coaches with 11 straight top 25 classes...

[the-iceman]

In the SEC:

It's a short list: Richt, Miles and Spurrier

Teams with 11 straight top 25 classes in the SEC, also a short list: lsu, bama, uga, fla, auburn, and...you guessed it, us.

Where do we rank in average recruiting in the SEC over that same last 11 years (incl. tamu and Mizzou): 7th which is the top half, behind only bama, fla, lsu, uga, auburn and tenn. which means we have, on average, out recruited over the past 11 years tamu, ark, ole miss, miss st, Mizzou and of course ky and Vandy

Flame away, change the subject, respond negatively, etc. but these are facts as best as my math skills can determine based on rivals rankings from this site . And yes, I understand some of those numbers are middle of the pack in the conference and in our division, but it ain't Rome burning.

I am thrilled we have coach spurrier and I'm thankful because it's highly doubtful ANY other AVAILABLE coach could have matched that kind of success and consistency.

Obviously disappointed in a lot of what happened last season and this season so far. But I choose to think positive. So I see the good we have accomplished and hope for more of those good things in our future. Thanks again Coach. Been a fan my whole life, 47 years next month, and the last 11 are the best stretch ever in my life. Even if it flames out, I'm thankful. But I've got faith that coach hasn't given up and neither have I, so in the meantime, GO COCKS!!!!!!!

 

[Laziness]

You do realize that puts us 4th in our own division? Going to be hard to win the SEC finishing 7th out of 14th on average, or is that no longer our goal?

What Spurrier has done has been remarkable. And all Gamecock fans are thankful for what he has done. But he was the one who told us not to cheer for the team for just competing, as the fans did when we came up short against #2 Auburn. He told us to expect more, not to cheer for almost doing well, but to expect to win. Why are so many of our fans going back to the old line of thinking?

 

[atlanta cock#]

How do we stack up as far as commitments actually making it into school and panning out? At the end of the day this is what matters, right? That's the difference. There was a time when the Latts and Clowneys made it into school and contributed. Not so much lately. Bad luck or bad evals?

 

[the-iceman]

You do realize that puts us 4th in our own division? Going to be hard to win the SEC finishing 7th out of 14th on average, or is that no longer our goal?

Perhaps you missed this in my post:

And yes, I understand some of those numbers are middle of the pack in the conferenceand in our division, but it ain't Rome burning.

 

[the-iceman]

He told us to expect more, not to cheer for almost doing well, but to expect to win. Why are so many of our fans going back to the old line of thinking?[/QUOTE]

And this: "Obviously disappointed..."

 

[the-iceman]

Bad luck or bad evals?[/QUOTE]

Or maybe neither. If you can find stats on how we've fared in that department as compared to all the other SEC schools, would love to see if that's bare speculation or if most other schools have the same issues at a similar frequency.

 

[the-iceman]

What I've compiled is straight facts.

It's also a fact we did poorly on a lot of fronts last year and we are struggling again so far this year. I don't argue those facts.

I don't see how you can argue the facts I've compiled either. As the man says, they are what they are.

 

[superflyby]

In the SEC:

It's a short list: Richt, Miles and Spurrier

Teams with 11 straight top 25 classes in the SEC, also a short list: lsu, bama, uga, fla, auburn, and...you guessed it, us.

Where do we rank in average recruiting in the SEC over that same last 11 years (incl. tamu and Mizzou): 7th which is the top half, behind only bama, fla, lsu, uga, auburn and tenn. which means we have, on average, out recruited over the past 11 years tamu, ark, ole miss, miss st, Mizzou and of course ky and Vandy

Flame away, change the subject, respond negatively, etc. but these are facts as best as my math skills can determine based on rivals rankings from this site . And yes, I understand some of those numbers are middle of the pack in the conference and in our division, but it ain't Rome burning.

I am thrilled we have coach spurrier and I'm thankful because it's highly doubtful ANY other AVAILABLE coach could have matched that kind of success and consistency.

