State of SC basketball recruiting question

[CCUIrmo]

This is about the state of South Carolina high school players and recruiting. Why is it that so many wat to go out of state so badly? We were just final 4 2 years ago and Clemson was Sweet 16 last year and both schools worked hard to maintain strong programs through in state recruiting, especially with the talent we have had the last 2 years in state. However, neither really got any of them and other than Zion, none really went to traditional power programs. They went places like Tenn, Vandy, and Georgetown to name a few. Granted Tenn is good this year but have not been known for basketball in a long time if ever on the mens side.
So why cant eith school keep basketball talent in state? Does it have to do with AAU pushing elsewhere? Both coaches, regardless of how fan bases feel right now, are really good coaches and seem very well respected. 2 different styles as well so why is it so hard to get in state players at either school?

 

[mikey888]

Tradition, proximity to blue bloods (duke & unc), aau culture, support/resources from athletic departments.

 

[uscnoklahoma2]

The FBI delivered enough information to the NCAA to shut down several programs for good. Did anything happen? Will anything hapoen? Did we take notice and start writing checks? Nope. There's your answer. Its your answer for football as well. We barely play off the field while other teams go all in off the field. Until that changes we will be mid to lower level.

 

[lawcalcock]

Frank needs to trash the holier than thou nonsense and cheat like the blue bloods do. You cannot compete at the highest level of college basketball without using brokers to buy ball players. Anyone that tells you different needs an enema. Within 10 years WBB will be the same.

 

[Bongsummers]

Frank needs to trash the holier than thou nonsense and cheat like the blue bloods do. You cannot compete at the highest level of college basketball without using brokers to buy ball players. Anyone that tells you different needs an enema. Within 10 years WBB will be the same.

Yeah, it took the FBI investigation to expose what everyone but the NCAA already knew - money is everywhere in college basketball. Except at Tennessee. I'm sure there's nothing shady going on in Knoxville.

 

[Jon Snow]

It starts with tradition. Neither we nor Clemson have placed much importance on basketball over the previous 30-40 years. We don't have a rabid fan base, we don't have a history of sending players to the NBA, and we don't seem to have any "ins" with the AAU coaches and uncles who play a prominent role in recruiting.

 

[lawcalcock]

It starts with tradition. Neither we nor Clemson have placed much importance on basketball over the previous 30-40 years. We don't have a rabid fan base, we don't have a history of sending players to the NBA, and we don't seem to have any "ins" with the AAU coaches and uncles who play a prominent role in recruiting.

Before our time Clemons bought enough players to compete for the ACC. UNC and Duke sent the NCAA to slap them down bigtime. That can't happen anymore. Other schools have seen the blue bloods bully the NCAA. If you have the will, you can buy players with very little damage to your program.

 

[psmith5532]

It starts with tradition. Neither we nor Clemson have placed much importance on basketball over the previous 30-40 years. We don't have a rabid fan base, we don't have a history of sending players to the NBA, and we don't seem to have any "ins" with the AAU coaches and uncles who play a prominent role in recruiting.

I beg to differ...With the success of the women's teams I was hoping it would help the Men's team. Our fan base has proven that if you put a good product on the court the fans will come...which explains the attendance of the Women's games. I see some good in this team just not consistent at this point. They seem to play at the level of their opponent. Will be interesting to see the results of Tuesdays game with Tenn. Help is coming...but damn you got to keep Silva on the court!!

 

[Cocky4SC]

I beg to differ...With the success of the women's teams I was hoping it would help the Men's team. Our fan base has proven that if you put a good product on the court the fans will come...which explains the attendance of the Women's games. I see some good in this team just not consistent at this point. They seem to play at the level of their opponent. Will be interesting to see the results of Tuesdays game with Tenn. Help is coming...but damn you got to keep Silva on the court!!

Being dead serious when I ask this... Maybe I missed something, but what help is coming that will be the game changer for us next year? Tre Hannibal will be a great player for us at guard, but we have no depth in the post and with Silva and Kotsar graduating, don't see much of a post presence...

