I just wished Ryan Hilinski could have stuck it out here.

[feeble2001]

You also included Charleston Southerni but didn’t include #20 App State that only 5 SEC teams were ranked ahead of. Who also had the 21st rank passing defense in the nation that year.

why didn’t you include them too into the conversation?

Do you honestly think a healthy RH only throws for only 169 yards vs the 125/127 ranked paaa defense? (Averaged 387)

196 yards vs the 119/127 pass defense? (Averaged 301)

or against the absolute worst pass defense in the nation, only throwing for 234 yards?

you say SEC schedule but Hill faced much worse passing defenses and was very pedestrian.

Versus the three worst pass defenses in the nation, Hill threw for 2 Touchdowns 2 Interceptions.

that is bad.

 

[GarnetBeamer]

Collin Hill had a QB rating of 117 versus an all SEC schedule. Hilinski has a 113 qb rating with a game against Charleston Southern.

So objectively, Hilinski could have done worse than Hill.

Ok, so Hill, as a 5th year senior playing his 5th year for the same coach was marginally better than a true freshman who was playing much of the season with a banged up shoulder.

 

[feeble2001]

Ok, so Hill, as a 5th year senior playing his 5th year for the same coach was marginally better than a true freshman who was playing much of the season with a banged up shoulder.

RH also faced 6 of the top 15 defenses in the country.

CH faced 0

 

[GamecockinHouston]

This is still a topic?

 

[uscwatson21]

Freshman vs Redshirt Senior. I meant he couldn’t have done worse regarding his ranking of SEC QBs.

you also included Charleston Southern but neglected to include Clemson - why is that?

RH also had less INTs with three more games and we all know RH was playing injured half the season

However you want to spin it doesn’t change the fact that you have nothing to legitimately argue Hilinski was better than Hill.

 

[GarnetBeamer]

However you want to spin it doesn’t change the fact that you have nothing to legitimately argue Hilinski was better than Hill.

Hill threw more interceptions on fewer pass attempts. Dude was an interception machine.

 

[uscwatson21]

Hill threw more interceptions on fewer pass attempts. Dude was an interception machine.

Yet still had a higher passing rating…

 

[uscwatson21]

Ok, so Hill, as a 5th year senior playing his 5th year for the same coach was marginally better than a true freshman who was playing much of the season with a banged up shoulder.

Look man. I think it’s pretty embarrassing that our fans are clamoring over a sophomore QB who couldn’t beat out a fifth year transfer from a group of 5 team who had 3 acl surgeries.

Tough times.

 

[GarnetBeamer]

Yet still had a higher passing rating…

There was no statistical significance to it.

If your entire pro-Hill argument hangs on the fact that a 5th year senior had a rating 4 points higher than a true freshman, well, you're on pretty weak ground, but I think you know that.

 

[GarnetBeamer]

Look man. I think it’s pretty embarrassing that our fans are clamoring over a sophomore QB who couldn’t beat out a fifth year transfer from a group of 5 team who had 3 acl surgeries.

Tough times.

If anyone was dumb enough to believe it was a real competition and not rigged from the outset. From our coaches own mouths, they each won a scrimmage and played even in the 3rd. Hill got the nod, presumably, b/c he was a master of the offense. Who knew the offense was coughing up game-losing INTs?

 

[Dizzy01]

So you legitimately believe that our last staff risked their jobs just to play Hill over Hilinski even though Hilinski was clearly a better QB? Why? Because Bobo just liked Hill more? I don’t believe a word of it. That is not how coaches make decisions, even bad coaches.

Hill was not a great QB, but he had more experience, and a better understanding of the offense we were trying to run. The coaches thought that because of that he gave us a better chance to win- that is why he started. RH was a real nice guy but never showed an ability to consistently deliver the ball downfield, read a defense or put pressure on a good defense. He can certainly get better with time and experience but last year with a horrible offense around him, I sincerely doubt he would have produced any more than Hill did.

It is all water under the bridge regardless as neither of those guys are here now. I am looking forward to seeing what Doty can do with some game experience under his belt, numerous new targets and a revitalized game plan. I hope he lives up to his potential!

This argument might hold more water if not for Muschamp’s history with QBs. He has notoriously mismanaged the position despite continuously recruiting top tier QBs. I’m his time at Florida his QBs routinely transferred and flourished under other coaches and even here he recruited five guys who were top fifteen at their position and so far three have transferred, one changed positions and one is about to start working with a new staff.