Obviously disappointed in a lot of what happened last season and this season so far. But I choose to think positive. So I see the good we have accomplished and hope for more of those good things in our future. Thanks again Coach. Been a fan my whole life, 47 years next month, and the last 11 are the best stretch ever in my life. Even if it flames out, I'm thankful. But I've got faith that coach hasn't given up and neither have I, so in the meantime, GO COCKS!!!!!!!

That worked when we had a staff that could work with these kids....make them better....make adjustments....teach strength and conditioning.....we are fresh out of those coaches that could parlay these recruits into SEC players. Next....

 

[world famous 3rd base hecklers]

In the SEC:

It's a short list: Richt, Miles and Spurrier

Teams with 11 straight top 25 classes in the SEC, also a short list: lsu, bama, uga, fla, auburn, and...you guessed it, us.

Where do we rank in average recruiting in the SEC over that same last 11 years (incl. tamu and Mizzou): 7th which is the top half, behind only bama, fla, lsu, uga, auburn and tenn. which means we have, on average, out recruited over the past 11 years tamu, ark, ole miss, miss st, Mizzou and of course ky and Vandy

Flame away, change the subject, respond negatively, etc. but these are facts as best as my math skills can determine based on rivals rankings from this site . And yes, I understand some of those numbers are middle of the pack in the conference and in our division, but it ain't Rome burning.

I am thrilled we have coach spurrier and I'm thankful because it's highly doubtful ANY other AVAILABLE coach could have matched that kind of success and consistency.

Obviously disappointed in a lot of what happened last season and this season so far. But I choose to think positive. So I see the good we have accomplished and hope for more of those good things in our future. Thanks again Coach. Been a fan my whole life, 47 years next month, and the last 11 are the best stretch ever in my life. Even if it flames out, I'm thankful. But I've got faith that coach hasn't given up and neither have I, so in the meantime, GO COCKS!!!!!!!

Les Miles' over all Record (Shade your eyes on Oklahoma State time and 2008 & 2014)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Les_Miles

Mark Richt's over all Record (Shade your eyes on 2001 and 2009, 2010 & 2013)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Richt

Steve Spurrier's over all Record

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Spurrier

And those same coaches had their bumps in the road as well...

 

[hopefultiger13]

I've looked at your recruiting classes and they seem OK. As is pointed out above, the shelf is not empty.

It would be interesting to see how many of your recruits (especially the high level ones) actually get into to school and contribute. I don't do much more that follow USC recruiting from a surface level. I used to follow a bit more closely and vaguely recall a guy that got counted for 3 recruiting class (and ultimately never played).

Anyway, USC seems to take 30 guys every year. Even if no one redshirts, that's 120 guys on the team at once. If everyone redshirts, its 150. So the real number is somewhere in between. Let's split it in half and call it 135 guys that have been offered schollys at any given time. Of course 85 is the limit. That's a HUGE difference of 50 guys. Of course there's guys that don't make it into school, there's attrition once they do, and of course guys transfer when they realize that they aren't going to see the field.

Realize that this isn't making fun of your recruiting process. It is what it is. But when you are looking at what's wrong, some in depth analysis may be in order. I'd love to see numbers over the last decade or so (SS's tenure there) on guys offered vs guys that make the 2-deep with a concentration on the high end guys (ranking in HS).

This can do a couple of things for you:

Are your coaches offering guys that aren't making it into school for academic reasons? Prep school is always an option for a talented guy or two, but if there's significant numbers going this route (and it takes them a year to get in, not just a semester) then you are counting them twice. Sure, it's fun to count stars and beat your chest about recruiting class rankings, but this can be misleading as your recruiting rankings show you got 2 4-star guys where the reality is you only have one. Not a big deal if this is a single player now and again, but if this happens often, it can seriously inflate the value of your recruiting classes. Of course guys that don't get in at all (Jr College) absolutely kill you.

