, is to get the BEST FB coach and pay him whatever he demands to come here. Looking back I kinda wish USC had hired Mack Brown when he expressed interest a few years ago. I know he's getting on in years but if he was successful it might have led to a SS like hire after he retired.
The FB knowledgers in the admin are supposed to figure this out. But so far......... ASS(after SS).
Clemson has offered a blueprint. Shouldn't be too hard to copy what they have done. Mich and Ala are two examples of schools that will do whatever it takes to win. Can't be done on the cheap or with smoke and mirrors.
Don't like being cynical about present state of USC FB. I want the ole Rah Rah Jerry back. Maybe, maybe, maybe I will STHU as far as being negative goes on Sept 30th.
Sorry but we have never demanded anything from our administration. We have gotten the results we deserve.
Oh, OK. Two NCs the last three years.
Absolutely, fans need to step up. Admin needs to listen if we/they ever do. Seems attitude is kinda like the last years of Lou.
Michigan May do whatever it takes but their current take isn’t producing too much more beyond a few wins
Their success is only a blueprint for comparable programs. We are not comparable to where Clemson was before they made the jump to the elite level. They started from a higher level.
Oh OK. Most USC fans would take his Mich record at faster than lite speed.
2 2018 Big Ten 10 3 0 .769 16.47 5.47 14 4 14 Jim Harbaugh (10-3) Peach Bowl-L
3 2017 Big Ten 8 5 0 .615 13.44 6.98 11 7 Jim Harbaugh (8-5) Outback Bowl-L
4 2016 Big Ten 10 3 0 .769 17.56 4.79 7 2 10 Jim Harbaugh (10-3) Orange Bowl-L
5 2015 Big Ten 10 3 0 .769 16.34 4.57 12
I was never crazy about hiring an SEC retread, I know that, who no one really wanted as a HC for sure. I thought even if we didn’t get the huge name, we go the Matt Campbell type route. But, even some our own fans sell the program short, and don’t think this is a top job, and probably thought we didn’t deserve the biggest name in college football at the time, like Tom Herman. I respectfully disagree, and have absolutely 0 bias when I say we are the BEST job in CFB.
1) Facilities - you can compare Boom’s and SOS’ first years until you’re blue in the face, but this isn’t even a comparison.
2) Conference money - same thing.
3) Overall brand of the program. Astronomically higher than 2004. Yes, SOS didn’t build on it like he should’ve, but neither did we. And regardless of how he left, the name recognition is all SOS. He still has more pull in his pinkie, than any other HC out there. And yes that includes Dabo and Saban.
4) Best fan support out there - always.
5) And maybe not the most positive benchmark, but coach isn’t gone if he wins 7 games.
I honestly don’t know why guys aren’t lined up down Bluff Rd. I seriously wonder if top guys are contacted, even if employed elsewhere, but don’t like the Ath Department. That’s another dead horse though. But anyway, back up the Brinks truck to the best out there. All they can say is no, but we’re already paying $4mm to stay in neutral.
1) Facilities - you can compare Boom’s and SOS’ first years until you’re blue in the face, but this isn’t even a comparison.
2) Conference money - same thing.
3) Overall brand of the program. Astronomically higher than 2004. Yes, SOS didn’t build on it like he should’ve, but neither did we. And regardless of how he left, the name recognition is all SOS. He still has more pull in his pinkie, than any other HC out there. And yes that includes Dabo and Saban.
4) Best fan support out there - always.
5) And maybe not the most positive benchmark, but coach isn’t gone if he wins 7 games.
I honestly don’t know why guys aren’t lined up down Bluff Rd. I seriously wonder if top guys are contacted, even if employed elsewhere, but don’t like the Ath Department. That’s another dead horse though. But anyway, back up the Brinks truck to the best out there. All they can say is no, but we’re already paying $4mm to stay in neutral.
But that tells you something, right?
Muschamp was not Tanner's first, second, third of probably even fourth choice.
As much as we enjoyed our 3-4 year run under Spurrier, his success is probably more of a deterrent than anything else for other coaches who would consider coming here. They look at Spurrier as one of the best college coaches of all time, a coaching genius, built UF into a formidable national power. With all that, even he couldn't get us over the hump. He only got us to one SECCG where we got soundly thumped.
If even Spurrier couldn't get us over the hump, most probably view the program as simply stuck where we are. Muschamp aside, our best bet is to luck into a head coach like Clemson did with Dabo.
If Spurrier had won a SECCG for us, I think we could have had our pick of the litter. But it didn't happen that way.
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It’s really only a 2-team race right now until it isn’t. Michigan has a pretty solid record under Harbaugh, and of course is the most recognized name in college, and the winningest, but in the what have you done for me lately world of college football, it means little. A split MNC almost 25 years ago? By using the logic of Clemmons being an almost there (even though they had a MNC, UM has several) for 25 years, the Wolverines should be winning titles too. Same with Nebraska, ND, Texas, Oklahoma, and on and on. I think if anything this proves that history means nothing, even to the bluest bloods, and that it takes a hayseed with unparalleled vision and most likely some timely support (another dead horse) to get them over the hump. After all, that’s part of the tradition too.
