Then why can Clemson?
Somebody Comfort Me (Credibly)
- Thread starter king ward
- Start date
Very simple ... their fanbase and Admin won’t tolerate it . Sucks to say but true . If Dabo goes 7-5 , 8-4 the next two years he will be on the hot seat and Death Valley will be half full . Same at Bama, LSU , UGA etc etc .
You make my point for me: There are too many of our fans that think we should just accept our lot in life and forget about ever winning big and consistently, while ignoring that a land grant school in the northwest corner of nowhere is doing it every year.
While I concur with your basic point there vehemon, but if Kirby doesn't win it ALL (or at least make it to the playoffs) within the next 2 - 3 years, its Marc Richt all over again with the door wide open for Champ and Mullen; and if Champ can get this team together in regards to remaining healthy and balanced (i.e. our "D" performing right up there with our "O" in regards to the last half of the 2018 season), then the opportunity will certainly arise for us.
A minor observation/thought on my part there; by all means shall we see what we'll see! =;-p
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This program will never be more than average unless some kind of miracle freak luck occurs. We're located in a geographic nightmare with 2 of the top 4 programs in our Country a rocks throw away. What happened a few years back was an abnormal amount of South Carolina NFL talent came and played here. That's not common and probably will not be happening anytime soon again. This has never ever been a consistent top 20 historical program so you cant expect recruiting to consistantly be higher than that.
I grew up in Clemson country and I know them well. They took football more seriously than Gamecock fans, and winning was important to them. The record speaks for itself. Also, their fans are more loyal and there is less petty criticism of the football staff even when they lose. Frank Howard is an idol in the Clemson pantheon of heros yet he, rarely for Clemson coaches, had a losing record against the Gamecocks.
I said it could be argued and that I'd take SC's over them, noI didn't take hours out of my day watching film of their D Line acquisitions but I didnt do that for UGA's or Bama's either-they may not be right every time but the recruiting services do a pretty good job analyzing talent overall so yea I'll go with the combined ratings of multiple services of people who do this for a living and base it off of that info-that work?
More loyal? During the five game losing streak to USC, orange went extinct all over SC. Now, it's everywhere. And when Clemson was mired in mediocrity, they literally gave away free tickets at the BI-LO. USC fans on the other hand sold out Billy Brice in a 21 game losing streak. We're loyal to a fault.
But yes, they do take winning more seriously. When Spurrier beat them 5 in a row, they took it to another level. The same thing happened after Jeff Grantz put the wood to them in the 1970s.
Clemson is a football school, as is Georgia, Alabama, etc. Carolina could compete in basketball when we were in the ACC, and Frank McGuire was the coach, but even then our accomplishments were modest.
Carolina's achievements in baseball and horse riding have been substantial, however, and I credit that to the fact that the teams involved have few members in comparison to football. Thus less difficult to recruit outstanding players/riders.
Clemson fans are more loyal in the sense that they stay together and support the coaches and the institution. They do not at all enjoy seeing their team beaten on the field and will not tolerate it for long.
Carolina fans, particularly, old loyalists like me, are either used to bitter, heartbreaking defeats, or they have moved their loyalties elsewhere.
Carolina fans, particularly, old loyalists like me, are either used to bitter, heartbreaking defeats, or they have moved their loyalties elsewhere.
That's nonsense. South Carolina simply hired the wrong people, and at important inflection points in the college athletics landscape, those bad hires made poor decisions. Bad decisions compounded and put the basketball and football programs behind other schools in the region. When quality people were hired at different points-- Hyman and Spurrier for example, the strides they made were monumental and elevated the program immediately. It's like any other organization, if you hire smart people to run it, they establish a vision and a legacy that other smart people can build on. You hire bad people, and they leave you adrift. If Muschamp and Tanner can build on what Hyman and Spurrier started, we might be in a totally different place in 10 years. If they both prove to be bad hires, they'll obscure all the progress that was made and we'll be starting again.
Correct. USC has a perennially mismanaged athletic department run by a BOT of good old boys that has no clue what they're doing.
1971 - We leave ACC. Two decades in the wilderness
- Carlen hired as both AD and football coach, which was dumb ass hell.
1976 Carlen refuses to go back to ACC.
- James Corrupt James Holderman hired as Prez.
- 1980 McGuire forced out. Basketball dead as fried chicken
1981 - James Holderman fires Carlen, who rightly recognized Holderman was stealing
1982 - Bell fired
- Bestwick made it six months as AD.
- Marcum fired as AD for shame drug testing policy
- Holderman eventually fired for corruption and lecherous behavior of the criminal variety. Eddie Floyd said he knew about it but didn't want to act without a formal complaint. Now that's BOT leadership!