 

[king ward]

It starts with tradition....

Every tradition started with the right coach in the right place at the right time. And even the greatest traditions flounder when they stop doing what tradition demands.

 

[silverspur4life]

I dislike Nike but it seems to be all the rage right now with kids. I prefer UA. I think this is having a huge impact on our recruiting period. I also wonder how long UA will stay in the game. They are pulling out of MLB because of the money it was losing.

 

[CCUIrmo]

I understand about the "blue bloods" and all but other than Zion and Woods, the more recent players are going Tenn and Vandy. I really dont see Vandy "Cheating" to get players. It just seems the players look at both the schools and then in the end pick a random school. Heck, even the number 2 player in state picked Boston College, there is less basketball tradition there than either in state school. Other than when Barnes and Fogler were recruiting for the 2 state schools, it seems we hardly get any to come here. If final four and sweet 16 dont change that, what will. I for one am not for cheating becasue we are the type of school that as soon as we do it, we get caught and NCAA decides to be strong and bold then and throw the hammer down on us while others get away with it.

 

[Jon Snow]

I beg to differ...With the success of the women's teams I was hoping it would help the Men's team. Our fan base has proven that if you put a good product on the court the fans will come...which explains the attendance of the Women's games. I see some good in this team just not consistent at this point. They seem to play at the level of their opponent. Will be interesting to see the results of Tuesdays game with Tenn. Help is coming...but damn you got to keep Silva on the court!!

We do have a decent-enough fan base that fans will show up when we have a good team. But, basketball is not that important to most of our base. (it is my favorite sport, but lets face it...most prefer football) Our biggest problem has been the lack of a consistent product on the court. Going back to the 1989-90 season (my freshman year at USC)...George Felton had 1 competitive team, Steve Newton's teams were awful, Eddie Fogler had 3 good teams, Dave Odom never finished above .500 in conference, Darrin Horne had one solid team, and so far Frank has had 2. So, over 29 seasons we've had 7 decent seasons. Honestly, why would a player with every option available to them think about coming here unless this is home?
Yes, Dawn has built a great following for women's basketball. Women's basketball isn't nearly as pricey to attend as the men's however. I work with people who have bought season tickets for years. They tell me it costs $70-$110 per season. I can't (won't) research to verify that, but regardless, women's sports tickets cost a fraction of men's.

 

[aj&uscgrad]

One game earlier this season the announcers were talking about the trial and stated that Frank had said that if at the end of all of that if some people still had their jobs with no consequences then he was going to leave the profession. Surprised I haven't heard this discussed more locally by Cline or Carey Rich.

 

[psmith5532]

Being dead serious when I ask this... Maybe I missed something, but what help is coming that will be the game changer for us next year? Tre Hannibal will be a great player for us at guard, but we have no depth in the post and with Silva and Kotsar graduating, don't see much of a post presence...

From what I hear is that the players coming in can actually shoot, and I Love Silva but with him fouling out of games on a regular basis (or foul trouble) he hurts the team more then help. I blame the refs more than Silva because the only game they let him play was the Auburn game and we saw what happened there. But it is what it is...they won't let him pay so we will see him more on the bench than on the floor. USC needs 30 mins out of him to compete for the most part

 

[Gradstudent]

Would the correct answer be we try and play the game ethically and dont pay the $$$ and Clemson spends all their $$$ on football, and thus doesn't pay the $$$ in basketball.

You can say that school Vandy would not cheat but Im skeptical Bryce Drew got their and all the sudden started recruiting phenomenally, reminds me of Miss in football. You never know when a coach will even use some of his salary to get these players, take a shave at the beginning get the ball rolling and higher salary contract extensions later.

Drew has already signed six of Vanderbilt's 22 highest-rated signees in the 2000s,

 

[rogue cock]

The FBI delivered enough information to the NCAA to shut down several programs for good. Did anything happen? Will anything hapoen? Did we take notice and start writing checks? Nope. There's your answer. Its your answer for football as well. We barely play off the field while other teams go all in off the field. Until that changes we will be mid to lower level.

