Cocks vs Cocks game thread....

[Ward Jr]

We need the aggressive X and O coach, or a certain coach who will go out and hire those aggressive X and O coordinators.

Since we ha e a deficiency in one area, there's no need to compound it in another.

Or we just settle.

So you believe we need to pay another big buyout with the hope that our new overpaid head coach will find new position coaches who can outcoach our current position coaches? All while maintaining a similar talent pool?

You believe that's the best course of action?

 

[Bucs90]

I'm not putting blinders on. My point is that Muschamp's efforts against Clemson were so bad that we can't use them for any level of analysis.

If we're doing worse against them than the bottom half of the ACC, I would have to believe that Beamer did a better job than Muschamp ever did against a Clemson team by beating them on their homefield while they were in the Top 10. ...Something no other ACC team had done in many years.

How is that not logical?

Im not saying its not. Im just saying the 2016-2019 Clemson teams, in a time machine, would have wrecked the 2022 Clemson team, probably by 35+ points. I know they’re our rival man, but sometimes you just have to tip the cap. Those 16-19 squads were f’ing insane. They were also in the wake of our 5-peat, and we ragged them bad for it, so they had extra motivation to spike it on us as payback. Saying they were equally motivated vs us as they were for Wake and Virginia isnt honest.

 

[Bucs90]

So you believe we need to pay another big buyout with the hope that our new overpaid head coach will find new position coaches who can outcoach our current position coaches? All while maintaining a similar talent pool?

You believe that's the best course of action?

No we need to fire the idiot who keeps putting us into the crippling buyouts.

 

[Ward Jr]

Nah I disagree. Holtz and Spurrier weren’t crapshoots. And I’ll admit, I was ok with giving Muschamp a shot, yes Florida was a flop, but he was/is an elite DC At several schools, a Saban trained coach, a great recruiter. Florida hired him for a reason, and Texas wanted to. For US, it was a reasonable risk.

But our HC job, at a mid tier SEC school, is a major job. I just cant fathom a hire with literally no experience as a HC or coordinator and that falls 100% on Ray.

Holtz and Spurrier were retired coaches who suddenly decided they wanted to try USC. It was a folly for them. That was luck and also a good fit because they were great human billboards for the program.

Find another media darling with a coaching pedigree such as theirs, then another buyout might be worth it.

Hoping Chadwell can replicate his success at the SEC level is not close to the same thing.

I'd rather jump to Conference USA as a team and be a big fish in a small pond from a football perspective.

 

[Ward Jr]

Im not saying its not. Im just saying the 2016-2019 Clemson teams, in a time machine, would have wrecked the 2022 Clemson team, probably by 35+ points. I know they’re our rival man, but sometimes you just have to tip the cap. Those 16-19 squads were f’ing insane. They were also in the wake of our 5-peat, and we ragged them bad for it, so they had extra motivation to spike it on us as payback. Saying they were equally motivated vs us as they were for Wake and Virginia isnt honest.

First off, that's total speculation. Clemson hadn't loss in like 7 years at home before we beat them last season.

Secondly, why do you even care about the comparison? We beat a Top 10 team on their homefield. Why the need to talk it down?

 

[Bucs90]

Holtz and Spurrier were retired coaches who suddenly decided they wanted to try USC. It was a folly for them. That was luck and also a good fit because they were great human billboards for the program.

Find another media darling with a coaching pedigree such as theirs, then another buyout might be worth it.

Hoping Chadwell can replicate his success at the SEC level is not close to the same thing.

I'd rather jump to Conference USA as a team and be a big fish in a small pond from a football perspective.

There are “retired”’coaches similar to them right now.

Yes we would have been hoping Chadwell replicated the tremendous success and overachievements he had a 3 different schools (4 now) if we hired him. What can we hope Beamer duplicates? Again, WHAT was Tanner thinking?

