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OT: 11 Bitcoin ETFs Approved by SEC.

Ward Jr said:
You believe I was going to peck out all of those features on FGF? :)

I've mentioned this previously but why do you believe all of the major investment players are in now? Why is Stanford the epicenter of the Bitcoin core developers and has been for over a decade? Just monkeying around?
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I wasn't being accusatory. I do like Chat GPT and I am very tech savvy and I Iove tech.

Just because Bitcoin hasn't collapsed like NFTs, doesn’t mean it is a great long-term investment. Though I wish I had gotten in on NVIDIA earlier, I think it is rising far more quickly than its actual value. Stanford is a great incubator for tech, but I don't think just because they allocate resources to it means I should like it. I am a skeptic by nature.

The volatility and transparent hype really concern me. Plus, I find all of the Satoshi philosophy surrounding Bitcoin a little contrived. I think the myth is far greater than the reality. Just my opinion, doesn’t make me right. Sometimes it just seems like the wizards in and around Silicon Valley are more PT Barnum than legit.

Ask me whether I think social media's benefits has out weighed its capacity for destruction.
 
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vidaliagamecock said:
I wasn't being accusatory. I do like Chat GPT and I am very tech savvy and I Iove tech.

Just because Bitcoin hasn't collapsed like NFTs, doesn’t mean it is a great long-term investment. Though I wish I had gotten in on NVIDIA earlier, I think it is rising far more quickly than its actual value. Stanford is a great incubator for tech, but I don't think just because they allocate resources to it means I should like it. I am a skeptic by nature.

The volatility and transparent hype really concern me. Plus, I find all of the Satoshi philosophy surrounding Bitcoin a little contrived. I think the myth is far greater than the reality. Just my opinion, doesn’t make me right. Sometimes it just seems like the wizards in and around Silicon Valley are more PT Barnum than legit.

Ask me whether I think social media's benefits has out weighed its capacity for destruction.
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The proof-of-work concept, scarcity and pure decentralization are all powerful for BTC. However, the most important part right now is that everyday investors of been hearing about Bitcoin and crypto for many years. They also know that our government is manipulating the dollar at a torrid pace and that our debt service each year now exceeds the military budget and is on a parabolic projectory. Now they have easy access to BTC alone as a hedge against corruption (money printing). They don't have options right now for any other cryptocurrency. It's the new shining object in their eyes. Not to mention all of the mom and pop financial advisor outfits on street corners now have a good reason to shuffle their clients into something new and get that commission (churn). That's a big part of the reason why things are getting very interesting, very quickly.
 
turncock said:
Do you honestly believe Bitcoin is a Ponzi scheme as of today? It's a commodity just like gold backed by sophisticated mining operations around the world.

With Madoff, returns to investors were paid from the capital of new investors, rather than from profit earned by the operation of a legitimate business.
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What legitimate business is Bitcoin conducting that grows wealth?

Its the epitome of a Ponzi scheme.
 
Bitcoin is up about 3% so far this morning. But the 2 crypto stocks I hold are getting whacked. Glad I lightened up by selling 25% of my crypto portfolio the other day. Rotation....rotation.....rotation.
 
uscwatson21 said:
What legitimate business is Bitcoin conducting that grows wealth?

Its the epitome of a Ponzi scheme.
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It's a store of value that is being used all over the world now. If it's a Ponzi, why are all of the biggest asset managers today involved and why did the SEC approve the ETF? Sorry, but this is a lame US government talking point to protect the dollar.
 
hahnenkampf said:
I’m sure Bitcoin will continue to be used in huge numbers by international criminals and terrorist organizations. As such, speculating in its growth value makes sense.

www.nbcconnecticut.com

Over 60% of illegal crypto activity is tied to sanctioned groups or terrorist organizations, report finds

Sanctioned entities and U.S.-designated terrorist organizations, such as Lebanon’s Hezbollah, continue to rely on cryptocurrency for fundraising.
www.nbcconnecticut.com www.nbcconnecticut.com
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Hit piece. The dollar is more laundered around the world than any other currency by a long shot. NBC and it's affiliates is US Government TV and it's been that way for quite a while.
 
turncock said:
It's a store of value that is being used all over the world now. If it's a Ponzi, why are all of the biggest asset managers today involved and why did the SEC approve the ETF? Sorry, but this is a lame US government talking point to protect the dollar.
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Gotta love the anti-government people touting the decisions by the government they hate.
 
turncock said:
Have you witnessed what's happened to the dollar and the debt we owe because of them? You'd be quite ignorant to be cheering it on at this point.
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I'm laughing at you thinking bitcoin is going to save you if something happens to the dollar.

