Virginia Dept of Ed Cancels Advanced Math

[BigWillieCock]

This is correct, I love when people have outrage about something conpletely inaccurate

it’s very ironic that there are posts about people claiming “THEY ARE DUMBING DOWN OUR SOCIETY” and they can’t be bothered to actually read what they are losing

Seriously I can’t get over how perfect it is some posters are claiming the government is trying to make us dumb while displaying pure ignorance about what is

Nothing about that is comparable.

Sure it is. Maybe you make more money than me or maybe I make more money than you. We should make the same money now and figure out who makes more money later.

How is that fair? I mean we are talking equity right?

All of this is about equity, their words not mine.

Pretend I’m a 5 year old child (you already think I am anyway) and explain like you would to a 5 year old what equity is. It’s a slippery slop

Basically yeah, and it’s a common thing students for whatever reason (bad previous educators, late development, taking school more seriously) are often forced to take classes below their ability because they don’t “qualify” traditionally and/or their current schedule/tract is full.

the students that excel in math early will still be able to take all the classes they want/need

Your lady statement isn’t accurate. This is the entire point. If it actually were what they were selling, then yeah, maybe. But what they are saying and doing are different things.

per Ian Serotkin Loudoun County School Board Member


"[A]s currently planned, this initiative will eliminate ALL math acceleration prior to 11th grade," he said. "That is not an exaggeration, nor does there appear to be any discretion in how local districts implement this. All 6th graders will take Foundational Concepts 6. All 7th graders will take Foundational Concepts 7. All 10th graders will take Essential Concepts 10. Only in 11th and 12th grade is there any opportunity for choice in higher math courses."

 

[duckcock2.0.0]

For example I had one student I tried to put in an elevated program because previously he never had a teacher push him - and he was absolutely crushing all the material I threw at him.

i told him to apply for honors, told the school that I recommended him - and because of logistics, they wouldn’t let him

See, that is maddening. I went through a public school syster in South Carolina, and the gifted tract seemed to start around 5th or 6th grade. I never did well enough in school up to the 8th grade, mostly due to lowlife bullies, to qualify for it. But I always excelled at math, and I had a teacher in junior high advocate for me to be able to take honors math classes in high school. I was a chemistry major at USC, and I think those classes were a great foundation for me in that regard. But I wasn't even considering such a thing until that teacher...shout out to Mrs. Bogan!!!...recommended I take those classes and saw to it I got in them.

 

[feeble2001]

Sure it is. Maybe you make more money than me or maybe I make more money than you. We should make the same money now and figure out who makes more money later.

How is that fair? I mean we are talking equity right?

All of this is about equity, their words not mine.

Pretend I’m a 5 year old child (you already think I am anyway) and explain like you would to a 5 year old what equity is. It’s a slippery slop

Your lady statement isn’t accurate. This is the entire point. If it actually were what they were selling, then yeah, maybe. But what they are saying and doing are different things.

per Ian Serotkin Loudoun County School Board Member


"[A]s currently planned, this initiative will eliminate ALL math acceleration prior to 11th grade," he said. "That is not an exaggeration, nor does there appear to be any discretion in how local districts implement this. All 6th graders will take Foundational Concepts 6. All 7th graders will take Foundational Concepts 7. All 10th graders will take Essential Concepts 10. Only in 11th and 12th grade is there any opportunity for choice in higher math courses."

That example still makes no sense and yeah that quote did not discredit anything I said 0/2

 

[feeble2001]

See, that is maddening. I went through a public school syster in South Carolina, and the gifted tract seemed to start around 5th or 6th grade. I never did well enough in school up to the 8th grade, mostly due to lowlife bullies, to qualify for it. But I always excelled at math, and I had a teacher in junior high advocate for me to be able to take honors math classes in high school. I was a chemistry major at USC, and I think those classes were a great foundation for me in that regard. But I wasn't even considering such a thing until that teacher...shout out to Mrs. Bogan!!!...recommended I take those classes and saw to it I got in them.