Are your coaches missing on evaluations (star chasing)? Stars aren't everything. Personally, I'd rather get a 3 star guy with Bama/Auburn/Ohio State offers rather than a 4-star guy with NC State, Penn State, and Wisconson offers. This is what happened to Miami IMHO in the early 2000s. They were offering guys w/o even seeing them in person. It's a sign of lazy recruiting and can happen when coaches aren't able to put in the time for that evaluation.

Are your coaches recruiting to their system? Again, you are asking players to do certain things based on scheme. A really high level player and look really bad when asked to do things that are out of their skill set. IE, a 320lb roadgrader of an OG with lot's of SEC offers could be a terrible choice for a team that's going to ask him to pull around the end and kick out a DE/OLB/ or Safety. You need a smaller, faster guy in this case). That guy will look great for the recruiting rankings, but may never even play a down.

I'd be interested to see the results if someone wanted to take a look... I'm not interested enough to do it myself.

 

[DarkHorse2001]

The ratings were for signing day, not for actually being enrolled. We sign players every year who never make it to the playing field. We had six guys in the 2014 class who never made it in. Six in one class is nearly 25% of the entire class. We also seem to have a high number of guys leave the program early for various reasons. If recruiting was rated after the guys were in the program a couple of years (and thats when it really matters) we would not be in the top 25, perhaps not in the top 35 nationally. Spurrier is a fantastic coach, but he and his staff have not done a good job recruiting. No coach can take talent level at the lower half of the SEC conference, and expect to compete for a conference title.

 

[CockaDude-a-Dude]

I've looked at your recruiting classes and they seem OK. As is pointed out above, the shelf is not empty.

It would be interesting to see how many of your recruits (especially the high level ones) actually get into to school and contribute. I don't do much more that follow USC recruiting from a surface level. I used to follow a bit more closely and vaguely recall a guy that got counted for 3 recruiting class (and ultimately never played).

Anyway, USC seems to take 30 guys every year. Even if no one redshirts, that's 120 guys on the team at once. If everyone redshirts, its 150. So the real number is somewhere in between. Let's split it in half and call it 135 guys that have been offered schollys at any given time. Of course 85 is the limit. That's a HUGE difference of 50 guys. Of course there's guys that don't make it into school, there's attrition once they do, and of course guys transfer when they realize that they aren't going to see the field.

Realize that this isn't making fun of your recruiting process. It is what it is. But when you are looking at what's wrong, some in depth analysis may be in order. I'd love to see numbers over the last decade or so (SS's tenure there) on guys offered vs guys that make the 2-deep with a concentration on the high end guys (ranking in HS).

This can do a couple of things for you:

Are your coaches offering guys that aren't making it into school for academic reasons? Prep school is always an option for a talented guy or two, but if there's significant numbers going this route (and it takes them a year to get in, not just a semester) then you are counting them twice. Sure, it's fun to count stars and beat your chest about recruiting class rankings, but this can be misleading as your recruiting rankings show you got 2 4-star guys where the reality is you only have one. Not a big deal if this is a single player now and again, but if this happens often, it can seriously inflate the value of your recruiting classes. Of course guys that don't get in at all (Jr College) absolutely kill you.

Are your coaches missing on evaluations (star chasing)? Stars aren't everything. Personally, I'd rather get a 3 star guy with Bama/Auburn/Ohio State offers rather than a 4-star guy with NC State, Penn State, and Wisconson offers. This is what happened to Miami IMHO in the early 2000s. They were offering guys w/o even seeing them in person. It's a sign of lazy recruiting and can happen when coaches aren't able to put in the time for that evaluation.

Are your coaches recruiting to their system? Again, you are asking players to do certain things based on scheme. A really high level player and look really bad when asked to do things that are out of their skill set. IE, a 320lb roadgrader of an OG with lot's of SEC offers could be a terrible choice for a team that's going to ask him to pull around the end and kick out a DE/OLB/ or Safety. You need a smaller, faster guy in this case). That guy will look great for the recruiting rankings, but may never even play a down.

