Can someone explain how Kirby Smart would be a better HC hire than Will Muschamp or Kevin Steele. All are Saban disciples , former DCs, and perceived as up and coming stars in cfb coaching circles at one time. Steele was a huge failure as HC of Baylor and Muschamp despite one great year at Florida was canned last year. Smart seems to me to be of the same mold. What makes Kirby different ?
Kirby Smart Fans
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He's different because he's a different human being. We have no clue how he will perform until he gets the job (if he gets the job).
Valid point to bring up....I think out of the top 3 guys swirling around only Fuentes has really shown the ability to make to build a program as a HC.
Hermann seems to be on his way to doing that but still is in year 1. Everyone thought Muschamp was great after year 1 too, right???
I think Muschamp was really close to having a bad season #1 of his tenure but I also think he wasn't terribly far off from having a pretty solid tenure there had he just been able to get some consistency on offense. Nothing they tried seem to work and while that does fall back on the HC I would still think Muschamp has the ability to be a good HC at some point.
Hermann seems to be on his way to doing that but still is in year 1. Everyone thought Muschamp was great after year 1 too, right???
I think Muschamp was really close to having a bad season #1 of his tenure but I also think he wasn't terribly far off from having a pretty solid tenure there had he just been able to get some consistency on offense. Nothing they tried seem to work and while that does fall back on the HC I would still think Muschamp has the ability to be a good HC at some point.
Let's say that Smart is hired, I think Tanner needs to have a say so on hiring an OC. We need to spend heavy on an OC and let the OC hire his offensive staff.
Muschamp only mistake was he didn't hire the right OC. Recruiting and defense was good.
Steele was basically forced out by Saban to be replaced by Smart. Muschamp never made the effort in recruiting at Florida that he needed to, and his biggest screw up was hiring Charlie Weiss.
I believe that Smart would probably opt for a HUNH system here, but OC will easily be the biggest decision that Smart would have to make.
Also, I don't see how being DC under Saban should somehow disqualify Smart as a HC candidate just because of what Muschamp did at UF. That's just crazy.
Not saying it should disqualify him, just trying to understand the fascination with him. Given what we know about saban's past DCs it definately shouldn't qualify him
No candidate has a proven record of what he can do at Carolina. At this point it is all pure speculation. There are reasons to wonder with every candidate we mention. "Can this one recruit well enough to compete in the SEC?", "Can this one handle being a head coach since he's never done it?", "Can this one ....". Yes, we should be cautious, but if we nit pick every detail of every coach then we will not have any candidates left. There is no 'perfect hire' for USC or our entire fan base. I think it's fine to discuss and debate these issues. That's what forums like this are for. But at the end of the day we're going to hire someone who many of you will not care for. I only suggest supporting him fully while giving that person adequate time to hire his staff, run his system, and recruit his players before you publicly spew your toxicity to the rest of the fan base, players, parents of players, and recruits, all of which read these forums.
All about risk. So what if we pass on Smart and UGA hires him in two years and becomes the new Bama? Fuente has built the Memphis program in a bad conference and knows the HUNH offense from his TCU days. Do we know for sure the HUNH can be effective in the SEC over the course of a season? What if he makes a bad hire on defense? I prefer a defensive minded coach. I'm sorry but Smart should not be compared to Brad Scott or even Muschamp. As stated, Muschamps failures are not connected to Smart and should not disqualify him for the job.
I simply asked what makes him different. What, other than being Saban's dc, him the right man for the job ? If it was already a done deal yes it may be considered "toxic" to attempt to undermine his hiring with questions like that. I'll support whomever RT decides is the best man for the job even if it's KS. I just hope he hires the right man.
This is the reason we don't hire ANY of the three.... can you say Ron Zook?
History shows you don't replace Spurrier with a defensive coordinator and history dictates future performance.
I can hear it now everyone screaming for KS to fire his OC. Good lawd shades of Spark Plug Woods.
History shows you don't replace Spurrier with a defensive coordinator and history dictates future performance.
I can hear it now everyone screaming for KS to fire his OC. Good lawd shades of Spark Plug Woods.
Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that your question was toxic. I responded here after reading the board for about 30 minutes today, and a lot over the past week. I just meant that when a decision is finally made, I hope our debates on the effectiveness or qualifications can be stifled a little.
I don't have an answer on what makes him different or not. But on the other hand people could spew off numerous coaches that have been assistants or coordinators for countless other legendary coaches for taking the leap into head coaching and then becoming successful. I do not think there are too many strong issues that make him avoidable, though. Is there a reason his name gets brought up in every major program's coaching search? There has to be something that makes him attractive to consider. What makes him different is simply that his name is not Muschamp or Steele. He's a different person, with a different personality, and different family, and different passions. That could all equate to a completely different outcome as those mentioned above, or it could equate to the exact same outcome. There is absolutely no way for us to know.
Tanner has a job that I do not envy. He'll earn his pay on this search.
Found it pretty telling that Ray Tanner highlighted Carolina being a "destination" school when asked about coaching changes during the Vandy game. Clearly he's not willing to hire someone who may ultimately use us as a stepping stone. First person I thought of on a stepping stone type list was Smart. Anyone else see it that way?
I can't say whether Smart would be a better hire than WM or Steele. But I understand why people would think he would be. Simply put, he's the guy behind door number three. His track doesn't have the dings of WM at Florida and Steele at Clemson. Smart's record is linear at Bama and pretty much good to great. So he gets the benefit of the doubt that the other two do not.
History says we should hire an offensive minded coach? I know Spurrier brought us success but our offenses never set the world on fire. The years we had our most success was with a great qb that made things happen but also a great defense.
