Lawsuit targets NCAA transfer rule

[DeeDave]

Challenging NCAA rule that clamps down on a 2nd transfer.

the NCAA rule on transfers is “an illegal restraint on college athletes’ ability to sell their image and likeness and control their education.”

The DOJ said attorneys general from the states of Minnesota, Mississippi, Virginia, and the District of Columbia have also signed on to the suit.

Dept. of Justice, 3 more states and District of Columbia join lawsuit against NCAA transfer rules

The Department of Justice, three more states and the District of Columbia have joined a lawsuit against the NCAA’s transfer eligibility rule.

apnews.com

 

[Ward Jr]

Explain when it became a right to play college sports?

An organization has the right to have rules for said organization.

If you want to play, you abide by those rules.

The DOJ is currently a captured joke and everyone knows it.

 

[cockofdawn]

Explain when it became a right to play college sports?

An organization has the right to have rules for said organization.

If you want to play, you abide by those rules.

The DOJ is currently a captured joke and everyone knows it.

100%

 

[DeeDave]

Explain when it became a right to play college sports?

An organization has the right to have rules for said organization.

If you want to play, you abide by those rules.

The DOJ is currently a captured joke and everyone knows it.

Go argue with the judge, not me. You make up too many flat out lies.

To correct you, the DOJ joined the already filed lawsuit. It was originally filed by seven state attorney generals - both Conservatives and Liberals.

This is not a surprise- and should not be one to anyone paying attention.

it should also be celebrated by those that believe that the free market should apply.

The ruling from the federal judge in December paused the rule.

U.S. District Court Judge John Preston Bailey granted a temporary restraining order against the NCAA, barring the association from enforcing a rule barring student-athletes who have transferred multiple times to play immediately at their current school.

Bailey wrote that the transfer rule “is the exact kind of unreasonable restraint of trade within labor markets that the relevant antitrust laws prohibit" and that the plaintiffs “have a strong likelihood of success.”

A bipartisan coalition of seven state attorneys general, including Ohio Attorney General Dave Yost and West Virginia Attorney General Patrick Morrisey, filed suit against the NCAA, claiming the NCAA transfer rules violate antitrust laws. Morrisey said the transfer rules deprive athletes of “the chance to pursue the athletic and educational opportunities of their choice,” including name, image and likeness agreements.

 

[Ward Jr]

Go argue with the judge, not me. You make up too many flat out lies.

To correct you, the DOJ joined the already filed lawsuit. It was originally filed by seven state attorney generals - both Conservatives and Liberals.

This is not a surprise- and should not be one to anyone paying attention.

it should also be celebrated by those that believe that the free market should apply.

The ruling from the federal judge in December paused the rule.

U.S. District Court Judge John Preston Bailey granted a temporary restraining order against the NCAA, barring the association from enforcing a rule barring student-athletes who have transferred multiple times to play immediately at their current school.

Bailey wrote that the transfer rule “is the exact kind of unreasonable restraint of trade within labor markets that the relevant antitrust laws prohibit" and that the plaintiffs “have a strong likelihood of success.”

A bipartisan coalition of seven state attorneys general, including Ohio Attorney General Dave Yost and West Virginia Attorney General Patrick Morrisey, filed suit against the NCAA, claiming the NCAA transfer rules violate antitrust laws. Morrisey said the transfer rules deprive athletes of “the chance to pursue the athletic and educational opportunities of their choice,” including name, image and likeness agreements.

Please explain what I've lied about in my post above? Just because you copy and paste excerpts of an article that any of us can read doesn't make it more sound or legit.

 

[DeeDave]

Please explain what I've lied about in my post above? Just because you copy and paste excerpts of an article that any of us can read doesn't make it more sound or legit.

The judge doesn't worry about your opinion of the law or case. LOL

Now, get back to your whining about it.

The DOJ has joined the following states in the lawsuit

Ohio
North Carolina
West Virginia
Colorado
Illinois
New York
Tennessee
District of Columbia
Minnesota
Mississippi
Virginia

“There is strength in numbers,” said Ohio attorney general Dave Yost

 

[Ward Jr]

The judge doesn't worry about your opinion of the law or case. LOL

Now, back to your whining about it.