How does almost every single thread (including this one ) on this board become a our version of 6 Degrees of Kevin Bacon, but we insert Clemson instead
Not beating your rivals, not winning the conference, and bowl losses? Tell me what's different?
You do remember how the last HC search went, don't you? They were not "Lined Up and Down Bluff Road."
So I guess if 100 schools do exactly what Clemson has done, we will have 100 national champions next year, correct?
I remember how our ace athletic director botched it.
so then, to be a gamecock fan (if the past is unacceptable) you must accept the future. otherwise you’re more than welcome to kick rocks all the way down the road that leads to the next team you’d rather pull for.
MUSCHAMP!!! DO YOU SEE THIS!!! ^
YOU’D BETTER WIN OR YOUR ASSSS IS OUT!!!! CUZ THESE GUYS DEMAND MORE!!!!
all kidding aside, they’re just statistics. you can make stats form any opinion you want.
YOU’D BETTER WIN OR YOUR ASSSS IS OUT!!!! CUZ THESE GUYS DEMAND MORE!!!!
all kidding aside, they’re just statistics. you can make stats form any opinion you want.
Great post.
McGee would have gotten Herman or Riley or would have made Ga outbid for Kirby. This season is make or break for Will. NO EXCUSES. SS would be 8-4 or 9-3 with this schedule. This will tell if Will has it or not. I hope he shuts all his critics up, including me. So far his staffing has left something to be desired. What bugs the hell out of me is that he is so intelligent but makes some not so intelligent decisions. Had to fire Roper whom he should never have brought with him in the first place, promoting and then having to hire a hand holder for a rookie OC, not using all the allotted practices for a minor bowl BUT he and staff failed to see how important that bowl was for fans, etc. If he would employ the smarts as a HC that he did in wife shopping, USC would have won a NC.
Note:Some of the most argumentative people on earth on this site. They must have the last word. Have seen threads where two of them go on and on, ruining a thread.
I think you're point about Spurrier not winning a conference title can't be overstated. Had he climbed the mountain at SC the perception of the program would be different. I think it leaves coaches, the better ones, with the impression that they can't win big in Columbia.
Sadly, yeah. As fans, we often think other coaches should look at Spurrier's run and say "see, you can win big at SC" but I'm afraid they look at it and say "even if you're the most wildly successful you've ever been at SC, the ceiling is SEC runner-up." And, let's be honest, anyone who looks at the team realizes we kind of backed into it. How many teams with 3 conferences losses have made it to Atlanta? On top of that, SOS didn't even get SEC runner-up with his best and most talented teams at SEC. We may never stockpile talent like we had on those 2011-2013 teams, and they never made it to Atlanta. So I do think coaches look at his run and come to the conclusion that our absolute maximum ceiling is SEC runner-up.
At some point in the future we're going to have gamble on a totally unknown entity, like Clemson did with Dabo.
Clemson's run of success started at the top, our last president, Jim Barker was a Clemson graduate and wanted a top tier football team as did the previous AD, Terry Don Phillips. The Board of Trustees also had the same mindset and were willing to provide the funding and do whatever needed to be done to get there. Tommy Bowden was fired and Dabo was given a chance. Ironically, Bowden recommended Dabo for the interim job and Terry Don, saw something he liked in him and now the rest is history. Our current president, Jim Barker is another huge football fan and has given Dabo all the support he needs. I was at an IPTAY meeting last Saturday and the common theme from our speakers was that everyone at Clemson is on the same page, Administration, Board of Trustees, Athletic Dept. and programs. We were told this is not always the case at most universities.
As a life-long (66 years) Clemson fan, I have followed our program and yours closely. Clemson's Board believed in Dabo and gave him what he needed to be successful. One of the most telling things about Dabo is that when he was given the head coaching job, the Board told him they wanted him build a program that would be admired like Alabama. Dabo said to the Board that he wanted to build a program that would admired like Clemson and become the envy of other football programs and he did.
When U of SC's administration hired Tanner as the AD, I stated that was one of the biggest mistakes I've ever seen a university make. To take your winning-est baseball coach ever and move him to the AD position which he had no experience in was a terrible move. They should have hired the best AD available and paid whatever was necessary. After Terry Don Phillips retired, Clemson hired Dan Radokovich and gave him all the tools he needed to build the best athletic programs possible. We bought a jet which allowed us to travel further on recruiting trips, spend more time on the ground and less time in the air. All major football programs have a jet, but U of SC does not. Sometimes Saban will arrive at the airport and get on a helicopter, then land at the recruits practice field...that will impress a recruit!
Y'all have a new president and hopefully the snowflakes that protested him will shut up and support the man. With his military background, I would think that he might be a football fan and get behind your program. Somebody needs to make some tough decisions and the first one should be a top tier AD hire.
