When asked in post game what he thought of the play calling
- Thread starter cadcock
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And? Aside from the goal line debacle what would you have called differently and why do you think it would have worked?
Are you really trying to defend an offense where the best pass of the day was thrown by the punter?
And this wasn’t some type of surprise. This offense has SUCKED all season.
Well I would start with some form of up tempo offense with a more innovative passing attack. I would also give JuJu a lot more touches that attacked the edges more often. I do not see any semblance of an offensive identity. Please tell me what identity our offense has had over the last 6 games?
What in particular? Execution poor or calls poor?
I think certain things were better and other things were worse. He's using the edges better each week and Doty seems more confident. Doty seemed to throw more hospital balls this week than last week so the middle was less effective. Aside from the long 3rd down run, Doty still seems to be making some bad decisions after he starts running (sliding early, checking up for some reason) -- could be a staff issue if they're making him do something but we'll never know.
The thing that was worse was the short side runs to the right. I'm not sure what he was seeing with some of those calls. I don't have the 22 view that he does but I think if it was a setup for other things then you had the opportunity to roll left (I know if hurts Doty's already questionable accuracy) but a throw to TE or run. Media people will have access to him this week and maybe there will be better answers.
I didn't say they have an offensive identity. They are transitioning from unconsciously incompetent to consciously incompetent right now in a lot of ways and it's going to be hard to watch.
I disagree with the up tempo. I don't think we have the weapons or OL competence to execute up tempo right now. Hell, it still doesn't look like Doty can make all the reads. He's getting better but he still misses some things.
That's not even remotely the same thing. That would be like a poster on the UMass board wondering why their offense still sucks. If you want to say scheme, then that's fine, it's your opinion but in terms of calls, I'm wondering what calls were so bad.
That is why you hire a coach that has a good understanding of what he wants to run. Leach, Kiffen, Briles etc. know what they want to be and coach / challenge their teams to execute it. Leach typically has a rough first year but then perform better. I do not see that we are developing towards an identity all I see is a book of dis-connected plays that don’t even set the D up for any other plays. Bobo was much better even if you didn’t like his offense it did have an identity.
Maybe not up tempo, but at least keep the RB and WRs in for a series instead of rampant substitution
What did you like about the Jordan Burch pass? Did you like the fact that they took the ball out of the QBs hands to throw. If you have any confidence in your QB you trust him to make a throw.
Or did you like the fact that it showed we had no confidence or ability to run the ball in despite rushing plays getting us down the field on that drive?
The execution sucked as well. Burch should have been drilled to never underthrow that pass.
I understand what you're saying but I disagree. He is implementing a pro style offense, which is much different from the pin and pull running game from last year. We are having competency problems that are affecting both the calls and the execution. It's hard to tell between Kentucky and Tennessee because of the defenses but it appears he is using the edges better with running backs both running and throwing the ball. Sorry, it's going to take a little while if it's even going to work. I'm just wondering if from an actual play call standpoint, someone is seeing something different than I am.
I completely opened my part of the discussion describing it as a debacle. I also don't like running surprise two-point play gimmicks in goal situations where (1) you're down 14-0 and (2) you haven't been lighting things up anyway.
My point with the original post was to point out a large disconnect from Beamer’s view and what I see which is very bad play calling and offense scheme for the first 6 games. I don’t see any identity that we are building towards and I don’t even see an offense that is tailored to the talent we do have. Vann was non-existent today, we consistently go away from what is working and then we let the DE throw a pass from the 1 yard line when we are down by 14. This feels more like watching my 13 year old playing Madden.
I understand what you're saying and if you don't like the scheme, that's fine. But, everyone keeps bitching about the "play calling" and aside from an obvious goal-line example, doesn't have a specific play or plays to talk about other than stating someone else's OC who they think magically fix everything. Re-watch the game and you'll see that Vann was marked out of the game and then got hurt when they forced a run with him (he's playing injured). A lot of teams do stupid crap on the goal line and I hate it. I also hate it that Joyner will never hand the ball off.
I also don't live in a zero sum world where one goal line play in a 45-20 game means all of the calls sucked. I also don't assume that we can magically say we're going to run offense x instead of offense y and think magically we would have won today. I understand frustration but people making unrealistic expectations for an offense that outright sucked after Hill came out was suddenly going to put it all together.
In the end, if Hooker was the QB at USC would the offense been better or worse? If Tennessee had Doty, would they have put up 45? I mean look that extreme experience difference alone. I don't know what Doty's ceiling is but it's certainly higher than it is right now. Can it be higher than Hooker? I don't know.
I think the play calling is above average for what we have in terms of skill and experience and I think they players are getting incrementally better. Until and if they can cross the line to be consciously competent then you're going to see a team that continues to beat itself on drives more often than not and I don't care who is calling the plays.
Don’t drop a bomb like that without posting full response and context
That wasn't his response, and you know it......
His response should have been, “ I don’t know. I have never called a play.”
Neither did Tennessee....have weapons/players for their systems....and their transfer portal outbox was brutL; but their experienced head coach had a plan, didn’t wait two weeks to show up on site to work and found players for the system....as a head football coach would.