The DOJ has joined the following states in the lawsuit

Ohio
North Carolina
West Virginia
Colorado
Illinois
New York
Tennessee
District of Columbia
Minnesota
Mississippi
Virginia

Do you need me to cross check all of the corrupt clowns seeking attention who are in favor?

Speaking of clowns seeking attention -- We all understand you are revealing in the destruction of college football (or any semblance of a level playing field) even though you are committed to "never giving a dime" to the actual cause.

 

[adcoop]

You guys do know that Judege Cavanaugh and Judge Coney Barrett (Trump appointees) were two votes that opened the door for NIL? You are way off if you are blaming the current state of College Football on liberals, the DOJ, or Joe Biden.

 

[Ward Jr]

You guys do know that Judege Cavanaugh and Judge Coney Barrett (Trump appointees) were two votes that opened the door for NIL? You are way off if you are blaming the current state of College Football on liberals, the DOJ, or Joe Biden.

Not really a party thing anymore. It's the Uniparty now. There are fools on both sides.

Do you believe the NIL and open portal as it stands today are promoting equity or are good for the game?

Do you believe our government should be strong-arming the NCAA and Universities to allow players to be able to treat football teams like a timeshare?

 

[adcoop]

Not really a party thing anymore. It's the Uniparty now. There are fools on both sides.

Do you believe the NIL and open portal as it stands today are promoting equity or are good for the game?

Do you believe our government should be strong-arming the NCAA and Universities to allow players to be able to treat football teams like a timeshare?

Yes, if it was an illegal system in the first place. No one should support something illegal because it was comfortable for your enjoyment or promoted some form of roster stability. The US Supreme Court has never been able to unanimously agree on anything. Here, they agreed that the previous system of college athletics was an illegal form of restriction on a student-athlete’s educational and financial opportunities. If you disagree, you can get a law degree and argue your point to our courts.

 

[Ward Jr]

Yes, if it was an illegal system in the first place. No one should support something illegal because it was comfortable for your enjoyment or promoted some form of roster stability. The US Supreme Court has never been able to unanimously agree on anything. Here, they agreed that the previous system of college athletics was an illegal form of restriction on a student-athlete’s educational and financial opportunities. If you disagree, you can get a law degree and argue your point to our courts.

How was it illegal? The players were receiving compensation for their efforts before any of this came about via school and housing. They were probably receiving more even then that those who worked part time during school. No one was forcing their hand to go work/play for a school.

I'm not saying they don't receive some level of compensation and insurance benefits. But this current system is ridiculous and everyone knows it. Even the professional (NFL) structure would be a huge step towards equity among schools as well as athletes.

And if you do agree with the current system - why wouldn't we apply it to other professions too? Why wouldn't high school athletes be paid their "free market" value?

 

[adcoop]

How was it illegal? The players were receiving compensation for their efforts before any of this came about via school and housing. They were probably receiving more even then that those who worked part time during school. No one was forcing their hand to go work/play for a school.

I'm not saying they don't receive some level of compensation and insurance benefits. But this current system is ridiculous and everyone knows it. Even the professional (NFL) structure would be a huge step towards equity among schools as well as athletes.

And if you do agree with the current system - why wouldn't we apply it to other professions too? Why wouldn't high school athletes be paid their "free market" value?

I am not here to argue with you. Just saying that if you have a unanimous Supreme Court, you have to respect it, read and understand the legal opinion, and come up with a new system that falls within those legal parameters. We don’t get to ignore the legal opinions we don’t like.

 

[uscwatson21]

How was it illegal? The players were receiving compensation for their efforts before any of this came about via school and housing. They were probably receiving more even then that those who worked part time during school. No one was forcing their hand to go work/play for a school.

Imagine if your manager at Hardee's refused to let you quit and take a job at McDonalds...

