Joyner said he is trying to flip XT

Discussion in 'Fighting Gamecocks Forum' started by jimnasium, Jun 18, 2017.

  1. jimnasium

    jimnasium Well-Known Member
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    He said during his post announcement interview he was going to try to get others to come with him and will try to flip XT. Is it possible?
     
  2. Garnet chicken

    Garnet chicken Well-Known Member
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    Not unless he has a sack full of cash or an upgrade for his wrecked vehicle.
     
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  3. gfluvsthecocks

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    People need to stop making dumb comments about XT and him being paid, etc. Unless you have proof stop talking. I realize a lot of the comments are coming from Clemson Trolls trying to make us out to be bitter. Do we want XT, of course. Have our coaches given up? No. Has Kereon given up? No. Will it happen. Probably not but worth a try.
     
  4. GarnetCocky1

    GarnetCocky1 Active Member
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    Dude, it's college football. These kids are getting paid anywhere they go. It's no exception here either.
     
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  5. section907

    section907 Well-Known Member
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    So what year do you think the taters quit paying their players? Or I should say quit Sponsoring their players. It happens. It happens everywhere.

    It's been awhile. But I witnessed it first hand to a third string running back. No doubt it's still going on.

    As far as XT. I won't be happy till Muschamp throws XT a private birthday party and tells him he "Loves Him" . Then if he still decided to go to Pickens , so be it. But I hope Boom doesn't quit recruiting him hard.
     
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  6. cocky lady

    cocky lady Well-Known Member
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    You know that for fact? Not doubting but wondering if that's accurate! I'm not a fan of Spurrier because of how he quit working & left our cupboard dry before we realized it, but from all indications he was pretty much on the up & up from what I always heard about him! Also, he had much more appeal during those earlier years than Dabo who started bringing in a bunch of 5-stars (mostly out of Fla) when Clemson was middle-of-the-pack ACC - no football paradise! Maybe ALL are paying recruits but have to wonder to what extent. IMO the NCAA selects schools to investigate (turn the other cheek) in conferences where they need certain schools to be strong versus others who get REALLY punished when caught! Might be wrong but it seems that way!
     
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  7. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow Member
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    Tons of kids say this, regardless of where they commit. Gary Gray ring a bell? I hope DJ can have a positive influence on recruiting, and I can see how players could be influenced by a close friend, but obviously I have no idea how close DJ is to XT, Stephon Wynn, or any other player we are recruiting.
     
  8. Rod Dangerfield

    Rod Dangerfield Well-Known Member
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  9. umdterpcock

    umdterpcock Well-Known Member
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    Dude really? Trying to say XT hasn't accepted impermissible benefits is like trying to say OJ didn't kill Nicole and Ron.

    Im not bashing a kid who took something, I don't do that because I haven't had to walk in their shoes. But to think he's on the up and up and hasn't been financially rewarded some way for his commitment to Clemson is pretty "not smart".
     
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  10. coolcock2001

    coolcock2001 Well-Known Member
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    I don't get if XT "grew up a Gamecock fan" why he didn't commit here. Clearly we need you XT
     
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  11. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    Hard to square that with the fact that Alabama has been on probation 3 times in the last two decades.
     
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  12. cocky lady

    cocky lady Well-Known Member
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    The SEC has a LOT more moneymakers than the ACC!
     
  13. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    Yeah, that's not really a good explanation.

    As far as I'm aware, the last three Big Ten schools to get probation were Ohio St, Michigan, and Penn St.
     
  14. cocky lady

    cocky lady Well-Known Member
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    How long ago?
     
  15. 92Pony

    92Pony Well-Known Member
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  16. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    Michigan got 3 years probation in 2010. Ohio St in 2012. Penn St is obvious.
     
  17. jimnasium

    jimnasium Well-Known Member
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    I somewhat beg to differ Grad. Just because a recruit might not NEED the money doesn't mean he won't take it. As for the 12,000 at our spring game we were in the final four and a lot just didn't go. Why wouldn't Clemson have 50,000 at their game heck the place should have be standing room only with a ring ceremony going on. I wasn't there when XT chose Clemson but I wasn't there when Watson decided either but they both looked fishy. Either the $$$ flows freely or Dabo and his staff are the best recruiters in the world and that ain't likely. All of a sudden over the past few years the best of the best choose Clemson? Just a gut feeling something is amiss.
     