Id agree with leaving the SEC. If our claim to fame is gonna be womens basketball and “hey NOBODY gets their butts kicked by more elite teams than us” then I agree, lets go elsewhere

 

[Bucs90]

First off, that's total speculation. Clemson hadn't loss in like 7 years at home before we beat them last season.

Secondly, why do you even care about the comparison? We beat a Top 10 team on their homefield. Why the need to talk it down?

Im not Im just putting it in perspective. It simply is not the caliber of win that it would have been had Muschamp beaten Clemson any year from 2015-2019.

 

[Ward Jr]

Im not Im just putting it in perspective. It simply is not the caliber of win that it would have been had Muschamp beaten Clemson any year from 2015-2019.

So you're talking last year's win down over your speculation? That's trollism.

If you want to argue the strength of any given Clemson team in any given year, aren't there better forums for this?

 

[stu1cocks]

To be fair, our team is currently being carried by a player we "stole" from Oklahoma.

That didn't want him anyway. BS flag flying.

 

[Bucs90]

So you're talking last year's win down over your speculation? That's trollism.

If you want to argue the strength of any given Clemson team in any given year, aren't there better forums for this?

Ok we can agree to disagree but any college football fan, like 99.5%, would agree with my comparison

 

[Bucs90]

That didn't want him anyway. BS flag flying.

Bet they wish they had him this year. He left bc Caleb Williams emerged

 

[Bucs90]

That didn't want him anyway. BS flag flying.

Bet they wish they had him this year. He left bc Caleb Williams emerged

 

[stu1cocks]

Haha great point. The “we dont have money we cant recruit in NIL era” forget Rattler, Juice Wells, Mario Anderson, guys who saved this program from total collapse, came from elsewhere.

Yeah great point. You're right!!! Beamer is the only reason we don't make the CFP this year. You nailed it. Dang you rock.

 

[stu1cocks]

Bet they wish they had him this year. He left bc Caleb Williams emerged

Maybe they do. Rgeret sucks. Doesn't prove we can swim with the big sharks in the ocean though, not one little bit.

 

[stu1cocks]

So for all you never Beamers, I hear you. I personally am somewhat ambivalent about it. If he gets canned, no biggie to me. What I have yet to hear is what REALISTIC expectations do folks have for this program in today's world with the soon to be even mpore formidable conference we reside in? If you say CFP, I chuckle. But 9 wins, 10 in a really good year? 6 and a bowl? Nobody seems to want to touch this question. In my mind the answer to this question should drive the whole conversation. What is actaully possible?

 

[Lurker123]

That didn't want him anyway. BS flag flying.

And yet the point stands that the dude literally carrying our team right now was gotten through NIL. Amongst other major contributors.

I get arguing about the repeatability etc, it just seems odd saying we can't do it when we literally have already.

 

[Lurker123]

So for all you never Beamers, I hear you. I personally am somewhat ambivalent about it. If he gets canned, no biggie to me. What I have yet to hear is what REALISTIC expectations do folks have for this program in today's world with the soon to be even mpore formidable conference we reside in? If you say CFP, I chuckle. But 9 wins, 10 in a really good year? 6 and a bowl? Nobody seems to want to touch this question. In my mind the answer to this question should drive the whole conversation. What is actaully possible?

To be fair, 10 wins would probably get us in the playoffs. They go to 12 teams next year, right?

But seriously, I'd say a baseline of bowl eligibility. We usually play 3 patsies and vandy, making 4 wins the floor. We should win 2 of the other 8 to get bowl eligible. (I know ow this year we played 2 patsies. Next year we play 3)

I honestly don't think we go bowling this year or next.

If you want to go deeper, you can't struggle with patsies and snatch victory on a pick six to end the game. Against a comparable team, like Missouri or UK, yes. But not Jax st.

If we really just go by recruiting and NIL, we should be above Missouri, UK, vandy and the patsies. And that's bowl eligible each year right off the bat.

 

[bayrooster]

Are we still winning?

 

[Bucs90]

Yeah great point. You're right!!! Beamer is the only reason we don't make the CFP this year. You nailed it. Dang you rock.