 

[Ward Jr]

I am not here to argue with you. Just saying that if you have a unanimous Supreme Court, you have to respect it, read and understand the legal opinion, and come up with a new system that falls within those legal parameters. We don’t get to ignore the legal opinions we don’t like.

Justice Brett Kavanaugh and Barrett's decisions where actually not directly tied to the current system, but it opened a back door to the current system which I'm not sure they anticipated.

"In the context of the National Collegiate Athletic Association v. Alston case, Justice Brett Kavanaugh's concurring opinion touched on non-cash education-related benefits for student athletes. He criticized the NCAA's restrictions on these benefits, which include things like scholarships, computers, and internships, as being potentially exploitative and in violation of antitrust laws. Kavanaugh's remarks suggested that the NCAA's policies on such benefits could face further legal challenges under antitrust principles."

 

[Ward Jr]

Imagine if your manager at Hardee's refused to let you quit and take a job at McDonalds...

Why would they refuse to let you quit?

There are non-competes signed each and every day as a basis for employment. And this isn't even that. They're simply stating there's a waiting period.

 

[uscwatson21]

Why would they refuse to let you quit?

There are non-competes signed each and every day as a basis for employment. And this isn't even that. They're simply stating there's a waiting period.

Ignoring that college football players aren't employees to explain the analogy, but there is no legitimate business interest that would be protected by a non-compete clause for student-athletes.

Non-compete clauses are largely unenforceable because of the restraint on trade. For them to be enforceable there needs to be a legitimate business interest that would be lost by you going to McDonalds. And while the Frisco breakfast sandwich is hands down the best breakfast sandwich, there is nothing that would really be lost by you going to work at McDonalds just because you know how to make one.

 

[adcoop]

Why would they refuse to let you quit?

There are non-competes signed each and every day as a basis for employment. And this isn't even that. They're simply stating there's a waiting period.

Let me put it like this. I had Academic Scholarships throughout my seven years of college. Nothing restricted me from selling items that were mine for money. Nothing restricted alumni from giving me financial gifts. Nothing restricted an Alumnus from giving me a job. Most importantly, nothing restricted me from starting my own business (YouTube, etc.) and making a secondary stream of income. So, the court’s decision makes a whole lot of sense IMO.

 

[stu1cocks]

I don't really care much about the specifics. One thing you can rest assured of is the rich will get richer and we a'int rich.

 

[Ward Jr]

Ignoring that college football players aren't employees to explain the analogy, but there is no legitimate business interest that would be protected by a non-compete clause for student-athletes.

Non-compete clauses are largely unenforceable because of the restraint on trade. For them to be enforceable there needs to be a legitimate business interest that would be lost by you going to McDonalds. And while the Frisco breakfast sandwich is hands down the best breakfast sandwich, there is nothing that would really be lost by you going to work at McDonalds just because you know how to make one.

Ha. I do like that analogy but noncompete are enforced all of the time. Student-athletes don't have a traditional contract but rather the NLI. My point is that if you're going to have paying being paid to play football for any given team, that team the NLI situation is no longer that. It's a flipping contract just like any other contract and it should be subject to the same rules and regulations of traditional employment.

 

[Ward Jr]

Let me put it like this. I had Academic Scholarships throughout my seven years of college. Nothing restricted me from selling items that were mine for money. Nothing restricted alumni from giving me financial gifts. Nothing restricted an Alumnus from giving me a job. Most importantly, nothing restricted me from starting my own business (YouTube, etc.) and making a secondary stream of income. So, the court’s decision makes a whole lot of sense IMO.

Good point. My point is that we're going the wrong direction. If a player doesn't want a corporation or school to use their name, they should be able to opt out of that. Otherwise, college football is totally screwed.

I realize it still has alot of interest today, but this isn't going to end well and we all know it. No one wants to watch the best team money can buy. I don't think the NFL would even survive on this model over the longer term. Americans are more bored than ever, but I'd like to believe they still have a tipping point of sensibility.

 

[uscwatson21]

Ha. I do like that analogy but noncompete are enforced all of the time. Student-athletes don't have a traditional contract but rather the NLI. My point is that if you're going to have paying being paid to play football for any given team, that team the NLI situation is no longer that. It's a flipping contract just like any other contract and it should be subject to the same rules and regulations of traditional employment.