Has the FBI turned that information over to the NCAA? I'm not sure the investigation is complete...and the FBI will not turn any information over until it has completed it's investigation. The information that has been printed in the media has all come from indictments filed with the courts, which is public information. To the best of my knowledge, no other information has been released...unless it was to clear a particular player from criminal wrongdoing. The NCAA can do nothing until they have access to the information....but thanks to a new rule they can use the information uncovered by the FBI...previously they could not.

 

[king ward]

From what I hear is that the players coming in can actually shoot, and I Love Silva but with him fouling out of games on a regular basis (or foul trouble) he hurts the team more then help. I blame the refs more than Silva because the only game they let him play was the Auburn game and we saw what happened there. But it is what it is...they won't let him pay so we will see him more on the bench than on the floor. USC needs 30 mins out of him to compete for the most part

I blame Silza. He is the constant. Lots of different people officiate our games.

 

[rogue cock]

I blame Silza. He is the constant. Lots of different people officiate our games.

Doesn't move his feet well at times....and commits stupid reaching fouls to make up for it....which will ALWAYS be called.

 

[92Pony]

I blame Silza. He is the constant. Lots of different people officiate our games.

Doesn't move his feet well at times....and commits stupid reaching fouls to make up for it....which will ALWAYS be called.

I dunno if I place it all on him. He isn't without some fault, but what about his play in the FF run where we were sans SEC officials? Seems that he played relatively foul-free ball throughout IIRC.

 

[rogue cock]

I dunno if I place it all on him. He isn't without some fault, but what about his play in the FF run where we were sans SEC officials? Seems that he played relatively foul-free ball throughout IIRC.

Don't know....players play well one day, don't the next. But he is consistently called more often than not by a variety of referees....that indicates it's more what he does than what they do. He does reach a lot....and that's the easiest call for a referee to make and they always call it.

 

[aj&uscgrad]

Our defense leaves Silva having to defend the rim alot. We pressure the ball constantly and too many times our guards are driven by and Silva and Kotsar have to leave their men, take a charge, a 50/50 call at bes,t or try to block the shot.

 

[king ward]

I dunno if I place it all on him. He isn't without some fault, but what about his play in the FF run where we were sans SEC officials? Seems that he played relatively foul-free ball throughout IIRC.

Complete coincidence.

 

[Cocky4SC]

Our defense leaves Silva having to defend the rim alot. We pressure the ball constantly and too many times our guards are driven by and Silva and Kotsar have to leave their men, take a charge, a 50/50 call at bes,t or try to block the shot.

Our defensive philosophy amazes me... we on ball gaurd almost from half court and get beat off the dribble most of the time, leaving the bigs (Kotsar and Silva) to try to recover for the guards not moving their feet... Frank's style of defense has not worked well for most of the year, a few games (MSU, Michigan, and Auburn) we played solid defense and executed FM gameplan... most of the year... not so much...

 

[midline]

My goodness. I do love it when everyone not doing so good immediately turns to the excuse of "everybody else is cheating". Like their school is the only shining light of integrity. It's a cop out excuse. Is the game played off the court? Of course. Mostly with the shoe companies. My point is either play the game, or be satisfied with what you get. Anyone that thinks that the true "student-athlete" still exists at the Power 5 level is terribly niave.

 

[Bleadgandb3334]

Being dead serious when I ask this... Maybe I missed something, but what help is coming that will be the game changer for us next year? Tre Hannibal will be a great player for us at guard, but we have no depth in the post and with Silva and Kotsar graduating, don't see much of a post presence...

Kotsar will be back next year, but I get ur point.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Our defense leaves Silva having to defend the rim alot. We pressure the ball constantly and too many times our guards are driven by and Silva and Kotsar have to leave their men, take a charge, a 50/50 call at bes,t or try to block the shot.