For sure and that’s why this program might be beneficial so that students like you won’t have to have the luck of a teacher recognizing and recommending them in order to gain access to advance courses

 

[Balwiles]

The amount of blindspots in today's education is stunning:

+ No personal finance / investing classes
+ No sales training classes
+ No self-care classes while physical education & recess are all but dead (imagine if a healthy mind was tied to a healthy body?)
+ No problem-solving based learning / creative though innovation classes

These are basic tools of life.

Meanwhile subjects that have very little to do with your day-to-day quality of existence (e.g. History) sit at the forefront?

Pretty incredible.

Inmates running the asylum.

 

[BigWillieCock]

The amount of blindspots in today's education is stunning:

+ No personal finance / investing classes
+ No sales training classes
+ No self-care classes while physical education & recess are all but dead (imagine if a healthy mind was tied to a healthy body?)
+ No problem-solving based learning / creative though innovation classes

These are basic tools of life.

Meanwhile subjects that have very little to do with your day-to-day quality of existence (e.g. History) sit at the forefront?

Pretty incredible.

Inmates running the asylum.

Understand your point. For instance I was almost 30 before knowing how to do basic home maintenance things because my school didn’t offer shop class which would be practical.

But I disagree about history. Without the context of history it’s my opinion we are doomed to repeat it.

 

[BigWillieCock]

That example still makes no sense and yeah that quote did not discredit anything I said 0/2

I’ll leave it here. First thanks for being respectful although we disagree. Second, I don’t like discussions where one side says x and the others side says well I haven’t proven anything but you haven’t discredited it. I appreciate the civil back and forth.

 

[feeble2001]

I’ll leave it here. First thanks for being respectful although we disagree. Second, I don’t like discussions where one side says x and the others side says well I haven’t proven anything but you haven’t discredited it. I appreciate the civil back and forth.

Okay I’ll explain why it doesn’t make sense since you are being reasonable!

no one is taking the grades or classes from the students they are just restructuring it so that late bloomers will also have access to these classes that are paramount for them to have a career/degree in STEM focused majors.

your example implies they are taking those spots from students and giving it to others which is not the case at all

 

[cocks rule]

We are now literally becoming the dumbest country in the world. No advanced math until the 11th grade STATEWIDE.

It’s an effort to “improve equity in mathematics learning opportunities”.

I suppose I should be ashamed of the advanced Algebra, Geometry and Trig I took in 8th-10th grade.

PS- it wasn’t all that advanced by the way, pretty easy. College math on the other hand kicked my butt. I expect college math will dumb down too. What can go wrong?

Public education is over, done, stick a fork in it. Self education is the only true education anyway. No wasted time, just the information that’s relative to your focus of study. Much more efficient and effective.

If I had kids today they would never see the inside of any public schools.

 

[atlanta cock#]

Ah yes, the infamous "they" and the extremely vague threat of "control" - with the concession that there is real fear that nothing can be done. You sir win internet conspiracy theory bingo for today!

Ignoring your smug response, how can you defend the decision?

 

[BigWillieCock]

Okay I’ll explain why it doesn’t make sense since you are being reasonable!

no one is taking the grades or classes from the students they are just restructuring it so that late bloomers will also have access to these classes that are paramount for them to have a career/degree in STEM focused majors.

your example implies they are taking those spots from students and giving it to others which is not the case at all

I’m not trying to say that necessarily.

After Hurricane Hugo I had to go to another school for most of 7th grade. That school wasn’t great and didn’t offer any “advanced” programs. I was in basic track. Not only was I bored because I’d learned most of it one year earlier, the students in basic never stood a chance...to your point.

What I am saying is that if the true intention is to pick up those left behind, there are many ways to do that, starting with actual teacher accountability and many other areas of administrative failures in schools. This way is homogeny, which just isn’t the real world. Hence my salary equity comment.