The only value Bitcoin has is because a bunch of idiots are using their dollars to buy bitcoin.
 
turncock said:
I think you're going to be on the wrong side of history and already are.
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lol This is how people convince themselves to fall for scams.

Eventually it's going to collapse and I hope you're not still holding the bag when it does.
 
uscwatson21 said:
lol This is how people convince themselves to fall for scams.

Eventually it's going to collapse and I hope you're not still holding the bag when it does.
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It's been around for 17 years. It was originally priced under a penny and currently it's around $62,000.

Which currency is the scam?
 
turncock said:
Hit piece. The dollar is more laundered around the world than any other currency by a long shot. NBC and it's affiliates is US Government TV and it's been that way for quite a while.
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I wasn’t making a judgment on anything. All currencies are used for illegal activities. I was only stating that its usefulness in such activities makes it of continuing growth.
 
Bitcoim is no more of a scam than a dollar bill.
The value of any currency is based on what people perceive to be its worth. And don't tell me the dollar is backed up by gold. There's not enough gold on the planet for all the dollars in circulation.
 
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Vanguard was the one holdout that pulled their BTC ETF and decided they wanted to "protect their investors."

Costly decision. Today the CEO forced to resign.

 
turncock said:
It's been around for 17 years. It was originally priced under a penny and currently it's around $62,000.

Which currency is the scam?
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You don't think it's a red flag that when you talk about the benefits of Bitcoin, the one you bring up is how many dollars it costs to buy a bitcoin?

When is your employer going to start paying you in bitcoin?
 
uscwatson21 said:
You don't think it's a red flag that when you talk about the benefits of Bitcoin, the one you bring up is how many dollars it costs to buy a bitcoin?

When is your employer going to start paying you in bitcoin?
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It's already happening around the world. There are even Bitcoin ATMs. The previous boom and bust cycles of Bitcoin were primarily because it was a new, illiquid market. The Wall Street infusion will help steady that. Big hands won't be able to manipulate the market like they once did.
 
I see bitcoin as a way to generate extra cash to reinvest in other sectors. Put in a core amount and leave it in there. If you go above that core and promising investment possibilities open up in other sectors, then sell down to that core, using those profits for the other sectors. That's what I recently did. And if no attractive investment possibilities open up in other sectors, you still have your core. If bitcoin goes through the roof, you come out really well with that core. People make fun of others who invest in bitcoin. All I can say is that I have been investing in bitcoin for years and years. I'm not going to take the time to go back and figure it out. But I know I'm playing with "house money" and have been doing so for a long time.
 
turncock said:
I think you're going to be on the wrong side of history and already are.
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That could be true. No one knows.

I am of the age where I don't worry about that because I'm not going to be around much longer as I am in my early 50s. I won't know any history or have any future pretty soon

But, I am not against the idea of people putting their money into anything they want.

My investments are very simple- mutual funds. My job and investments allowed me to retire early (I work now for fun a few days a week -mainly in the winter months- and to stay a little busy during the week) and have enough money for my family so they are in a good position whether I am here or not. So I have been satisified keeping things simple and boring. It's provided me with what I needed, wanted, and security.

But, I am not someone who chases investments or is all that interested in spending much time keeping up with such things I'll pay attention to it enough to stay informed of what my portfolio is doing. But that's it. I prefer to do other things. Some - mainly men- like to focus on such stuff a lot and that's fine. It's just not something I enjoy.
 
DeeDave said:
That could be true. No one knows.

I am of the age where I don't worry about that because I'm not going to be around much longer as I am in my early 50s. I won't know any history or have any future pretty soon

But, I am not against the idea of people putting their money into anything they want.

My investments are very simple- mutual funds. My job and investments allowed me to retire early (I work now for fun a few days a week -mainly in the winter months- and to stay a little busy during the week) and have enough money for my family so they are in a good position whether I am here or not. So I have been satisified keeping things simple and boring. It's provided me with what I needed, wanted, and security.

But, I am not someone who chases investments or is all that interested in spending much time keeping up with such things I'll pay attention to it enough to stay informed of what my portfolio is doing. But that's it. I prefer to do other things. Some - mainly men- like to focus on such stuff a lot and that's fine. It's just not something I enjoy.
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No one knows? One bitcoin is currently priced at $62,000. One US Dollar is worth less than $1 in the amount of time it took me to post this.



 
hahnenkampf said:
Yes indeed — it’s what happens when the citizens of our nation voluntarily pay for the problems of other nations and their citizens. Voluntarily you ask? — by voting for administrations that put the U.S. last, it is indeed voluntary.
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The US is never "last" with any Presidential administration.