Disagree. Their portal inbox wasn't too bad with Hooker. Gray hurt real bad if they ran last year's system but Heupel plugs in a JUCO transfer and uses his WRs as an extension of the running game anyway. The portal hurt Tennessee more on defense.
I'm sorry but the wait two weeks line is pure BS. Plenty of coaches stay with their former team and work their new job in off hours. What could he have done in two weeks here that he couldn't do there? I'm sure using the telephone in Columbia during COVID would have been more effective than using the telephone in Norman.
Agree here. We randomly hop in the I formation, run the ball down the field to the 4 yard line and the suddenly we get cute? Makes no sense. Pound it in!
I'll share my worst call of the game. 2nd drive. 2nd and 10. We tried to hit WR on a go route. What are the chances of success with our personel? Single digits. 3 and 10. We punt, 14-0. Trying to hit go route on 2 and 10 almost as stupid as the goal line plays.
In particular, the red zone play calling inside the 10 when we were down 14-0 and could have made it a 1 score game. We were running from an I-formation with 2 TEs and moving the ball. We got in scoring distance and abandoned it. We threw an INT. I thought that was all on the coaches.
There were other examples of both poor play calling and poor execution throughout the game. Honestly, when it is this bad it is hard to tell what is a bad play and what is bad execution.
Well, I think point number one is very valid and not even debatable. Just because you practice something all week doesn't mean that you have to run it.
In terms of point two, you may be correct. I still see an offense exploiting the edges, working the middle, throwing some outs and improving on dreadful running game. He's also mixing in working with and against motion to tray and create some one-on-ones. I think it's been pretty good and see more problems with execution because of how the lineman interact after negative plays. The production increased today to 370 yards. I didn't understand why there were so many weak side runs to the right.
However, I'm not getting anyone discussing how different play calls would have worked when others failed. (Example if they say it, "They were giving Brooks too much cushion and we weren't taking advantage of it" or "Tennessee was noticeably overloaded to the right side and we weren't exploiting a numbers advantage in that direction.") I was hoping for someone to have seen something else or I'm pretty much just left with execution.
That wasn't the design and you know it. There were three options, deep, short and run. You know that.
But who the hell needs to run a trick play to get a first down? Really. Does your offense not have ANY plays that can get it?
He was angry with the question too. He then defended it by basically saying the play calling was bad. He hasn't got a clue what he's doing.
First, the main design of the trick play is to get more than a first down, which they were trying to do and second, it was a build off the motions plays they've been running since East Carolina. You need to keep doing different variations of the play to make it effective. It was 2nd and 3 -- they didn't need to do it to get a first down; it wasn't 4th and 1 after getting stuffed two times.
It didn't seem to be a big problem when Spurrier did a variation of it.
Yes it was. In fact the reporter who asked the question was surprised by the answer. It is on YouTube, go watch it.
This is correct.
Beamer follows up with "What do want me to say, that it's been terrible? Are there plays that Marcus would like to have back? Yeah. Whatever we are offensively right now, it's not good enough."
Cloninger summary:
Had it [the worst play of the year] in all week. Had talked about it that they were going to put in in the first time that they were inside the 5. He mentions that, in hindsight, should have just kept running. Burch also had the option to run, but the throw was the design.
Again, you are correct. He snapped an answer and then explained it after he clamed down because he appeared curiously annoyed to be asked an obvious question.
Quote from the broadcast: The coaching staff told the ESPN guys that sometimes he doesn't run the right route (note INT vs. ECU). I think not realizing he was supposed to get the handoff last week against Troy was pretty bad, too (great catch of someone else's ball against ECU). He had very few plays last year and is raw but you are right about his ceiling. I think they are trying.
I would settle for seeing a 3rd down play call that actually moves beyond the first down marker. The constant 3 yard passes when there are 5 yards to go is puzzling.
I saw a few. Not sure if they were 3rd options or not. This is what I pulled from the play-by-play. They were better than I thought.
Ist 3rd Down: 4 yard scramble.
2nd 3rd Down: Sack.
3rd 3rd Down: Pass for 11 yards down the middle. First down.
4th 3rd Down: Pass for 8 yards to the left. First down.
5th 3rd Down: Sack.
6th 3rd Down: 13 yard rush. First down.
7th 3rd Down: 7 yard pass.
8th 3rd Down: Pass for 16 yards down the middle. First down.
9th 3rd Down: Incomplete Pass.
10th 3rd Down: 5 yard rush. First down.
11th 3rd Down: Incomplete Pass.
12th 3rd Down: 6 yard rush. First down.
13th 3rd Down: 23 yard scramble. First down.
14th 3rd Down: (Goal to Go). 2 yard rush.
15th 3rd Down: Incomplete Pass.
16th 3rd Down: Doty 7 yard scramble.
Lol, that was his exact response dumbass. Is it really that hard to do a little research before posting nonsense?
Here’s the video, the question starts at 9:55.
You seem really invested in defending this coaching staff.
Beamers response to the play calling question was purely sarcastic in initial response. If one cannot see that then no further help is warranted.
I'm confident that Beamer knows what the problems are. He just can't admit it publicly. You know he and his dad talk. We have a lack of talent and so so coaching staff. The question of the day is, what does Coach Beamer plan on doing about it?
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