You seem to have a reasonable interest in the subject. If you’d like to gain additional insight on what is really wrong in our school systems, I’d encourage you to watch The Cartel. It’s an eye opening documentary that examines the education system in New Jersey (which at the time it was made spent more per pupil than almost anywhere in the world).

We can debate Virginia as we did today. Or you can watch a documentary about New Jersey. Or we can look nearly anywhere. It’s a largely broken system.

Im simply saying both things (helping those behind and advancing those ahead) are possible at the same time. I’m simply saying this isn’t the answer. It’s more complicated than that. There will be a dumbing down unintended consequence. If for no other reason then parents will move and budgets will shrink. The left behind will stay behind.

Thank you for the expanded explanation.

 

[feeble2001]

I’m not trying to say that necessarily.

After Hurricane Hugo I had to go to another school for most of 7th grade. That school wasn’t great and didn’t offer any “advanced” programs. I was in basic track. Not only was I bored because I’d learned most of it one year earlier, the students in basic never stood a chance...to your point.

What I am saying is that if the true intention is to pick up those left behind, there are many ways to do that, starting with actual teacher accountability and many other areas of administrative failures in schools. This way is homogeny, which just isn’t the real world. Hence my salary equity comment.

You seem to have a reasonable interest in the subject. If you’d like to gain additional insight on what is really wrong in our school systems, I’d encourage you to watch The Cartel. It’s an eye opening documentary that examines the education system in New Jersey (which at the time it was made spent more per pupil than almost anywhere in the world).

We can debate Virginia as we did today. Or you can watch a documentary about New Jersey. Or we can look nearly anywhere. It’s a largely broken system.

Im simply saying both things (helping those behind and advancing those ahead) are possible at the same time. I’m simply saying this isn’t the answer. It’s more complicated than that. There will be a dumbing down unintended consequence. If for no other reason then parents will move and budgets will shrink. The left behind will stay behind.

Thank you for the expanded explanation.

I literally have a masters degree in education theory and practice. I’m well aware of our issues structurally and curriculum wise.

honestly this fixes the system - students in 11/12th grade who are not going to use math as their major dont need to be in those classes and unless they are very self-aware they won’t realize this until around this time when they are more seriously considering college.

alternatively it will also help students that are late bloomers that need those classes for their intended career/profession

this is the most efficient use of class time and space

 

[BigWillieCock]

I literally have a masters degree in education theory and practice. I’m well aware of our issues structurally and curriculum wise.

honestly this fixes the system - students in 11/12th grade who are not going to use math as their major dont need to be in those classes and unless they are very self-aware they won’t realize this until around this time when they are more seriously considering college.

alternatively it will also help students that are late bloomers that need those classes for their intended career/profession

this is the most efficient use of class time and space

So in this view, if you are saying the output is having kids better prepared for what is next, what is your opinion on other education systems in the world that truly do this?

For instance a good friend from South Africa had to choose their career path as our equivalent of a 10th grader. The last two years of ‘high school’ were essentially his freshman and sophomore years in our college system. Core classes for his eventual major or engineering. Then in university it was advanced engineering from day one.

It at least a makes sense to me that the input results in a specific output.

 

[lostcock]

I got news, Virginia is about 9th in the US in education while SC continually hums along in about 64th place, so tell me, what have they been doing here for YEARS now, in all classes?

 

[feeble2001]

So in this view, if you are saying the output is having kids better prepared for what is next, what is your opinion on other education systems in the world that truly do this?

For instance a good friend from South Africa had to choose their career path as our equivalent of a 10th grader. The last two years of ‘high school’ were essentially his freshman and sophomore years in our college system. Core classes for his eventual major or engineering. Then in university it was advanced engineering from day one.

It at least a makes sense to me that the input results in a specific output.

I think a lot of countries have much better systems put in place. They are actually implementing similar types of those systems in EL and other pedagogical philosophies

I also think less emphasis on standardized testing would be very beneficial there is too much stress on rote memorization and not actual knowledge and skills built on inquiry

also another thing we are slowly pushing towards, very slowly

 

[feeble2001]

I got news, Virginia is about 9th in the US in education while SC continually hums along in about 64th place, so tell me, what have they been doing here for YEARS now, in all classes?