I'd be interested to see the results if someone wanted to take a look... I'm not interested enough to do it myself.

Not exactly true. Your math is already flawed since we don't take (30) guys a year. The average is closer to (25) guys a year..

The heavy classes are typically with guys that did not qualify the year before. Since 2010, we've signed over (30) once and approached it once.

2010-signed (23)
2011-signed (32)
2012-signed (25)
2013-signed (21)
2014-signed (21)
2015-signed (29)-at least (3) of those guys were guys who didn't make it in on 2014

 

[spinrbait]

Not exactly true. Your math is already flawed since we don't take (30) guys a year. The average is closer to (25) guys a year..

The heavy classes are typically with guys that did not qualify the year before. Since 2010, we've signed over (30) once and approached it once.

2010-signed (23)
2011-signed (32)
2012-signed (25)
2013-signed (21)
2014-signed (21)
2015-signed (29)-at least (3) of those guys were guys who didn't make it in on 2014

clemson numbers are alot like obama numbers. it doesn't matter if they are true or not. just how they make you feel

 

[The tigerdoc]

Recruiting rankings are very subjective and factors that influences rankings are the size and enthusiasm of the fan base. Since all the recruiting services are interested in making money, there is a tendency to over estimate the recruits that sign with high profile programs. Many SEC teams fall into that category as well as teams such as Clemson and Notre Dame as well as many others. If you look at recruiting rankings vs FBS final rankings you will see a disconnect. If those rankings panned out, the SEC would have 4-5 teams in the final top ten and 8 teams or so in the top 25. That does not happen, and the entire reason can't logically be because those teams beat each other up. FSU is much more talented than BC, but BC will beat up your team to a greater degree. The rankings below will validate what I'm saying regarding the # of SEC teams in each category. A& M and Missou included.
Top 10 recruiting. Top 25 recruiting Final FBS top 10. Final top 25
2014 7 10 2 5
2013 5 10 4 7
2012 3 8 5 7
2011 4 9 4 5
2010 5 10 3 8
2009 4 11 2 4
2008 3 8 2 5
2007 4 8
2006 4 8
2005 3 9

It appears that the SEC overall is not as good as rankings suggest, except for the big boys like Bama. Other teams, such as SC have been recently over valued, especially after your recent success. With SOS coming off a string of really excellent years on the field, the analysts may have given SC recruits the benefit of the doubt based on the track record of Spurrier. I know that personally I did the same thing, so I really can't criticize the rivals guys.

 

[usaguy40]

I've looked at your recruiting classes and they seem OK. As is pointed out above, the shelf is not empty.

It would be interesting to see how many of your recruits (especially the high level ones) actually get into to school and contribute. I don't do much more that follow USC recruiting from a surface level. I used to follow a bit more closely and vaguely recall a guy that got counted for 3 recruiting class (and ultimately never played).

Anyway, USC seems to take 30 guys every year. Even if no one redshirts, that's 120 guys on the team at once. If everyone redshirts, its 150. So the real number is somewhere in between. Let's split it in half and call it 135 guys that have been offered schollys at any given time. Of course 85 is the limit. That's a HUGE difference of 50 guys. Of course there's guys that don't make it into school, there's attrition once they do, and of course guys transfer when they realize that they aren't going to see the field.

Realize that this isn't making fun of your recruiting process. It is what it is. But when you are looking at what's wrong, some in depth analysis may be in order. I'd love to see numbers over the last decade or so (SS's tenure there) on guys offered vs guys that make the 2-deep with a concentration on the high end guys (ranking in HS).