It is entirely possible in ever situation Muschamp thought he was making the best QB choice but it is also possible his choice is based on incompetence.

 

[feeble2001]

However you want to spin it doesn’t change the fact that you have nothing to legitimately argue Hilinski was better than Hill.

I just showed you a ton of evidence. Hillinski had a similar QBR while facing better defenses.

you were real heavy on that “all sec schedule” argument until the facts came out

 

[feeble2001]

This is what I mean when I said you move goal posts and won’t admit you’re wrong

 

[feeble2001]

The best defense hill faced (#29) he went 8/21 66 yards and 2 ints

he was bad

 

[will110]

This is such an absurd argument. Literally none of the players or coaches involved in this decision are still here! Let's get excited about 2021 and the future instead of arguing about whether Collin Hill was better than Hilinski. Obviously neither of those guys were very good or we would have seen a bit better production, and who knows, possibly even a win or two more.

 

[uscwatson21]

I just showed you a ton of evidence. Hillinski had a similar QBR while facing better defenses.

you were real heavy on that “all sec schedule” argument until the facts came out

You’ve shown a bunch of spin. Which is my point. I don’t care who was better between Hilinski and Hill. They were both going to lead us to 2-8

 

[feeble2001]

You’ve shown a bunch of spin. Which is my point. I don’t care who was better between Hilinski and Hill. They were both going to lead us to 2-8

Why are you back tracking now that I proved your “all sec” schedule argument was incredibly flawed?

 

[uscwatson21]

Why are you back tracking now that I proved your “all sec” schedule argument was incredibly flawed?

Backtracking? It’s apparent you don’t even comprehend what others are arguing.

And you’ve proved nothing as usual. Did Hill get a gimme versus an FCS game to boost his QB rating or not?

 

[kidrobinski]

If anyone was dumb enough to believe it was a real competition and not rigged from the outset. From our coaches own mouths, they each won a scrimmage and played even in the 3rd. Hill got the nod, presumably, b/c he was a master of the offense. Who knew the offense was coughing up game-losing INTs?

First sentence is among the dumbest I have ever seen on a message board.

Last sentence ignores the fact that Hill’s team was averaging in the mid-20s points per game, even with the 3 against A&M, but had a defense that was giving up half a hundred.

If Hilinski would have been decent he would have been on the field; same with Doty. The former is gone; let’s pray a light has come in for the latter, because God help the fanbase if Beamer starts Brown.

 

[Gamecock Lifer]

This argument might hold more water if not for Muschamp’s history with QBs. He has notoriously mismanaged the position despite continuously recruiting top tier QBs. I’m his time at Florida his QBs routinely transferred and flourished under other coaches and even here he recruited five guys who were top fifteen at their position and so far three have transferred, one changed positions and one is about to start working with a new staff.

It is entirely possible in ever situation Muschamp thought he was making the best QB choice but it is also possible his choice is based on incompetence.

I agree- it certainly could be incompetence and we saw plenty of that under that Muschamp. I am arguing that no coach would willfully not start a QB who is clearly the best player out of spite. I don’t think Muschamp is that dumb nor do I believe Bobo is that dumb. RH had more developmental potential than Hill- there is no doubt about that in my mind, and if they felt they were developing a team and would be coaching here for years to come- you might focus more on the developmental guy and take some growing pains. In the situation they were in, they clearly tried to go with the more experienced player and hoped his familiarity with Bobo’s scheme and his experience would yield better results. It did not, and that is why we find ourselves where we are today.

I am not hating on Hilinski- my point from the start in this discussion is that we should not lament losing our third string QB. We have Doty- a highly rated HS player. Gauthier- another 4* guy and Brown who was an AA performer at the D2 school he transferred here from. Our QB room looks pretty good! The blowback I keep getting is to the effect of “well he shouldn’t have been 3rd string”… Well OK but- HE WAS. Or “it was a conspiracy/ favoritism/Bobo had it in for him and that is why he did not play”- which I simply think is BS.

 

[feeble2001]

Backtracking? It’s apparent you don’t even comprehend what others are arguing.

And you’ve proved nothing as usual. Did Hill get a gimme versus an FCS game to boost his QB rating or not?