It’s a lot of what we don’t do. We don’t adjust and change to new studies and practices that work everywhere else.

 

[BigWillieCock]

I think a lot of countries have much better systems put in place. They are actually implementing similar types of those systems in EL and other pedagogical philosophies

I also think less emphasis on standardized testing would be very beneficial there is too much stress on rote memorization and not actual knowledge and skills built on inquiry

also another thing we are slowly pushing towards, very slowly

Standardized testing. Finally a point of agreement.

I’d imagine in a theoretical world, we might be surprised on what we agree on. Most people who know me are surprised at my theoretical opinions on issues. Unfortunately I have this nagging life lesson that has slapped me in the face over four decades that the real world is a whole different situation. I tend to operate in the real world which makes me skeptical of most things.

Good luck in your endeavors. You are fighting an battlefield against well entrenched politics and bureaucracy. Whether we agree or not, status quo is not an option.

 

[McCock]

You were in fact respectful in your disagreement and I will respond with respect.

You posted “your post is an inaccurate oversimplification of what VA is trying to do.”

My response-

Leslie Sale, director of the Virginia Education Department's office of policy “This is about ... how and where graduation requirements can operate as a lever for equity. So, first, we're going to start with...the possibility of consolidating the standard and advanced studies diploma."

The majority of advanced-diploma earners in 2019 were Asian (79%) and White (63%), according to Sale's presentation. Among minority students, 44% of Hispanic learners, 40% of Black students and 35% of "economically disadvantaged" students received advanced degrees.

So I guess it’s all the Asian’s fault. Although odd that 4 of 10 black students and 1/3 of economically disadvantaged students somehow got by in this horribly inequitable system.

Did you know that they already reduced the types of advanced diplomas from 6 to 3 in 2011 to “close the equity gap”?

So explain to me how removing advanced classes and diplomas is helping that cause?


Though you were mostly respectful you seem to assert I only read a headline. In fact I read 3 articles to try and see the story from all the spin angles.

I understand your point on the flashy headline like “Trump incites sedition”. We do unfortunately live in that society right and left.

I can't speak to the purpose for eliminating advanced diplomas, and that really is unrelated to the math curriculum changes. As a former educator and spouse of a current one, I would guess that, as much as equity, that has to do with administrative cost vs. student benefit (i.e., no college really cares what diploma a student gets... admissions are generally made based on standardized test scores and GPA).

But getting back to the core subject, as I skimmed through the first few Google returns (Fox News, Daily Wire, Bacon Rebellion), it became clear that there was a ton of agenda-driven secondary source material regarding the curriculum. As I do whenever that happens (which seems to be more and more these days, as news media is almost universally agenda-driven, and those agendas seem to strengthen with each passing day), I tend to go to the primary source and trust what I'm seeing with my own eyes more than the view through a "journalist's" glasses. Here is an excerpt of the actual description of the math curriculum from the Va. Dept. of Education's website with a few particularly pertinent portions highlighted (https://www.doe.virginia.gov/instruction/mathematics/vmpi/VMPI for vdoe website.docx):

VMPI is a proposal to modernize and update Virginia’s mathematics curriculum in grades K-12 to align instruction with the essential knowledge and skills students need to succeed in the 21st century economy. The proposals would update Virginia's Mathematics Standards of Learning and Virginia’s public school divisions would then be responsible for creating courses and designing curricula to implement those state standards, as they do now.

VMPI maintains Virginia’s rigorous mathematics instruction for all students and strives to provide all students with opportunities to receive high quality, highly-relevant math instruction that is tailored to their specific post-secondary goals.

The implementation of VMPI would still allow for student acceleration in mathematics content according to ability and achievement. It does not dictate how and when students take specific courses. Those decisions remain with students and school divisions based on individualized learning needs.

