Welp, now that the season is over I guess I can talk about old Final Four Frank. Yep, just...

Discussion in 'Fighting Gamecocks Forum' started by jsusc, Mar 12, 2018.

  1. psmith5532

    psmith5532 Active Member
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    One could argue that SC going to the Final 4 last year hurt Frank more then help. Now the expectations of the fan base is to at least make it to the dance every year...when in reality this program makes it about once every 6 to 7 years. Look at our baseball program...it WS or bust with fan base.
     
    41 psmith5532, Mar 12, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2018
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  2. Spurlier

    Spurlier Active Member
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    Wow, it's funny how stupid some of you people are. Next season when we have almost our whole team back plus Felder, Bowen and Couisnard and with a whole year of conditioning and training, I'm going to be smiling thinking back to what you shortsighted dumbasses were saying. Frankly I'm with Frank, the best coach we've ever had and one of the top coaches in the country today.
     
  3. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow Member
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    Maybe we just need to realize that our program is going to have some ups-and-downs. We aren't Duke, Kentucky, or UNC...we won't be able to just reload with 5-star talent every year.
    Was I happy with the overall result this season? No. But I had a feeling that something like this could happen; we just didn't have enough talent this year to expect much better.
    And yeah, that's Frank's fault. He has to recruit better and more consistently. But I'm hoping to see a much stronger class signed in 2019 and MAYBE that will start a series of even stronger recruiting classes.
    If not..if Frank keeps finishing a few games above .500 and missing the post-season...I'd imagine Ray will be forced to make a move.
     
  4. The Carolinian

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    Not exactly, but what’s your point?
     
  5. The Carolinian

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    I hope you’re right. Everybody does. But just curious. Were you equally confident this far into the tenures of Brad, Horn and the last baseball coach?
     
  6. jsusc

    jsusc Member
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    Ya'll keep talking about our bball history and how FFF has done more than anyone else we've had. So? He's still not a good coach. Just because he's better than the other bad coaches we've had doesn't' mean he should have a free pass at mediocrity for eternity here. But ya'll are so desperate that you'll cling to a ratty life preserver when, if you'll just swim 20 or 30 feet, you can climb into a safe, dry boat.
     
  7. rogue cock

    rogue cock Well-Known Member
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    Bowen? Keeping my fingers crossed...but after the latest disclosures, it's not looking too promising.
     
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  8. jsusc

    jsusc Member
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    And make fun of me and others that want Marshall all you want, but all of you people or at least 95% of you would trade FFF for Marshall straight up in a heartbeat, and you're not being honest if you say otherwise.
     
  9. rogue cock

    rogue cock Well-Known Member
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    That ship (Marshall) has sailed I'm afraid. At least that's my understanding.
     
  10. jsusc

    jsusc Member
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    Yeah, I've heard people say that too, and I hate it if it's true, but you may be right.
     
  11. 92Pony

    92Pony Well-Known Member
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    I am hopeful that the recently-hired Chuck Martin will pay dividends in that area.
     
  12. jsusc

    jsusc Member
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    She's hot. Admit it.
     
  13. HI Cock

    HI Cock Well-Known Member
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    This is way better than playing a few basketball games in mid-late March.
    [​IMG]
     
  14. drawplay000

    drawplay000 Member
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    But but but. We went to the final four lol btw. Your post is dead on
     
  15. drawplay000

    drawplay000 Member
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    I just want to know one thing. Not three. How many times has Martin taken sc to the big dance?? Exactly
     
  16. drawplay000

    drawplay000 Member
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    Hahahahahahaha.
     
  17. jonesz21

    jonesz21 Well-Known Member
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    Pics or it didn’t happen
     
  18. funktavious

    funktavious Well-Known Member
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    I seem to recall him saying that we would have a losing record and only win 3 or 4 conference games. He was wrong but just because we didn't make it into the postseason he thinks he is some kind of genius.
     
  19. funktavious

    funktavious Well-Known Member
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    I don't want to just make it to the dance. I'd like to win once we get there and right now, Frank Martin is tied for 1st in NCAA tournament wins at USC. Frank McGuire who was the greatest basketball coach to ever coach at USC only had 4 tournament wins over his entire career at USC. In just his 5th season, Frank tied him. This season was a step back but with the majority of the team coming back and hopefully better pg play next season we should be right back in the thick of things. As bad as the situation was this season we still finished with a winning record. If the worst he will do from here on out is finish above .500 that's not so bad as long as it's not a trend. I say we win at least 20 games next season.
     
  20. Athenscock1

    Athenscock1 Well-Known Member
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    We went through a lot of years in the basketball wilderness when this years record would have been gladly accepted.
     
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  21. rogue cock

    rogue cock Well-Known Member
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    Not really. Can't remember a time in our basketball history where a .500 record would be "acceptable."
     
    61 rogue cock, Mar 13, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2018
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  22. UofARooster

    UofARooster Well-Known Member
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    This post is ridiculous.
     
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  23. UofARooster

    UofARooster Well-Known Member
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    And those years the fans had a loser mentality. Just, No.
     
  24. UofARooster

    UofARooster Well-Known Member
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    Couisnard is a 3 star true freshman. Bowen will never suit up for Carolina. It's going to be worse than you think.