As a life-long (66 years) Clemson fan, I have followed our program and yours closely. Clemson's Board believed in Dabo and gave him what he needed to be successful. One of the most telling things about Dabo is that when he was given the head coaching job, the Board told him they wanted him build a program that would be admired like Alabama. Dabo said to the Board that he wanted to build a program that would admired like Clemson and become the envy of other football programs and he did.
When U of SC's administration hired Tanner as the AD, I stated that was one of the biggest mistakes I've ever seen a university make. To take your winning-est baseball coach ever and move him to the AD position which he had no experience in was a terrible move. They should have hired the best AD available and paid whatever was necessary. After Terry Don Phillips retired, Clemson hired Dan Radokovich and gave him all the tools he needed to build the best athletic programs possible. We bought a jet which allowed us to travel further on recruiting trips, spend more time on the ground and less time in the air. All major football programs have a jet, but U of SC does not. Sometimes Saban will arrive at the airport and get on a helicopter, then land at the recruits practice field...that will impress a recruit!
Y'all have a new president and hopefully the snowflakes that protested him will shut up and support the man. With his military background, I would think that he might be a football fan and get behind your program. Somebody needs to make some tough decisions and the first one should be a top tier AD hire.
Can't disagree with most of this. I don't think many here believe the promotion of Tanner to AD was a wise move. It really just didn't make any sense. Now we're kind of screwed though. He's probably the most revered of our current/former coaches b/c of the back-to-back national titles and the powerhouse baseball program he established, so firing him isn't really a possibility. Guess we can just hope he realizes he doesn't have it and graciously steps aside into some kind of ambassador role or something. That would be a great fit for him.
For all of Clemson's commitment to success, which can't be overstated, there's no accounting for luck. They got flat lucky with Dabo. Not saying they didn't do their due diligence and vet him thoroughly, but with absolutely no track record as a HC or even a coordinator, it was a real roll of the dice to promote him to HC. But, as they say, the rest is history and he's arguably the best coach in the game.
@cutiger653 Jaw dropped after reading your post. A Clemson fan having so much insight into what is wrong with our pgm and it starts at the top. He may have botched the HFBC hiring. We will know about six or eight weeks into the season. This was his most important decision and the entire fanbase wanted Herman, IMO, but we got a Fla retread. Money should have been no object in this hiring and it should have been no object in the AD hiring. I'm afraid the attitude of a lot of fans is similar to "ole Warchest" and it took a small tactical nuclear weapon to get rid of someone who should never have been hired in the first place. It may have been just laziness that led to Odom's hiring. WF fans threw a party when USC hired him away. Fla was probably scratching their heads when they saw USC was gonna hire someone who couldn't win at a FBNC school.
I hope it has dawned on this FB staff that they are under a microscope and had better perform. No more Va type effort or attitude. That bowl game with Va was not unimportant as some posters think. They seemed to reflect the attitude of the team and staff. If that Va game had been a resounding victory, fans would have a better attitude. What about the fans that made the effort to attend that game-the travel, the expense? Does that not matter?
Hope I don't see excuse makers crying about the schedule anymore. It should be seen as a challenge not an obstacle.
I hope it has dawned on this FB staff that they are under a microscope and had better perform. No more Va type effort or attitude. That bowl game with Va was not unimportant as some posters think. They seemed to reflect the attitude of the team and staff. If that Va game had been a resounding victory, fans would have a better attitude. What about the fans that made the effort to attend that game-the travel, the expense? Does that not matter?
Hope I don't see excuse makers crying about the schedule anymore. It should be seen as a challenge not an obstacle.
We've got to stop with the Herman stuff. It doesn't matter that the fans wanted him. HE DID NOT WANT TO COME HERE. The whole world knew he was waiting out Strong's tenure at UT. It was the worst kept secret in sports. Hypothetically, even if he had come here, he'd have been gone after a year and we'd have been right back where we started.
I believe Ray got the best person he could. Herman simply didn't want to come. UGA made the move to get Smart so we couldn't get him (and he'd have been gone for UGA as soon as that job opened up anyway). Champ was, at best, Tanner's 3rd choice, but likely his 4th or 5th.
We simply weren't an attractive job at the time.
Agreed, our board of trustees is just politicians, lawyers, and judges trying to advance their political status in the good ole boys club. Politics has ruined us over the years. I agree with Tanner assessment. We are up the creek and it is a cultural thing.
All of this is true. Herman was never coming here. It is message board fantasy.
Anybody and I mean anybody can be had for the right amt of money including Herman. Don't think Ray even upped the ante when Houston matched USC's offer. Houston!! A somewhat 3rd rate school in a 3rd rate conference. If Herman was made to be happy at USC, he would have stayed.
And, yet, you don't know whether he did or not. So just an allegation without proof. Houston had already indicated they would match whatever salary any other school offered....including Texas (which they did). And then there was Texas....his dream school......just sitting there with a dead-man walking as it's HC. Don't be surprised that Houston could match anyone until you look at the money they have available to them.
Finishing ranked in the top 10 for 3 consecutive seasons is not getting over the hump?