I am a basketball coach. It’s clear you know basketball. Martin wants constant ball pressure. If your guys on the wing get beat, it puts your post players in tough situations. Martin does a great job teaching post defense, but guarding near the rim in Division 1 basketball is a tough job to do.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Our defensive philosophy amazes me... we on ball gaurd almost from half court and get beat off the dribble most of the time, leaving the bigs (Kotsar and Silva) to try to recover for the guards not moving their feet... Frank's style of defense has not worked well for most of the year, a few games (MSU, Michigan, and Auburn) we played solid defense and executed FM gameplan... most of the year... not so much...

I would like to see us defend from a few steps outside of the 3 point line on in and forget the ball pressure at half court.

We did a lot of 1-2-2 pressure last game. Did not like us playing zone against a weak team on the road. Sometimes we lack identity on defense.

 

[aj&uscgrad]

I would just like to back off the on ball pressure sometimes. Once they get by our guards it takes the rest of the defense to play perfectly, if not, lots of easy baskets like at LSU. It leads to lots fouls, whether it be hand checks out front,, fouls when we end up with a poor matchup, and fouls at the rim by our bigs as the last line. If we didn't give up all those free throws at OKSU we win the game.

 

[king ward]

I would just like to back off the on ball pressure sometimes. Once they get by our guards it takes the rest of the defense to play perfectly, if not, lots of easy baskets like at LSU. It leads to lots fouls, whether it be hand checks out front,, fouls when we end up with a poor matchup, and fouls at the rim by our bigs as the last line. If we didn't give up all those free throws at OKSU we win the game.

We need to go all zone, all the time.

 

[Garnet chicken]

Being dead serious when I ask this... Maybe I missed something, but what help is coming that will be the game changer for us next year? Tre Hannibal will be a great player for us at guard, but we have no depth in the post and with Silva and Kotsar graduating, don't see much of a post presence...

Kotsar is not graduating. He is a Junior.

 

[Freddie.B.Cocky]

Yeah, it took the FBI investigation to expose what everyone but the NCAA already knew - money is everywhere in college basketball. Except at Tennessee. I'm sure there's nothing shady going on in Knoxville.

Oh I can guarantee you there is nothing shady going on in Knoxville. Right!

 

[Freddie.B.Cocky]

The FBI delivered enough information to the NCAA to shut down several programs for good. Did anything happen? Will anything hapoen? Did we take notice and start writing checks? Nope. There's your answer. Its your answer for football as well. We barely play off the field while other teams go all in off the field. Until that changes we will be mid to lower level.

Isn't Bruce Pearl at Auburn being investigated by the FBI? Why would a school even have someone being investigated by the FBI on their staff in any capacity?

 

[FORKCOCK]

Frank needs to trash the holier than thou nonsense and cheat like the blue bloods do. You cannot compete at the highest level of college basketball without using brokers to buy ball players. Anyone that tells you different needs an enema. Within 10 years WBB will be the same.

Bingo. Basketball is filthy. Want to be good? You better not be afraid to get dirty. You have to roll around and kiss the asses of those scumbag AAU coaches that have their hands out at every turn.

 

[Baltcock96]

This is about the state of South Carolina high school players and recruiting. Why is it that so many wat to go out of state so badly? We were just final 4 2 years ago and Clemson was Sweet 16 last year and both schools worked hard to maintain strong programs through in state recruiting, especially with the talent we have had the last 2 years in state. However, neither really got any of them and other than Zion, none really went to traditional power programs. They went places like Tenn, Vandy, and Georgetown to name a few. Granted Tenn is good this year but have not been known for basketball in a long time if ever on the mens side.
So why cant eith school keep basketball talent in state? Does it have to do with AAU pushing elsewhere? Both coaches, regardless of how fan bases feel right now, are really good coaches and seem very well respected. 2 different styles as well so why is it so hard to get in state players at either school?

Unlike football, basketball really begins in 8th grade before high school. Especially bluechip recruits. We are a decent to good basketball program in conference with only 1 year in and out heavy weight.

One and done do not want to play for Frank. They want to showcase their talents. Frank places a premium on defense and the NBA offense.

 

[coolcock2001]

Idk. Luckily we get good talent from out of state too