    I love Frank to death, he's an amazing all around human being and his wife is just as sweet as she could be, but OP is right. We really screwed the pooch with Marshall, TWICE.
     
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  25. UofARooster

    UofARooster Well-Known Member
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    We can't we be UNC, Kentucky, or Duke? The women's team just won a national title and reload with talent every year. I don't want to hear that excuse. Excuses are for losers.
     
  26. _NOVA_

    _NOVA_ Active Member
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    Two things Martin said this year that pretty much sum up why he’s such a divisive figure.

    1. “I’m not playing zone. I don’t care if we lose. I’m not playing zone...”

    He went on to talk about courage and bad technique. What was clear is that the guys didn’t have the athletic talent to play his defense scheme, and this comes off like a public shaming to embarrass. As the season went on, he played more zone. Probably not enough.

    2. Reported: Martin said during the last two practices they didn’t work on offense.

    What? Your team is terrible on offense. They’ve been a bad offensive team for the entire time you’ve coached here. Solution? Don’t practice offense at all. Brilliant.
     
    66 _NOVA_, Mar 13, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2018
  27. rogue cock

    rogue cock Well-Known Member
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    Well, there goes any comparisons to Coach Knight.
     
  28. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow Member
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    Right now, no...we can't be UNC, Kentucky, or Duke. It will take time, work, success, and some luck to get to that point. If you think stating that we aren't in a position to go out and reload every year with All-Americans is just an excuse then I don't know what else to tell you.
     
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  29. UofARooster

    UofARooster Well-Known Member
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    So how did Dawn Staley do it with a perennial cellar dweller? She can sell a program, there is no reason why we can't find a coach that can do the same in men's basketball.

    You don't need years of building in basketball. 2-3 of the right players come aboard and you can compete for a national title.

    I love Frank and have stated it multiple times. He's our coach NOW and I support the hell out of him. But one tourney appearance every 5 years is not going to cut it. He's also stubborn as crap when it comes to recruiting.
     
  30. Athenscock1

    Athenscock1 Well-Known Member
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    I never saw a fan suit up to play a game. The players on the court were the culprits. Their play did not warrant fan support. Few coaches in that period were simply not capable of recruiting players good enough to win big. Martin has raised the excitement level. You got anybody in mind you would guarantee would have done better?
     
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  31. South Cack

    South Cack Member
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    How so? Do you know his recruiting model? Does he not make offers to the best players in the State and surrounding states?
     
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  32. wallycock

    wallycock Well-Known Member
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    Give me the name of the safe dry boat (coach) you think we’re going to get.
     
  33. 92Pony

    92Pony Well-Known Member
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    I believe he's referring to Marshall. The Marshall loons are out in full force since we didn't follow up our FF run with a national championship; Because, you know, we're a perennial power now and should never lose another game, and wouldn't if Greg Marshall were here.
     
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  34. UofARooster

    UofARooster Well-Known Member
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    Basically, he said he doesn't go after many McDonald All-Americans because he doesn't want a program full one and dones. His system takes an entire collegiate career to develop so he only wants to recruit 'his' type of players. That's why he brings in so many projects. He simply looks at big time recruits as a waste of time. Yes, he is trying to bring in Bowen, but he's not trying to fill a team out with one and dones like National Championship winning coach Calipari does.
     
  35. UofARooster

    UofARooster Well-Known Member
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    It all starts with the fanbase. Accepting mediocrity is a trickle down effect.
     
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  36. jsusc

    jsusc Member
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    We are not a perennial power, and never will be under FFF. We will be what we have been with him....a team that will make the tourney maybe every six or seven years. Ya'll better keep them Final Fluke t-shirts ya'll loaded up on in good shape, because 4 years from now when mediocre Martin has led this program to one tourney appearance in ten seasons those memories are all you will have.
     
  37. The Carolinian

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    Not quite a fair comparison. Back then, far fewer teams went to the tourney. We were in the ACC. Only the ACC tournament champion was invited. One year, we went undefeated in the ACC during the season and made it to the championship game (in Greensboro as usual) and lost to NC State in double overtime when Roche played with a severely sprained ankle. It's subjective, to be sure, but I'll take McGuire over Martin any day.
     
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  38. jsusc

    jsusc Member
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    Well, clearly, I prefer Marshall, but a Quija board could do a better job than FFF.
     
  39. funktavious

    funktavious Well-Known Member
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    Actually it can take years to build in men's basketball and you can't compare it to women's bball. They're not nearly on the same level but I will say we were very fortunate to get Dawn Staley. As for men's basketball, we are in the middle of the ACC recruiting territory and it's very difficult to convince young men to come to South Carolina. Just look at how many players we have missed out on just in the Columbia area and it's always been that way. They would rather play for the UNCs of the world. A lot of it has to do with perception and USC is perceived as an inferior school when it comes to basketball. It will take a good stretch of success before we can begin to recruit on that level. The culture around the program has to change and that can't be changed overnight.
     
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  40. jsusc

    jsusc Member
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    Your memory fails you. I said we would have a losing SEC record and likely have a barely winning record but not make the tourney. I don't claim to be some kind of genius, and I don't have to be to see what we will get with FFF. Six seasons here and five of them are bad or boring. Trust the coaches though, right?
     

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