The United States has- and will always fund things in our interests around the world. The amount and list of things we fund in one or another is very long. No President has- or will stop that because even the dumbest ones realize it's in our interest- and in the interest of stability in one way or another.

Isolationism and isolationist populism has not had a good history in the United States or in most countries. That's not to say being involved in everything is smart either. But no Presidential administration wants to be involved in everything. (Even when we tried to be in the Reagan Administration with illegal sales to fund administration goals that Congress didn't know about or approve, we weren't going to be involved in everything).

To pretend that the last Presidential administration didn't spend loads of money around the world is spin. The executive branch is just one arm of the government. Congress also has just as important a role.

China has ramped up their foreign spending, preferring to focus internally for decades and decades while the United States did spend money around the world, usually to the disadvantage of countries like China. China has realized this mistake and in South America and the South Pacific region, their ramped up spending in numerous countries is most noticeable.

Individuals, you in this case, repeating campaign slogans from politicians is interesting- and nothing but political nonsense and spin.
 
DeeDave said:
The US is never "last" with any Presidential administration.

The United States has- and will always fund things in our interests around the world. The amount and list of things we fund in one or another is very long. No President has- or will stop that because even the dumbest ones realize it's in our interest- and in the interest of stability in one way or another.

Isolationism and isolationist populism has not had a good history in the United States or in most countries. That's not to say being involved in everything is smart either. But no Presidential administration wants to be involved in everything. (Even when we tried to be in the Reagan Administration with illegal sales to fund administration goals that Congress didn't know about or approve, we weren't going to be involved in everything).

To pretend that the last Presidential administration didn't spend loads of money around the world is spin. The executive branch is just one arm of the government. Congress also has just as important a role.

China has ramped up their foreign spending, preferring to focus internally for decades and decades while the United States did spend money around the world, usually to the disadvantage of countries like China. China has realized this mistake and in South America and the South Pacific region, their ramped up spending in numerous countries is most noticeable.

Individuals, you in this case, repeating campaign slogans from politicians is interesting- and nothing but political nonsense and spin.
Click to expand...

You have to be trolling here? No one is this naive. Even the largest donors of the Democratic Party with deep interest in the financial world have been sounding the alarm bells. Just look at the economic indictors coming directly out of the FED since 2020. It's mindboggling.
 
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Ward Jr said:
You have to be trolling here? No one is this naive. Even the largest donors of the Democratic Party with deep interest in the financial world have been sounding the alarm bells. Just look at the economic indictors coming directly out of the FED since 2020. It's mindboggling.
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Shallow people only see the superficial. The cabal takes full advantage of that.
 
Buying A House - 2020 vs. Today
In Jan 1, 2020, an middle/upper middle class around my area went for around $500K. Today, just over 3 years later, it's now around $1,000,000. But that's just part of the story. In 2020, interest rates were around 3%. Today they are around 7%. So the monthly payment on a middle class home is approximately 3.2 times higher (320%) than it was 3 years ago. The net present value of a $500K home at 3% in 2020 was $758K. The new present value of that same house priced at $1,000,000 w/ 7% rate today is $2.4 million. This is what the climate change children should actually focus their ire on. This is the middle class being priced out by our government and the inflation they create via corrupt money printing.

Illustrating the strength of Bitcoin vs. US Dollar over same period
From a BTC perspective, that house in 2020 was 70.2 Bitcoin. Today, it's only 22 BTC. That's a 68% decrease in the price of the house if you were in Bitcoin versus a 100% increase if you were in the US Dollar. And if you finance the house, it's a 68% decrease versus a 320% increase.
 
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Ward Jr said:
Buying A House - 2020 vs. Today
In Jan 1, 2020, an middle/upper middle class around my area went for around $500K. Today, just over 3 years later, it's now around $1,000,000. But that's just part of the story. In 2020, interest rates were around 3%. Today they are around 7%. So the monthly payment on a middle class home is approximately 3.2 times higher (320%) than it was 3 years ago. The net present value of a $500K home at 3% in 2020 was $758K. The new present value of that same house priced at $1,000,000 w/ 7% rate today is $2.4 million. This is what the climate change children should actually focus their ire on. This is the middle class being priced out by our government and the inflation they create via corrupt money printing.

Illustrating the strength of Bitcoin vs. US Dollar over same period
From a BTC perspective, that house in 2020 was 70.2 Bitcoin. Today, it's only 22 BTC. That's a 68% decrease in the price of the house if you were in Bitcoin versus a 100% increase if you were in the US Dollar. And if you finance the house, it's a 68% decrease versus a 320% increase.
Click to expand...