That’s ridiculous. But, I do believe the coach I lobbied for would have won 8/9 games this year at least

 

[Bucs90]

And yet the point stands that the dude literally carrying our team right now was gotten through NIL. Amongst other major contributors.

I get arguing about the repeatability etc, it just seems odd saying we can't do it when we literally have already.

Also some say even Spurrier couldnt have won in this NIL era. But I disagree. Spurrier didnt have the privilege of being able to plug a hole with stars like Rattler or Juice Wells. He had to develop talent and groom backups. In the coming offseason, Beamer can literally go recruit any college player in America to come fill a hole immediately.

 

[DeeDave]

That’s ridiculous. But, I do believe the coach I lobbied for would have won 8/9 games this year at least

Not a chance in the world.

Not with the holes on this offensive line, the lack of an all conference level pass rusher, and no depth at the linebacker spot at all with LB starters that have some obvious limitations in pass coverage ability. Not to mention the lack of experienced depth and talent at the RB position.

the thing about "believing" though is you can believe anything in the world, including that such a Gamecock team could have beaten 15 NFL teams.

 

[Gamecock Jacque]

Are we still winning?

Some how it doesn't feel like it, does it? 🙂

 

[Bucs90]

Not a chance in the world.

Not with the holes on this offensive line, the lack of an all conference level pass rusher, and no depth at the linebacker spot at all with LB starters that have some obvious limitations in pass coverage ability. Not to mention the lack of experienced depth and talent at the RB position.

the thing about "believing" though is you can believe anything in the world, including that such a Gamecock team could have beaten 15 NFL teams.

But you’re assuming he would be coaching THIS same team. He wouldnt. Him and his staff run a different system, would have recruited different players.

But, I DO know this, in year 1 at Liberty he just broke them into the AP Top 25. Thats not guessing or speculation. Immediately overachieving. Just like he and his staff did at Coastal, Charleston Southern and NGU.

Liberty is ranked in AP Top 25 poll after 9-0 start to season

For the third time in four seasons, Liberty has been ranked in the Associated Press Top 25 poll as the Flames checked in at No. 25 in the updated poll released on Sunday. The Flames picked up a win…

www.aseaofred.com

 

[Bucs90]

Some how it doesn't feel like it, does it? 🙂

3-6 isnt “winning”

 

[DeeDave]

But you’re assuming he would be coaching THIS same team. He wouldnt. Him and his staff run a different system, would have recruited different players.

Again, it's only pure speculation. Maybe Rattler never comes here with a Chadwell. Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe....

But as I said, you can believe anything because it requires no proof.

 

[stu1cocks]

That’s ridiculous. But, I do believe the coach I lobbied for would have won 8/9 games this year at least

You believe. That's fair. Believeing and happening as we all know are two different things though. Fact is we will never know for sure. In any event, whether he really would have risked his whole career to come here or not, that ship has sailed and crying over spilled milk is kind of useless. For what its worth, I am 100% on board with Ray is way the f over his head.

 

[stu1cocks]

And yet the point stands that the dude literally carrying our team right now was gotten through NIL. Amongst other major contributors.

I get arguing about the repeatability etc, it just seems odd saying we can't do it when we literally have already.

One guy isn't going to do it. Rattler is a one off in my mind who had special circumstances. He was a 5* that nobody else wanted. We got him and he has performed well. How many more good players have we lost then gained? A lot.

 

[Lurker123]

One guy isn't going to do it. Rattler is a one off in my mind who had special circumstances. He was a 5* that nobody else wanted. We got him and he has performed well. How many more good players have we lost then gained? A lot.

I get the special circumstances with Rattler, maybe it had more to do with a previous relationship. But I hesitate to say that no one wanted him. Do we know that?

Also, Juice, and Mario are considered our best runner and receiver, right? So one of the best qbs we've ever had, our best wr (I know, injured) and our best RB are all portal players.