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  18. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    If God himself came down from on high, and proclaimed neither of the players got paid by Clemson, you still wouldn't believe it. You just automatically believe anything bad about Clemson because you are a Carolina fan.

    It's funny you think it's fishy that Clemson has been getting good recruits for the past few years, but you don't think it's fishy that out of the blue, Carolina started getting recruits like Alshon Jeffrey, Jadeveon Clowney, DJ Swearinger, Marcus Lattimore. This after Spurrier had mediocre results his first 5 years.

    On top of that, if Clemson's always been paying players, then why were they so God-awful in the 90s under Tommy West? Or mediocre under Tommy Bowden? Remember the days of Nealon Greene and Willie Simmons? I've sure tried to forget them. So what, did they pay players in the 80s, forget how to do it for 20 years, and just now figure it out again?
     
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  19. mbsurfside

    mbsurfside Well-Known Member
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    And UNC didn't cheat. We weren't there so it must not have happened. You were pulling 5 stars out if Fla with a crappy record. Just because you aren't being investigated doesn't mean stuff isn't happening. Look st Louisville. That stuff was probably going on for years. But until they got caught who knew but it was going on. I also believe most schools probably give benefits to recruits in one form or another including us. Can I prove it ? No I'm not in the room but common sense tells you it's happening
     
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  20. CockFamily6

    CockFamily6 Member
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    I think it boils down to boosters that make things happen. I don't believe most coaching staffs are directly involved because it would be career suicide. I also don't think it takes millions of dollars just steady untraceable cash and some favors here and there for the right circle of close friends/relatives. It still comes back to recruiting at some point because if a lot of folks are doing it the program has to distinguish itself to the player some how. I just want us to have relatively equal footing in the pursuit of players...whatever that is.
     
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  21. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    And again, explain to me Alshon Jeffrey, Jadeveon Clowney, DJ Swearinger, Marcus Lattimore, etc. Everything you say about Clemson applies to South Carolina as well.
     
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  22. cocky lady

    cocky lady Well-Known Member
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    A while back! I thought so! And what was the punishment? A slap on the hand? And, yes, Penn St. is a little different than the rest!
     
  23. cocky lady

    cocky lady Well-Known Member
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    Not really! We did have a legend, Steve Spurrier at the helm then - well respected and a hall-of-famer - whereas Clemson had (when they were middle-of-the-pack ACC - not exactly a football paradise at the time with a used car salesman coach who was basically a nobody in sports - leading them)! Just worlds apart in recruiting at the time when Clemson was losing bigtime yet they were bringing in 5-star recruits from Fla "selecting - not recruiting" (Dabo's words)! If those don't raise eyebrows, nothing will!
     
  24. mbsurfside

    mbsurfside Well-Known Member
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    Would the truck have to go back to their booster ?
     
  25. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    Six years ago is "awhile back" now? Please enlighten me on all the "little guys" who have gotten probation during this time. Ohio St received a post-season ban, just 5 years ago. (You recall they went 12-0 in 2012, but didn't play for he conference title or a bowl.)

    Your claim was that the NCAA is selective in its punishment of the bigger schools in a given conference. Well, the facts simply prove you incorrect. Alabama (about the biggest name in college football much less the SEC) has gotten probation 3 times in the last 2 decades. Michigan, Ohio St, and Penn St, the most prominent names in the Big Ten, are the last three I'm aware of to receive probation. According to your theory, it should be Vanderbilt and Purdue, not Alabama and Ohio St getting probation. The facts simply don't support your argument.

    Yeah, really. Having a legend in Lou Holtz didn't even result in a 10-win season. Spurrier was mediocre in his first 5 years at South Carolina. Spurrier averaged 7 wins and 5.6 losses during his first 5 years. If Will Muschamp has the same level of "success" in 5 years, he won't even be here.

    So Spurrier being a legend didn't bring in top recruits for 5 years. Then all of a sudden, a bunch of NFL-caliber players show up. Then those guys leave, and Spurrier can't recruit to replace them. Yeah, doesn't look suspicious at all.

    Both of your arguments are not based on logic or evidence, but are based on emotion and bias.
     
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  26. mbsurfside

    mbsurfside Well-Known Member
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    I didn't see them riding around in big trucks. Heck Clowney drove a used car until he signed with an agent. Also we were not pulling in 5 stars from fla so not apples to apples. Look Magellan I'm not saying we have not given benefits. It's just schools like Auburn and Clemson are at a whole different level
     
  27. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    "Clowney drove a used car." So does this guy. From what everyone has said on the thread so far, this car is 5 or 6 years old, maybe more. You mean buying a used car (several years at that) is being at a "whole different level?"