The ones that are enforced involve legitimate business interests.

Also, why would any student athlete ever sign with a school that wanted to to sign a non-compete clause?

 

[Ward Jr]

The ones that are enforced involve legitimate business interests.

Also, why would any student athlete ever sign with a school that wanted to to sign a non-compete clause?

If you start paying players millions a year, it's now a business.

They aren't signing a traditional non-compete. They simply have to wait a year before they play if they are going to jump around all over the place. At some point, you have to protect the integrity of the vehicle that is making everyone money.

 

[uscwatson21]

If you start paying players millions a year, it's now a business.

They aren't signing a traditional non-compete. They simply have to wait a year before they play if they are going to jump around all over the place. At some point, you have to protect the integrity of the vehicle that is making everyone money.

This type of reasoning doesn't work in the legal field. You can't just ignore what you're saying is that all colleges should collude to restrict trade...

 

[Ward Jr]

This type of reasoning doesn't work in the legal field. You can't just ignore what you're saying is that all colleges should collude to restrict trade...

You redefine the role. Do you believe players receiving millions of dollars a year to play football for any particular team should not be looked at as an employee?

 

[uscwatson21]

You redefine the role. Do you not believe players receiving millions of dollars a year to play football for any particular team should not be looked at as an employee?

The solution is to actually make them employees and get an anti-trust exception from congress. So you're right in that is the solution.

But that solution doesn't work without Congress giving an anti-trust exemption just like the NFL and other sports have.

 

[Ward Jr]

The solution is to actually make them employees and get an anti-trust exception from congress. So you're right in that is the solution.

But that solution doesn't work without Congress giving an anti-trust exemption just like the NFL and other sports have.

Exactly. Instead, they continue to move the wrong direction.

I did my undergrad work at Pepperdine and helped create an invention that has made well over $100mil for the school. I didn't receive a dime. School is school and it should remain just that. If you want to go and test the "free agent" market, there's a professional outlet for that.

 

[Pageland Gamecock]

Best solution to all this BS, cut out sports completely and let these entitled characters go to school for its purpose because it's becoming a shit show, if I'm not good enough and don't want to work hard and improve myself, I should be able to transfer at free will until I get to a school where I'm the best at my position and can start

 

[Ward Jr]

Best solution to all this BS, cut out sports completely and let these entitled characters go to school for its purpose because it's becoming a shit show, if I'm not good enough and don't want to work hard and improve myself, I should be able to transfer at free will until I get to a school where I'm the best at my position and can start

It's certainly headed that direction right now. The only thing holding that movement up is fan participation. Today's America might be too bored to look away.

 

[stu1cocks]

I did my part, I watched exactly zero minutes of NCAA football this year. I plan to watch less next year.

 

[uscwatson21]

Exactly. Instead, they continue to move the wrong direction.

I did my undergrad work at Pepperdine and helped create an invention that has made well over $100mil for the school. I didn't receive a dime. School is school and it should remain just that. If you want to go and test the "free agent" market, there's a professional outlet for that.

The issue is college sports are literally every single sport and attached to universities so it's a much more complex problem to solve because of it.

 

[adcoop]

It's certainly headed that direction right now. The only thing holding that movement up is fan participation. Today's America might be too bored to look away.

I don’t get all the complaining and hand wringing. In fact, I do. Most of you guys are fine with the free market playing out in almost every walk of life. However, because you think you fall at a competitive disadvantage due to a lack of resources, you want a governing body to maintain concessions so you can compete. Sounds like you want an Affirmative Action system for sports. College Athletics will be fine. Just needs time to adjust to a new reality of doing things. That’s what makes all this complaining and talk of doom hilarious to me.