Did he play against a top 15 defense? He played against one top 30 defense and he had a QBR of a whopping 45

 

[feeble2001]

Hillinski had a higher QBR vs Clemson/Georgia/Alabama than Hill did against that single top 30 defense

 

[uscwatson21]

The best defense hill faced (#29) he went 8/21 66 yards and 2 ints

he was bad

My favorite part of this argument is how you can’t comprehend at how not playing out of conference opponents affected these rankings.

Top 10 defenses in 2019: Georgia, SDSU, Clemson, Ohio State, Iowa, Utah, Florida, Penn State, Oregon and Wisconsin.

Top 10 defense in 2029: Marshall, Army, Air Force, BYU, Northwestern, Iowa, Ohio, Cincinnati, FAU, Wisconsin.

So 9 out of 10 in 2019 were Power 5 and a mere 3 out of 10 in 2020.

Don’t worry I know you’re incapable of admitting when you’re wrong.

 

[Gamecock Lifer]

Hillinski had a higher QBR vs Clemson/Georgia/Alabama than Hill did against that single top 30 defense

Under a different offense, different OC, running a different scheme, with different players around him. Neither was impressive but comparing stats for two guys playing with completely different circumstances is pretty much irrelevant.

 

[GarnetBeamer]

Under a different offense, different OC, running a different scheme, with different players around him. Neither was impressive but comparing stats for two guys playing with completely different circumstances is pretty much irrelevant.

Yes, about the only conclusion you can make is that they were statistically comparable (interceptions aside). It's impossible to quantify all the other differences you mention. On top of that you're comparing 5th year senior to a true freshman.

 

[feeble2001]

My favorite part of this argument is how you can’t comprehend at how not playing out of conference opponents affected these rankings.

Top 10 defenses in 2019: Georgia, SDSU, Clemson, Ohio State, Iowa, Utah, Florida, Penn State, Oregon and Wisconsin.

Top 10 defense in 2029: Marshall, Army, Air Force, BYU, Northwestern, Iowa, Ohio, Cincinnati, FAU, Wisconsin.

So 9 out of 10 in 2019 were Power 5 and a mere 3 out of 10 in 2020.

Don’t worry I know you’re incapable of admitting when you’re wrong.

That’s why initially did pass defense, I don’t have the time but if you look how Hillinski preformed against SEC defenses vs other SEC QBs vs Hill, it will be night and day.

Hill was not good at all

 

[uscwatson21]

Hill was not good at all

Neither was Hilinski.

That’s the point you’re missing.

 

[Dizzy01]

I agree- it certainly could be incompetence and we saw plenty of that under that Muschamp. I am arguing that no coach would willfully not start a QB who is clearly the best player out of spite. I don’t think Muschamp is that dumb nor do I believe Bobo is that dumb. RH had more developmental potential than Hill- there is no doubt about that in my mind, and if they felt they were developing a team and would be coaching here for years to come- you might focus more on the developmental guy and take some growing pains. In the situation they were in, they clearly tried to go with the more experienced player and hoped his familiarity with Bobo’s scheme and his experience would yield better results. It did not, and that is why we find ourselves where we are today.

I am not hating on Hilinski- my point from the start in this discussion is that we should not lament losing our third string QB. We have Doty- a highly rated HS player. Gauthier- another 4* guy and Brown who was an AA performer at the D2 school he transferred here from. Our QB room looks pretty good! The blowback I keep getting is to the effect of “well he shouldn’t have been 3rd string”… Well OK but- HE WAS. Or “it was a conspiracy/ favoritism/Bobo had it in for him and that is why he did not play”- which I simply think is BS.

That’s ignoring Bobo’s equally inept QB coaching at CSU as well as his pattern of attempting this same thing when he got there of bringing a QB in with him and trying to force him in despite it being obvious he couldn’t do the job.

I don’t think either one said let’s play the lesser guy but I also don’t think either one has shown any reason to not doubt their ability to make QB decisions.

 

[feeble2001]

Neither was Hilinski.

That’s the point you’re missing.

He was just as good if not better and had the benefit of the growth from Freshman to Sophomore which tends to be the biggest growth in a player.

if you don’t think Bobo had a grudge then you obviously were not watching. The amount of blowouts we had and not to give RH reps - and when he first came in he called QB DRAWS for RH