    And yeah, it is apples to apples. You can't claim it's unusual for Clemson to get high level players, but then say it's not unusual for South Carolina. Alshon Jeffrey chose South Carolina over Southern Cal. Tell me the last time South Carolina, or Clemson for that matter, was able to protect in-state talent. Remember in the 90s,Tennessee and Florida St used to raid the state of talent year after year. That's not even counting what Georgia used to do. But all of a sudden, that magically stopped?
     
  28. tl from little hell

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    If that's the case, we must not be paying market.
     
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  29. gfluvsthecocks

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    Guys, the bottom line is that whether they're paying athletes or not, recruiting at the highest level takes relationships. Relationships take time. Clemsons staff has had 7 years.

    Spurrier ran a clean program. It took him 5 years to get enough pieces. Lattimore and Gilmore were the first big ones along with Devontae Holloman, (who just happened to be teammates and friends with Gilmore and Clowney). We won the East. Lattimore looked like a Heisman candidate. All of that led to a huge bump in recruiting. Had our staff put forward half of the effort of Muschamp then we would still be at the pinnacle.

    Similarly, Clemson has benefitted tremendously from Spiller, Sammy Watkins, Deshaun Watson, Vic Beasley, Mike Williams, etc. Kids grow up as fans of impact players, not just team's. Look at the way people talk about the NBA. It is less about the team and more about the Superstars. CU did a great job of attracting a few stars and now people view the school as a place that will get you to the next level, true or not that is the perception. They also won their conference Championship often because the ACC sucked.

    I will admit that it is likely they bought those Florida boys early on, but at this point it has paid off and has not been proven. I don't know if they pay players now or not. But neither does most anyone else here either. What I do know is that saying XT chose Clemson because they paid him or he has a truck seems like sour grapes and we need to stop belittling 17 year olds.

    XT respects DJ and vice versa. If anyone can sway XT, it is probably him and Muschamp. I doubt XT changes his mind but everyone needs to just let it play out.
     
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  30. mbsurfside

    mbsurfside Well-Known Member
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    You really are sharp as a marble. I shouldnt expect anything more from a Clemson fan. It's much more difficult to pull 5 star recruits from out of state than it is from inside your state. Now you signing a 5 star now from out of state after winning is much less questionable. When your record was around .500 and you signed Spiller and Watkins, well it doesnt pass the smell test to me. That's just my opinion. I can see you are donning your orange glasses so dont expect you to be reasonable. If you think your school isnt stretching the rules well more power to you. I mentioned that pretty much all schools do that sort of thing. I was at the AF Academy and while I didnt see any benefits but what I did see them do was push through marginal students who were good at football. So I am not naive enough to believe it doesnt go on everywhere. I just think some schools, (Clemson Auburn etc) are blatant and will do whatever it takes. Dont get all worked up when someone says something about your school. After all this is a Gamecocks board.
     
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  31. radcock

    radcock Well-Known Member
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    dont know if champ is paying kids, but spurrier was not
     
  32. BigTomE

    BigTomE Active Member
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    Easy to explain, Alshon Jeffrey is from St Mathews, SC. Clowney is from Rock Hill, SC. Gilmore is from Rock Hill, SC. Lattimore is from Duncan, SC. DJ Swearinger is from Greenwood, SC.

    Nice try tater, but again you're stretching to try and make a comparison.
     
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  33. wallycock

    wallycock Well-Known Member
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    Ok. You're either an idiot or you are under the age of 35. We Gamecock fans think bad things of Clemson because Clemson has done very bad things more than just once. Charlie Pell and Danny Ford's tenure produced 2 NCAA probations for some of the most aggregious institutionally sponsored violations in providing improper benefits to players ever documented by the NCAA. Ken Hatfield followed Ford, and he cleaned all the crap up, and was not only hated for doing so, but run out of Clemson as well. So, Clemson hired one of Danny's boys, but he couldn't compete without cheating, and Clemson ran him out too. You turned to Tommy Bowden who won more than those that followed Ford, but no championships of any kind. By this time, 20 years passed since the glory days when money flowed, and so did victories. The cheating supposedly stopped after the 2nd probation, and coincidentally so the championships. Bowden is canned, and along comes Dabo Gump who promises to put Clempson back on the map. After the 2010 season, Clempson is going nowhere when on national signing day in 2011 they land (3) 5-star players and (6) 4-stars. 2 of the 4-stars were from SC, all the rest came from FL, VA, and NC. All of the great players out of HS that USC signed during our great run were from SC! Why the NCAA didn't raise any questions about the Clempson's recruiting anomaly in 2011 is beyond me. So Dabo Gump has put Clempson back on the map like Charlie Pell and Danny Ford. It's pretty coincidental that they all played football at Alabama, the most penalized football program in the history of the NCAA! So yeah, we have every reason to believe that Clempson has returned to the practices that brought them all of their glory to begin with.