 

[adcoop]

Best solution to all this BS, cut out sports completely and let these entitled characters go to school for its purpose because it's becoming a shit show, if I'm not good enough and don't want to work hard and improve myself, I should be able to transfer at free will until I get to a school where I'm the best at my position and can start

So you want to take your ball and go home because some 18-24 year olds made some money. So as long as the players don’t have any money and you can feel superior to them, you like football. SMH.🤦‍♂️

 

[uscwatson21]

I don’t get all the complaining and hand wringing. In fact, I do. Most of you guys are fine with the free market playing out in almost every walk of life. However, because you think you fall at a competitive disadvantage due to a lack of resources, you want a governing body to maintain concessions so you can compete. Sounds like you want an Affirmative Action system for sports. College Athletics will be fine. Just needs time to adjust to a new reality of doing things. That’s what makes all this complaining and talk of doom hilarious to me.

The problem is you're wrong. Most of us know the free market system doesn't truly work. This current setup isn't sustainable. Not even the NFL could survive the existing framework for CFB right now.

So the old system wasn't "right" but that doesn't change the fact those of us who loved CFB can't be sad about it changing from what we knew.

 

[adcoop]

The problem is you're wrong. Most of us know the free market system doesn't truly work. This current setup isn't sustainable. Not even the NFL could survive the existing framework for CFB right now.

So the old system wasn't "right" but that doesn't change the fact those of us who loved CFB can't be sad about it changing from what we knew.

Not saying the current system is right. However, with your logical approach to this, it makes me think you are a lawyer. if you are, what do we tell clients all the time. We may want to work with the other side to settle this. Otherwise, the courts are going to settle it and no one will probably like the outcome. That is what we have in this current enviroment. However, all parties (Institutions, Players, fans) are still looking at each other as adversaries. If this all falls apart, we all lose. Yes the college game may fall, but you lose everything that took decades to build because parties don’t want to do the hard work to create a system that works for everyone. The world is not going to end if college kids make money to play a sport. The question should be how far are we willing to go and what the contractual obligations the players should have moving forward.

 

[DeeDave]

I did my part, I watched exactly zero minutes of NCAA football this year. I plan to watch less next year.

You posted plenty in football season talking about college football. Seems odd you didn't watch any of it but posted about it.

 

[DeeDave]

You guys do know that Judege Cavanaugh and Judge Coney Barrett (Trump appointees) were two votes that opened the door for NIL? You are way off if you are blaming the current state of College Football on liberals, the DOJ, or Joe Biden.

ahh - come on

You know those Liberal Attorney Generals in Tennessee and Mississippi are....

sorry- I can't even type that out without laughing.

Ward just makes up lies about anything he doesn't like.

 

[adcoop]

You posted plenty in football season talking about college football. Seems odd you didn't watch any of it but posted about it.

It’s like all those Black people that were never going to watch the NFL anymore because Kaepernick didn’t get a job. LOL. People and their boycotts.

 

[DeeDave]

This type of reasoning doesn't work in the legal field. You can't just ignore what you're saying is that all colleges should collude to restrict trade...

Ward just makes up stuff. It's funny to read though.

College football isn't there to make Ward happy.

The players should be able to earn what they can in the market and they shouldn't be held hostage to a school if they want to go to another.

The free market isn't always fair to everyone. Never has been.

You are either for it- or you aren't. Only hypocrites are for it when they get the benefit.

 

[DeeDave]

It’s like all those Black people that were never going to watch the NFL anymore because Kaepernick didn’t get a job. LOL. People and their boycotts.

No doubt.

I stopped by a restaurant to see a friend this evening for a few minutes. Place was absolutely packed with people watching the Bills-Chiefs game. Couldn't even hear yourself talk in there it was so loud and packed. I ended up leaving after a few mins.

I wonder how many in there have told people they'll never watch another NFL game..... LOL

 

[DeeDave]

The solution is to actually make them employees and get an anti-trust exception from congress. So you're right in that is the solution.

But that solution doesn't work without Congress giving an anti-trust exemption just like the NFL and other sports have.

No reason for them to be employees. That won't happen. No real incentive for that.

The players- the talent- should be able to transfer as they see fit, and make money off their names, etc.

That's the free market. No reason why adults in college shouldn't be able to participate in the open free market.