The traditional high school pathway culminating in the study of Calculus or other advanced courses is not being eliminated. Additional course pathways will include engaging semester courses in statistics, data science, modeling, design, and logic, among others.

Local school divisions will still have plenty of flexibility to create courses aligned to the standards to meet the needs of all students; and provide opportunities for all students to advance through the curriculum based on their learning needs. School divisions will also be able to offer advanced sections and acceleration through the courses.

VMPI will increase rigor by integrating mathematical content and concepts, emphasizing reasoning and problem solving, and providing a highly-relevant experience for all students. It will also include a new focus on statistical literacy, essential for success in a data-rich world.

VMPI proposes math standards in kindergarten through high school that focus on reasoning, real-world problem solving, communication, and conceptual connections while shifting away from an emphasis on computation and routine problem practice.

The VMPI initiative imagines math instruction for students that integrates existing math content into blended courses for students typically in grades 8-10.

The content from Algebra 1, Geometry, and Algebra 2 is not being eliminated by VMPI, but rather the content of these courses will be blended into a seamless progression of connected learning. This encourages students to connect mathematical concepts and develop a much deeper and more relevant understanding of each concept within its context and relevance.

Honestly, when I read the source material directly, I don't find support for the conclusion that you reached about the math curriculum (once again, I know nothing about the diploma requirements). Your conclusion does align rather closely with the sources noted above, though, but I certainly beg your pardon if I was mistaken about what informed your belief.

 

[BigWillieCock]

I can't speak to the purpose for eliminating advanced diplomas, and that really is unrelated to the math curriculum changes. As a former educator and spouse of a current one, I would guess that, as much as equity, that has to do with administrative cost vs. student benefit (i.e., no college really cares what diploma a student gets... admissions are generally made based on standardized test scores and GPA).

But getting back to the core subject, as I skimmed through the first few Google returns (Fox News, Daily Wire, Bacon Rebellion), it became clear that there was a ton of agenda-driven secondary source material regarding the curriculum. As I do whenever that happens (which seems to be more and more these days, as news media is almost universally agenda-driven, and those agendas seem to strengthen with each passing day), I tend to go to the primary source and trust what I'm seeing with my own eyes more than the view through a "journalist's" glasses. Here is an excerpt of the actual description of the math curriculum from the Va. Dept. of Education's website with a few particularly pertinent portions highlighted (https://www.doe.virginia.gov/instruction/mathematics/vmpi/VMPI for vdoe website.docx):

VMPI is a proposal to modernize and update Virginia’s mathematics curriculum in grades K-12 to align instruction with the essential knowledge and skills students need to succeed in the 21st century economy. The proposals would update Virginia's Mathematics Standards of Learning and Virginia’s public school divisions would then be responsible for creating courses and designing curricula to implement those state standards, as they do now.

VMPI maintains Virginia’s rigorous mathematics instruction for all students and strives to provide all students with opportunities to receive high quality, highly-relevant math instruction that is tailored to their specific post-secondary goals.

The implementation of VMPI would still allow for student acceleration in mathematics content according to ability and achievement. It does not dictate how and when students take specific courses. Those decisions remain with students and school divisions based on individualized learning needs.

The traditional high school pathway culminating in the study of Calculus or other advanced courses is not being eliminated. Additional course pathways will include engaging semester courses in statistics, data science, modeling, design, and logic, among others.

Local school divisions will still have plenty of flexibility to create courses aligned to the standards to meet the needs of all students; and provide opportunities for all students to advance through the curriculum based on their learning needs. School divisions will also be able to offer advanced sections and acceleration through the courses.

VMPI will increase rigor by integrating mathematical content and concepts, emphasizing reasoning and problem solving, and providing a highly-relevant experience for all students. It will also include a new focus on statistical literacy, essential for success in a data-rich world.

VMPI proposes math standards in kindergarten through high school that focus on reasoning, real-world problem solving, communication, and conceptual connections while shifting away from an emphasis on computation and routine problem practice.

The VMPI initiative imagines math instruction for students that integrates existing math content into blended courses for students typically in grades 8-10.