This can do a couple of things for you:

Are your coaches offering guys that aren't making it into school for academic reasons? Prep school is always an option for a talented guy or two, but if there's significant numbers going this route (and it takes them a year to get in, not just a semester) then you are counting them twice. Sure, it's fun to count stars and beat your chest about recruiting class rankings, but this can be misleading as your recruiting rankings show you got 2 4-star guys where the reality is you only have one. Not a big deal if this is a single player now and again, but if this happens often, it can seriously inflate the value of your recruiting classes. Of course guys that don't get in at all (Jr College) absolutely kill you.

Are your coaches missing on evaluations (star chasing)? Stars aren't everything. Personally, I'd rather get a 3 star guy with Bama/Auburn/Ohio State offers rather than a 4-star guy with NC State, Penn State, and Wisconson offers. This is what happened to Miami IMHO in the early 2000s. They were offering guys w/o even seeing them in person. It's a sign of lazy recruiting and can happen when coaches aren't able to put in the time for that evaluation.

Are your coaches recruiting to their system? Again, you are asking players to do certain things based on scheme. A really high level player and look really bad when asked to do things that are out of their skill set. IE, a 320lb roadgrader of an OG with lot's of SEC offers could be a terrible choice for a team that's going to ask him to pull around the end and kick out a DE/OLB/ or Safety. You need a smaller, faster guy in this case). That guy will look great for the recruiting rankings, but may never even play a down.

I'd be interested to see the results if someone wanted to take a look... I'm not interested enough to do it myself.

geez hopefultiger, do you have the cliffnotes version

 

[The tigerdoc]

Sorry, but I'm doing this on an iPhone. The post doesn't look like I typed it now I've viewed it. I'm not suggesting that SC has no talent. SC has some excellent players and Nunez looks like the immediate future at QB. He is an outstanding athlete and I think he will a pro WR. I think that will be his position at SC once McIlwain gets on campus. There are some good but young OL & DL on campus as well. Moore is a dynamite LB and Holliman looked good today. I'm just suggesting that maybe SC recruiting has been over rated for the reasons I mentioned above. You could clearly say the same about CU, and in fact it has been said many times. There are good young players at SC, but for a couple of years it appears that recruiting was not as good as it was rated. Not trying to be negative, because I think the best players ar SC are young. The future looks brighter than this year.

 

[Bongsummers]

Thanks elevating the discourse per usual, spinirbait. Derp.

As for the the original post: The most important stat is your record. Come give us a breakdown of that at the end of the season.

 

[RockThrillCock]

I think we have one star coaches. When Fitzgerald left we took a huge hit. He was a five-star and we have Richard Simmons covering for him. You can make a case or even lie with statistics. Fact of the matter is we do not improve our players once they get out of high school. Shell should have been a top 10 pick. We may have to start bending the rules to be competive. I swear half our team sits down to pee.

In the SEC:

It's a short list: Richt, Miles and Spurrier

Teams with 11 straight top 25 classes in the SEC, also a short list: lsu, bama, uga, fla, auburn, and...you guessed it, us.

Where do we rank in average recruiting in the SEC over that same last 11 years (incl. tamu and Mizzou): 7th which is the top half, behind only bama, fla, lsu, uga, auburn and tenn. which means we have, on average, out recruited over the past 11 years tamu, ark, ole miss, miss st, Mizzou and of course ky and Vandy

Flame away, change the subject, respond negatively, etc. but these are facts as best as my math skills can determine based on rivals rankings from this site . And yes, I understand some of those numbers are middle of the pack in the conference and in our division, but it ain't Rome burning.

I am thrilled we have coach spurrier and I'm thankful because it's highly doubtful ANY other AVAILABLE coach could have matched that kind of success and consistency.

Obviously disappointed in a lot of what happened last season and this season so far. But I choose to think positive. So I see the good we have accomplished and hope for more of those good things in our future. Thanks again Coach. Been a fan my whole life, 47 years next month, and the last 11 are the best stretch ever in my life. Even if it flames out, I'm thankful. But I've got faith that coach hasn't given up and neither have I, so in the meantime, GO COCKS!!!!!!!