- King Dixon hired as AD. He was working at a bank in Sumter. His only qualification was he played at USC in the 1950s.
- We hire Sparky for no money promising to de-emphasize sports and concentrate on academics. One of those happens.
This could go on and on. Yes, it's the BOT.
1971 - We leave ACC. Two decades in the wilderness
- Carlen hired as both AD and football coach, which was dumb ass hell.
1976 Carlen refuses to go back to ACC.
- James Corrupt James Holderman hired as Prez.
- 1980 McGuire forced out. Basketball dead as fried chicken
1981 - James Holderman fires Carlen, who rightly recognized Holderman was stealing
1982 - Bell fired
- Bestwick made it six months as AD.
- Marcum fired as AD for shame drug testing policy
- Holderman eventually fired for corruption and lecherous behavior of the criminal variety. Eddie Floyd said he knew about it but didn't want to act without a formal complaint. Now that's BOT leadership!
- King Dixon hired as AD. He was working at a bank in Sumter. His only qualification was he played at USC in the 1950s.
- We hire Sparky for no money promising to de-emphasize sports and concentrate on academics. One of those happens.
This could go on and on. Yes, it's the BOT.
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USC lacks the long time, loyal football coach who built a foundation. Like General Neyland at Tennessee or Howard at Clemson.
Studying our history, I think Billy Laval could have been that man, but alas we asked him to take pay cuts in successive seasons (when he was winning!) and he left.
Some info on him from Wikipedia:
Billy Laval, a Columbia, South Carolina native, came to USC from Furman. Laval accepted a three-year contract worth $8,000 per year to coach the Gamecocks, which made him the highest-paid coach in the state. From 1928 to 1934, he led the Gamecocks to seven consecutive winning seasons and a 39–26–6 overall record, which included a perfect 3–0 Southern Conference campaign in 1933. Laval is one of only two South Carolina football coaches to have produced seven consecutive winning seasons (Steve Spurrier is the other, from 2008-2014). In 2009, The State called him "the greatest collegiate coach" in the history of South Carolina.Laval left USC after six seasons to coach multiple sports at Emory and Henry College, partly due to differences over his contract with the USC athletics department
In 1933, the South Carolina athletic department reported a $15,200 deficit, and Laval reluctantly agreed to take a pay cut to $5,000. However, the department's financial difficulties worsened, and the next year it requested Laval take a second pay cut to $3,600, which he refused. The school allowed his contract to lapse after the 1934 season.
Seems that with a few exceptions Carolina has been making bad decisions re. its athletic programs since about Reconstruction.
And I think that was largely due to Spurrier. He was so cool everybody wanted to play for him. Even if it was at South Carolina.
We need to hire Nick Saban away from Bama. Or give Bill Belichick all of Fripp Island or something if he'll come here and teach our quarterbacks how to be Tom Brady.
I do think Muschamp will build a tough, competitive team and keep winning. I think that might eventually pay off in recuiting to the level we can be in the hunt for the SEC title.
One thing I was pondering, living down here in GA. Kirby had the Dogs seconds from a title last year. This year he doesn't even get to the playoff.
What if Smart turns into another Richt, chronically underachieving by UGA's lofty expectations.
The good news is that we finally figured out again what an SEC defensive end looks like. After Clowney, we forgot for a few years.
Maybe it’s time for you to use that enormously broad vocabulary that you so often grace us with.
The BOT also hired Ray Tanner several time Ntl champion
Dawn Staley ntl champion
Lou Holtz -ntl champion
Steve spurrier ntl champion
Equestrian
Etc..
they done good things as well.
With
1 5 star
2 4 stars
3 high 3 stars
I looked it up and I would say 3rd in the country behind Bama and A&M.
1. That's what myself and many others are saying our fanbase needs to do in order to duplicate their success. As a whole, we simply don't.
2. That's a bunch of bull. Until Dabo finally turned the tables on us, they have tried to and --- except for him -- succeeded in running off every coach since Ford. Even when some of them were averaging 8-9 wins a year and beating us with regularity.
Are you Muschamp?
I honestly loathed our fanbase right now. It's like a damn pity party. It's a sad time. You can thank SOS for this. Those glorious years showed me it is possible with the right coach. SOS was brilliant, except for a few old moments. I know we would have won a NC if he had came here 5 years sooner.
Yes, we are poised to overtake Kentucky, as if that should ever have been necessary, and contend for the Outback bowl on our best years.
I should, but I won't. I won't because I can't.
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You could always just cough up about $20M. That would make up the shortfall between us and the team you'd like us to be. Money is the real difference.
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