The content from Algebra 1, Geometry, and Algebra 2 is not being eliminated by VMPI, but rather the content of these courses will be blended into a seamless progression of connected learning. This encourages students to connect mathematical concepts and develop a much deeper and more relevant understanding of each concept within its context and relevance.

Honestly, when I read the source material directly, I don't find support for the conclusion that you reached about the math curriculum (once again, I know nothing about the diploma requirements). Your conclusion does align rather closely with the sources noted above, though, but I certainly beg your pardon if I was mistaken about what informed your belief.

I appreciate the thoughtful and in depth reply.

Not that we will change each other’s minds, I suppose I just look at the forest as a whole more often than individual trees.

For one thing, according to the VA Dept of Ed own info graphic, the “gap” isn’t that wide. And we have school board members within VA stating the opposite of the the Dept is asserting in their official sales job.

Second, the timing of this change seems curious to me. We have reports of school districts de-emphasizing getting the right answer in math because

"white supremacy culture" allegedly "infiltrates math classrooms”

Such as “the focus is on getting the 'right' answer," students being "required to 'show their work,'" and other alleged manifestations.”

Additionally we have leaked training and classroom documents in VA promoting CRT. As well as private school enrollments decreasing where CRT pledges are being required.

I am not suggesting there is some overlord pulling a single set of strings. I am suggesting this is all politically motivated and somewhat connected.

Lastly, as I told another educator within this thread, good luck in your endeavors. We may debate the change needed, but change is needed. You have an uphill battle on your hands.

 

[tron1013]

And yet the fine folks of the Commonwealth can still tell that 28-0 is butt whooping. Not that I’m still sore over the 2018 Belk Bowl or anything.

 

[76gintcock]

Ah yes, the infamous "they" and the extremely vague threat of "control" - with the concession that there is real fear that nothing can be done. You sir win internet conspiracy theory bingo for today!

Well you explain it, know it all. Because the official explanation makes no sense. I promise you that nobody at my daughters' high school felt worse because our girls were in AP math classes. This whole equity thing is completely out of control. Wait until dweeby little kids demand to play varsity basketball.

 

[76gintcock]

the students that excel in math early will still be able to take all the classes they want/need

No they won't. That's the whole point.

 

[king ward]

Is this Virginia initiative not somewhat in the same spirit? It would seem to suggest an ideological pattern.

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

 

[Gamecock Lifer]

That example still makes no sense and yeah that quote did not discredit anything I said 0/2

It was a “feeble” attempt for sure 😉

 

[paladin181]

Exceptionalism has no value in a Socialist society.

Damn you for your Orange self making too much sense not to like. Take your +1.

 

[BigWillieCock]

It was a “feeble” attempt for sure 😉

Lifer,

You are an enigma wrapped in a riddle inside an enigma. Of your posts I see I agree with 50% of them. I just never know what I might agree with you on. It’s a coin toss. But I like the unpredictable nature of it. You fire zingers, but respectfully. All anyone can ask.

 

[Gamecock Lifer]

Lifer,

You are an enigma wrapped in a riddle inside an enigma. Of your posts I see I agree with 50% of them. I just never know what I might agree with you on. It’s a coin toss. But I like the unpredictable nature of it. You fire zingers, but respectfully. All anyone can ask.

Gotta keep ya’ll on your toes! 😂

 

[67gamecock]

We are now literally becoming the dumbest country in the world. No advanced math until the 11th grade STATEWIDE.

It’s an effort to “improve equity in mathematics learning opportunities”.

I suppose I should be ashamed of the advanced Algebra, Geometry and Trig I took in 8th-10th grade.

PS- it wasn’t all that advanced by the way, pretty easy. College math on the other hand kicked my butt. I expect college math will dumb down too. What can go wrong?

College (Freshman) math at Carolina was a jolt. I don't think I ever got over it. I still have nightmares about it 58 years later. Even now, when I'm on Gibbes Green or driving under the Pickens Street bridge, I won't look at Sloan College!