How many houses were bought with bitcoin last year?
 
DeeDave said:
The US is never "last" with any Presidential administration.

The United States has- and will always fund things in our interests around the world. The amount and list of things we fund in one or another is very long. No President has- or will stop that because even the dumbest ones realize it's in our interest- and in the interest of stability in one way or another.

Isolationism and isolationist populism has not had a good history in the United States or in most countries. That's not to say being involved in everything is smart either. But no Presidential administration wants to be involved in everything. (Even when we tried to be in the Reagan Administration with illegal sales to fund administration goals that Congress didn't know about or approve, we weren't going to be involved in everything).

To pretend that the last Presidential administration didn't spend loads of money around the world is spin. The executive branch is just one arm of the government. Congress also has just as important a role.

China has ramped up their foreign spending, preferring to focus internally for decades and decades while the United States did spend money around the world, usually to the disadvantage of countries like China. China has realized this mistake and in South America and the South Pacific region, their ramped up spending in numerous countries is most noticeable.

Individuals, you in this case, repeating campaign slogans from politicians is interesting- and nothing but political nonsense and spin.
Click to expand...
And you keep defending and supporting political talking points from a liberal Democrat perspective. You probably think the Johnson Administration was wise to blow huge taxpayer dollars and young lives in Vietnam. It’s amazing the lengths you’ll go to in supporting liberal orthodoxy. And you no doubt have a terminal case of white guilt.
 
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uscwatson21 said:
How many houses were bought with bitcoin last year?
Click to expand...

You certainly can. There are banks that offer mortgages based in BTC. But why does this matter either way? If you held in BTC from 2020-2023, you can easily convert to cash at that point and deal with any mortgage company or pay in cash. Nets out the same exact way.
 
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uscwatson21 said:
How many houses were bought with bitcoin last year?
Click to expand...

I'm betting quite a few folks that made a mint on bitcoin converted that back to the flimsy dollar and used it to buy a house.
I made some decent cash on crypto back in the run up time. Nothing like house buying cash but in came in quite handy.
 
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Ward Jr said:
Ha. I hope for his sake he's trolling. Otherwise, it's just more evidence we desperately need a basic competency screen before you can vote.
Click to expand...

Not the sharpest knife in the drawer. One day, when he is out on that boat of his, he will understand, maybe. Nah... probably not.
 
Ward Jr said:
You certainly can. There are banks that offer mortgages based in BTC. But why does this matter either way? If you held in BTC from 2020-2023, you can easily convert to cash at that point and deal with any mortgage company or pay in cash. Nets out the same exact way.
Click to expand...

So you don't actually know do you?
 
hahnenkampf said:
And you keep defending and supporting political talking points from a liberal Democrat perspective. You probably think the Johnson Administration was wise to blow huge taxpayer dollars and young lives in Vietnam. It’s amazing the lengths you’ll go to in supporting liberal orthodoxy. And you no doubt have a terminal case of white guilt.
Click to expand...

When I see other people make posts- like most made by people on here - that are straight out of the Trump political campaign's talking points, sometimes I will respond and point out the Dear Leader cult worship.

In August 1965, Gallup reported that 60% of Americans supported the war effort. By January 1967, it was 52% and declined further each year after. Nothing really stunning about those numbers. The numbers for the Iraq war effort, Afghanistan effort and many others often start out high, then dwindle as fatigue and reality set in.

Plenty of people, including Johnson were responsible.

I didn't look too hard but Gallup said in a poll taken in January 2018 that 69% of Democrats polled said we should have stayed out of Vietnam. Only 38% of Republicans said we should have stayed out.

I even know Richard Nixon tried to ruin the peace talks in his Presidential campaign in 1968 and extend the war, with more Americans dying.

"In one series of scribbles, H.R. Haldeman reported Henry Kissinger’s willingness to inform on his U.S. diplomatic colleagues, and keep Nixon updated on President Lyndon Johnson’s furious, eleventh-hour efforts to end the Vietnam War.

In late October 1968, the two men connected on what came to be known as “the Chennault Affair.” Nixon gave Haldeman his orders: Find ways to sabotage Johnson’s plans to stage productive peace talks, so that a frustrated American electorate would turn to the Republicans as their only hope to end the war."

Given the failed talks, aided by Nixon, one young man from my home county was a victim to that effort. He died in April 1969 of a gunshot to the stomach in Gia Dinh. He was 21. Per my father who was friends with him, he didn't think he had ever been out of our own county before he went to Vietnam.

A good read about Nixon's effort to sabotage the peace talks and extend the war

 
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