    So having said all of that, are you an idiot or are you just too young to know Clempson's real history?

    Here's a link to educate you in just some of Clempson's shenanigans that covered just basketball, which I haven't even gotten into.

    https://www.si.com/vault/1982/03/08/616473/the-descent-of-a-man
     
  34. mavcock

    mavcock Well-Known Member
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    Excellent post.
     
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  35. mbsurfside

    mbsurfside Well-Known Member
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    And in reality where is the motivation not to. I mean the Holes are getting away with it and other schools are too
     
  36. topdecktiger

    topdecktiger Well-Known Member
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    No, my position is much more reasonable. South Carolina didn't have a history of pulling in top in-state recruits either. The truth is, the top in-state talent has tended to go out of state. Yet all of a sudden, a slew of NFL-level talent shows up in this one period of time, when South Carolina was around.500, you know, like you are saying with Clemson.

    I also agree with you that thing go on everywhere. I don't agree that there is something particularly sinister at Clemson. Think about it. At Clemson, you basically just have to get through Florida St every year, and you can wind up in a major bowl/playoffs. Then Clemson, unlike most other ACC schools, can offer facilities comparable to some SEC schools. Pretty good pitch to make to a recruit. Maybe change your point of view every now and then, and you might not see conspiracies around every corner.

    No, I'm not stretching the comparison at all. Those players weren't coming to South Carolina before, and they haven't been coming after. You have this one glaring period that sticks out like a sore thumb.

    I'm fully aware of Clemson's prior probation. It's not "some of the most aggregious institutionally sponsored violations in providing improper benefits to players ever documented by the NCAA." You have plenty of other schools that have committed equal or more serious infractions. Here's a little tidbit for you. 30 schools at the FBS level have won national championships in football. Of those 30, only one (BYU) has never been on probation.

    Here's the real truth. The reason you think Clemson is cheating is because you're jealous. Your jealous Clemson has been so successful against Carolina, and your jealous that Clemson has won 2 national championships and Carolina has zero.

    By the way, here's another little tidbit for you. One school in the state of South Carolina has ever been stripped of a title in football. (Hint: It's not Clemson.)
     
  37. Goldhunter

    Goldhunter Member
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    All schools pay, I work with a guy that played basketball at middle Tennessee state and he told me that people would come up and give them money. It's usually not the coaches so Spurrier wouldn't have had anything to do with it. It's a lot of moving parts in sports and big money boosters grease the wheels. People can believe what they want but our boosters are paying too, you can't tell me middle Tennessee state pays and we don't. Not saying you said that, just giving some information I have from someone that would know.
     
  38. funktavious

    funktavious Well-Known Member
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    We had some good players in that timespan but class rankings by Rivals were 12,24, and 18. The state produced some really good players in those classes. USC's highest ranked players have almost always come from within the state. It's not like we went down into Florida or Georgia and pulled 5 star players.
     
  39. mbsurfside

    mbsurfside Well-Known Member
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    Yeah you're clueless. You came very close to death penalty after the transgressions of the 80s. You were either soiling your pants then or in serious denial. You still can't see difference in pulling 5 stars from Fla to instate recruits. That tells me everything I need to know about you
     
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  40. jimnasium

    jimnasium Well-Known Member
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    That is why I said "the last few years" those are Dabo years. Spurrier got his 5* recruits because he was Steve Spurrier the legend but later stopped working. Things kicked into another gear under Dabo but it was the same Clemson under Bowden, where were the big name players then? You can judge the future of Clemson by its past and I am old enough to remember their teams of the 80's. BTW if God told me Clemson was on the up and up I would believe him but he is silent on this like he was in the 80's.
     

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