 

[GamecockJL]

I’m glad Virginia is doing this. You get what you vote for.

 

[atlanta cock#]

College (Freshman) math at Carolina was a jolt. I don't think I ever got over it. I still have nightmares about it 58 years later. Even now, when I'm on Gibbes Green or driving under the Pickens Street bridge, I won't look at Sloan College!

Dumbing down the population sounds anti-American to me.

 

[BigWillieCock]

College (Freshman) math at Carolina was a jolt. I don't think I ever got over it. I still have nightmares about it 58 years later. Even now, when I'm on Gibbes Green or driving under the Pickens Street bridge, I won't look at Sloan College!

Funny you mention that. I have a reoccurring nightmare related to Statistics at Sloan. I’ve had it every so often 20 years now.

 

[feeble2001]

No they won't. That's the whole point.

Where are you seeing that?

 

[alphazeta]

We are now literally becoming the dumbest country in the world. No advanced math until the 11th grade STATEWIDE.

It’s an effort to “improve equity in mathematics learning opportunities”.

I suppose I should be ashamed of the advanced Algebra, Geometry and Trig I took in 8th-10th grade.

PS- it wasn’t all that advanced by the way, pretty easy. College math on the other hand kicked my butt. I expect college math will dumb down too. What can go wrong?

Someone from "Sack Liner" criticizing VIRGINIA over education standards? That's like poop telling vomit it stinks.

 

[atlanta cock#]

Someone from "Sack Liner" criticizing VIRGINIA over education standards? That's like poop telling vomit it stinks.

Doesn’t change the fact it’s an asinine decision.

 

[feeble2001]

Doesn’t change the fact it’s an asinine decision.

Or maybe they are following research and studies which they historically have which is why they are one of the best states in education

 

[Lurker123]

Haven't researched, so I'll leave the he said she said alone.

But IF they are postponing kids getting into the advanced track, I would be against it. As a parent, part of the allure of my kids in those classes is to separate them from students who arent interested or focused in academics. This has all sorts of benefits for them.

If the same track is still offered, but other kids can jump in later, seems like no big deal.

 

[fowl_mood]

Whatever your political persuasion, the public school system is in rapid decline, and has been for sometime. The overall loss of faith in the system coupled with trying to repair every societal I'll, including bad parenting and social conflicts, has sucked the life out of teachers and demotivated good students.

Chasing the repair of societal ills in the classroom is the last nail for many parents. We are about to see three large, divergent systems: public, private and homeschooling. We are probably on the cusp of a similar alignment at the University level, though that is slower.

The politicization of all things inevitably leads to the destruction of free and civil societies. And we are now "hyperpoliticized."

 

[Blackland]

The Idiocracy has been coming for a while now, the last election just made it permanent.

 

[Dizzy01]

Whatever your political persuasion, the public school system is in rapid decline, and has been for sometime. The overall loss of faith in the system coupled with trying to repair every societal I'll, including bad parenting and social conflicts, has sucked the life out of teachers and demotivated good students.

Chasing the repair of societal ills in the classroom is the last nail for many parents. We are about to see three large, divergent systems: public, private and homeschooling. We are probably on the cusp of a similar alignment at the University level, though that is slower.

The politicization of all things inevitably leads to the destruction of free and civil societies. And we are now "hyperpoliticized."

While I’ll agree with the overall sentiment with a lot of this there is a large population of the people that flee to private school that are the bad parents. I’ve heard countless times about the kids with single parents or disinterested parents but the real issue is little Jonny’s parents. They get tired of people not recognizing how special Johnny is despite the fact in 5th grade he can’t spell his name and has he told constantly to stop wiping boogers on his desk.

Removing discipline from schools is an issue but it was driven by the “good” parents who refused to accept their kids were a problem.

 

[BigWillieCock]

Someone from "Sack Liner" criticizing VIRGINIA over education standards? That's like poop telling vomit it stinks.

Cool story. Thank you.