Here are some other nick saban deciples
jimbo fisher- offensive coordinator for Saban during his LSU days
Mark dantonio- was sabans defensive assistant/coordinator while Saban was the head coach at Michigan State
Jim Mccalweain- Sabans offensive coordinator at Alabama
Look I can do it too.
jimbo fisher- offensive coordinator for Saban during his LSU days
Mark dantonio- was sabans defensive assistant/coordinator while Saban was the head coach at Michigan State
Jim Mccalweain- Sabans offensive coordinator at Alabama
Look I can do it too.
Now there's some good info. I'd thought about jimbo and mcalwean but they are both offensive minded guys. Didn't realize dantonio was DC under Saban at msu. He has definately made a name for himself and gives hope if Smart is hired at USC
You dont say!?!
Goes both ways I see.
Bottom line is a successful tenure as long as Smart has had under Saban counts for something in my book....does it make him the best candidate??? I dont know
But is that a bad thing? I'd prefer he brought in someone who is high profile and sports a Hurry Up, No Huddle offense...legit DC head coach with a dangerous high scoring offense? Yes Plz...
I agree Muscjsmp isnt the answer, but funny people forget he did have an 11-1 regular season at Florida. Better than USC ever has done and went to a bigger bowl than we ever have. I know 1 of 4 years doesn't get it, but still the facts.
That is a disaster waiting to happen. Kiffen is way too schizophrenic when it comes to his offensive approach. He's a pro-style WCO guy at heart who has been dabbling in spread concepts. Dilettante is the word that most comes to mind when describing him. We need someone who has a proven level of expertise in the spread. I've heard Spavital thrown around but honestly, it will probably be someone way off the radar like Morris was for Clemmons coming out of Tulsa.
Really. By who? You? I don't see an opinion just a random crap talk. So which is, you think Brad was a great hire? Or that Kirby is the brains behind the Bama D?
This would be the best case scenario although I don't know that Tanner himself would know the best OC to hire. We would be rolling the dice either way if we bring in a defensive minded guy.
Yes, by me and many others, including professionals in the business who actually think about these types of scenarios, who are not repeating ridiculous drivel from a bunch of message board blowhards. Brad was a terrible hire in hindsight. Two totally different people from different eras. Just because one failed many years ago doesn't mean the next offensive or defensive coordinator won't succeed as a head coach here or anywhere else. One does not equal the other. Come on, use your noggin.
Some coordinators are quite successful moving to big head coaching jobs: Bob Stoops, Mark Richt, Jimbo Fisher and Charlie Strong at Louisville come to mind. Some aren't. And, considering that Kevin Steele had no Saban connection until AFTER he was Baylor's head coach, why are you bringing him into the mix?
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Kevin Steele was a huge failure as a DC after he left Saban and Alabama . My point was , why should Smart be any different . Your answer " some coordinators are quite successful after moving to big HC jobs " sure was insightful . Thanks
Well, Kirby Smart is being mentioned as a possibility. The other two, I haven't even heard of them as candidates. I'd want Chad Morris, who, rumor has it, has let it be known he's interested, before Kevin Steele.
At least your comparison makes more sense than the dummies who try to compare him to Brad Scott- WTF? Still, you cannot say ____ was a coordinator or ____ worked under Saban and it didn't work out, so Smart won't work out either. Guess who else was also a Defensive assistant/ DC before becoming a HC... IT's ok I can wait... Cue Jeopardy music...
Bee-beep
NICK SABAN is the answer we were going for! So, how does it make sense to say other DCs/ OCs didn't make good HCs, so Smart won't either...? By that reasoning, would it not make more sense to say "Nick Saban was a DC and turned into one of the most successful HCs in modern college football, and Smart has been called "Saban Jr" by people close to him becuase he has a similar work ethic and recruiting ability, so he might be the next super star of the coaching world!" Or might it make sense to say "Urban Meyer went from being a POSITION COACH (WRs) to Head Coach and is now sitting on a fist full of NC rings, so a COORDINATOR like Smart is a shoe in the successful"? No you say? Why not?
BECAUSE EVERY PERSON IS DIFFERENT! What Saban or Steele or Meyer or DABO or Scott... Did has ZERO IMPACT on the future performance of Kirby Smart as a HC. ZERO. So, could you all please just STOP!?
The facts are Smart is a proven commodity as one of the best defensive minds in the game, a relentless ULTRA-SUCCESSFUL recruiter who is young, energetic charismatic and viewed by everyone who knows him as being "ready" to take the next step. We can pass and watch him take some other team to new heights or we can give him a shot to do it here. Nobody knows how successful he will be, but injecting a bit of the "what works at Bama" into our program could be what we need to erase a century of mediocrity. Or maybe he won't be successful... But there is only one way to find out.
Yes! By that logic, no one can ever advance from the coordinator position to HC.
How exactly was your comment- basically "some DCs didn't make good HCs" any MORE insightful exactly? I will give you a hint- it WASN'T.
Exactly... By the reasoning of some of our posters, nobody outside of the guys who currently hold HC positions should ever coach's FB team. Boy... In about 15-20 years as those guys retire, I guess we will just have to stop playing FB because there will be no HCs left once these guys retire and die off! Sad... I kinda like this game!
Completely agree - Fuente also has no roots in this area of the country and is not thought of as good of a recruiter as either Smart or Herman ...Memphis is on a nice run but their defense is brutal - currently ranked 104th out of 127 teams...A very pedestrian Cincinnati Bearcat team had over 750 yards of offensive against them this year and could have easily won the game without several silly turnovers. Bowling Green had 600yds in their 3pt loss..Not to mention, the SEC has a reputation for adapting to prolific offenses in pretty quick fashion. Just ask Gus Malzahn.
Mr. Sims wrote: "There is no 'perfect hire' for USC ... "
Yes, there is. Tom Herman.
Yes, there is. Tom Herman.
