Dawn has led us to the NCAAT 8 years in a row and won a natty. That level of success buys you some freedom from criticism.
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- Thread starter JasonScottinSC
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Dawn has led us to the NCAAT 8 years in a row and won a natty. That level of success buys you some freedom from criticism.
A "natty"? What criticism are you taking about I thought we were talking about transfers and besides no coach gets a free pass in my book just fairness in my view.
Where did I say she gets a free pass? People are trying to compare apples to oranges with Frank and Dawn. There is no comparison. Frank's results + Frank's level of attrition = lots of questions/skepticism. Dawn's results + Dawn's level of attrition = comparatively little questions/criticism.
When you're a lock for the tournament people don't really care about the attrition. Plus, there's no comparison between the level of talent Dawn brings in compared to Frank. This single class by Dawn grades higher than every top recruit Frank has brought in his entire time here.
Frank couldn't get four 5* recruits if he coached here for 100 years.
So stick to the women's games. The world is fun of talented male basketball players and everybody is after them. In the world of women's basketball not so much there's a hand full of elites and Dawn gets her share of them but in men's basketball the recruiting is harder and some good players go to ....let's say Wofford. You'll never see a 5* women at Wofford .
How many 5* players does Wofford men's team get???
In any event, you're trying to compare an incredibly successful coach with an ok coach. It's just a poor comparison to make. It's kind of like saying "Michael Phelps eats 8,000 calories a day, so I can as well." Yes, you absolutely can...if you train like a world-class Olypmian 10 hours a day, every single day.
Is it though?
So, I'm not clear here. Are you contending that Frank has recruited comparably to Dawn? Are suggesting that Frank and Dawn have had roughly equal success here?
No I'm saying men's recruiting is harder because of the higher level of talent than the ladies.
But you seem to be contending that Dawn should receive the same level of scrutiny/criticism as Frank over player attrition, as though they are otherwise equals as coaches.
You are wise enough to realize fair is a four letter word! Whenever I hear a plea for fairness, I make sure I'm not tuned in to CNN! Coach Staley is a proven big time winner and recruiter! Her resume is beyond reproach!
Uhduh! Miss St was a 2 point game with 48 seconds to go. Knock it off King!
We were never going to win it. Our last gasp was always going to come up short against their superior talent. Nice try, but short is short.
I kinda get that vibe from Cooke as well from the highlights I've seen of her and her interviews. But, I hope I'm wrong and she leaves her high school days behind her, and fall in line once she gets here.
But you said we were never close to winning. Clearly we were.
I hate to see the transfers too. I’m willing to bet many NCAAW basketball teams would love to have Dawn at the head of thier program. And we’ve got her! That’s worth celebrating.
This move may be best for both parties. Time will tell.
good lawd man! Don Lemon is that you? Did your brain get sucked into the same black hole NASA was able to photograph this week?
As for your statement that "both coaches make a tone of $$ to coach basketball", youre right, they do. Just thought I'd show in some basic salary facts (this is just a base figure, not including the typical coaching extras), as itt appears that Martin pulls in 2.95 million yearly (22nd highest in the country) versus Staley at 1.1 million. Just saying that maybe, just maybe, that might require a little more consistency and success from him as far as accountability is concerned. Now I'm not saying that 1 mil doesn't require the same, just a comparison to think about. Might be neither here nor there in the way you're looking at the situation, and that's fine, but it is what it is.
The truth is the truth. They always had the upper hand; it was just a matter of turning it on and us running out of plays, always being at a physical disadvantage. See, I'm actually using MY head. You, on the other hand, are rationalizing based upon you understandable but misbegotten sentiment.
You initially said, " Every premier team we played this year shelled us. We were completely uncompetitive on those occasions when we went up against teams that got nearer the top of the mountain than we." Now you are trying to move the goal post.
Both make a lot of money but that's not really my point, my point is men's basketball and women's basketball are too different animals when it come to recruiting and national attention. Frank has one more year to make some waves I believe or he is sent packing. Dawn has one of the top five programs and going to get better with the incoming but Frank makes more $$ that's just the way it is with women's and men's sports. When something goes off track with Frank fans attack him when Dawn loses to Uconn or has transfers etc. it's because she is over loaded with talent and some flee to make room, or had a bad game or something else. We can't compare the two sports in the real world of basketball if it were the same they'd both be making $2.95 million. JMHO
Nope. We were never going to win that game regardless of score. We didn't have the wherewithal. If two entities are separated by a wall, it doesn't matter if the wall is thick or thin if it's made out of iron. The game was a formality for them.
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Oh unfortunately I get it, and agree about how the two of them are assessed "blame" in quite different ways. My bottom line is, why can't we compare the two sports. They don't have to be the same to compare, nothing I can think of is exactly the same, yet we make comparisons all the time in our lives. It's a hard argument to make that Dawn Staley is not at or close to the very top level of women's basketball, yet she makes a third of what her male counterpart makes. Sure, it's good money, great money, I'd take it in a heartbeat. But again, not the point - it's a third of Frank Martin's salary. Just because "that's just the way it is with women's and men's sports" does not equate to "that's the way it should be". I'd love to know, other than Frank Martin, who do you think would care if the salaries were flipped? And I'd love for my alma mater USC to be the first to do it.
Never gonna happen though because in reality women't basketball is still women's basketball but at Carolina we want a winner bad enough that the house is full when the ladies play because they win. Dawn is near the top but we can compare the two only on wins and loses not on what the people want. It's nice to win the women's NC but that's not the goal in college sports nobody wants to known as just a women's ball school. That's the reason Frank makes more money and also the reason Frank will be given the left foot of fellowship faster than Dawn and the reason Muschamp's lease is shorter. I can remember back when Frank McQ was winning game after game I didn't even know we had a woman's program...lol. Dawn is worth every penny but in the final analysis NC in women's sports is just gravy. Frank flounders next season and the cries for his head with me ear-splitting not so if Dawn slips up for a couple campaigns. I agree it's not the way it should be in all cases but it's danged sure the way it is.
It would, wouldn't it. I'd pay for admission to witness the aftermath and fallout. Sounds like fun.
OK, not that there's anything wrong with that.
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