It was a Dietzel initiative. Without him, it never happens. And to answer the question your posed about playing them after we left softening the blow, as was done in football, the answer is "no".
My 50+ Year History following USC Mens Basketball
- Thread starter permacock70
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Absolutely correct.
Upon further reflection, if McGuire didn't want to be a part of the ACC, why would he have accepted the job at USC after resigning under pressure from UnCarolina?
I would still liked to have played, say Wake Forest, instead of Hofstra during those years in the wilderness.
My understanding is that most of our former ACC rivals continued to schedule us on the gridiron for the $$$. Wish the athletic department had insisted that hoops games be part of the deal.
My first 2 years at USC were the 97 and 98 tourney teams. Those guys were so much fun to watch. We played more pick up ball those 2 years. Had the pleasure of playing in the Coliseum a few times.
I don't mind FM going ballistic after a terrible play. But I don't get him doing it all the time even on good plays. Going bonkers loses it's effect pretty quick. Have you ever seen him smile during a game, or pat a kid on the back?
I was at the Capitol Newsstand on Main the day Klores' "Roundball Culture" was released in 1980 . 1st pressing hardback & I've got Klores' signature in it. He was there that day. Excellent source of info.
UNC fans I knew at the time refused to give Joyce credit claiming Dedmon back tipped it.
I was born in 1985, so my first basketball memories were the Fogler teams of 1997 and 1998. I was in tears when we lost to Coppin State. Can't think of a more heartbreaking loss other than the push off in 2000 vs. Clemson.
That loss the next year in the first round of the Dance was almost as disappointing and embarrassing. I forget to whom we lost - Richmond?
It's never a fluke when you beat teams like we beat in Duke, Baylor, and Florida. That team just put it all together at the right time. I agree with what you said about McGuire and getting out of the ACC. He really started it when he couldn't get that kid, Grazzo (I think) into school because of his SAT score.
I just purchased one for my father. Great idea! That is an expensive book, but I'm sure he will enjoy it. His years at USC were 68-72 +/-
You know very little if anything about those times or the story behind the enrollment of freshman phenom Mike Grosso
I agree; it was no fluke. That team did what it did. It probably could be better described as a historical aberration.
No. Just a team that was tough. At least the leaders were tough. Thornwell was/is as tough as any player in the country. The Canadian was tough. The two Europeans were tough in their own way. Others were tough. Toughness made up for other deficiencies. And they were a joy to watch.
Yes, things are that bad. Had we shown normal legitimacy after going to a Final Four, threads like this would be fewer and farther between.
And that's what I meant about fluke. Yes, the team that year ended up with great chemistry and toughness. Sadly, it wasn't sustained, hence the fluke.
Our latter ACC years showed sustained, growing success. Leaving the ACC ended up being like drilling a hole in the boat.
Grosso did enroll, but his SAT scores weren't high enough to qualify for a basketball scholarship.
Read all about it (and more) in Roundball Culture.
And if I remember correctly, the ACC changed their SAT requirements a year or so after we departed to comply with other conferences. We lost a lot of great football players with that ACC requirement also.
The ACC changed their requirements due to the adjudication of a court case filed by a couple of Clemron soccer players, I think. Taters weren't happy about the ACC's standards either, but they were more patient than us.
As Klores mentions in Roundball Culture, Dietzel's narrative was false. We were recruiting athletes under the same standards as our conference brethren, and still couldn't get the job done on the gridiron. Now if we were in e SEC at the time recruiting under ACC standards, that's something else.
Knew they changed, was not sure why. Thanks.
While the latter is true, I remember us losing a lot of in-state recruits due to that rule. It wasn't so much that we were recruiting with the same standards as our ACC brethren, it was SC players couldn't qualify under those standards which hurt us. There was a lot of SC players, especially from the coastal areas, that we couldn't get in. Clemson managed to overcome it, but never really looked at why or where they were getting their players.
Dietzel was extremely upset when Issac Jackson and Sumter's Freddie Solomom could not qualify at USC under ACC rules.
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It started with Frank....excerpt::
The Atlantic Coast Conference was created in 1953, and the eight original members included the University of South Carolina. According to The State newspaper, the university withdrew from the ACC on June 30, 1971, becoming the only school to leave the ACC. The decision to withdraw was mostly a football decision made by the athletics director, but the university's feud over the admission of star basketball player Mike Grosso and coach Frank McGuire's constant bickering with league administrators contributed to that decision.
"Contributed" - Frank got p!$$ed off; but Dietzel was the driver. He knew he could never compete with teams bringing in 90 a year while he was bringing in 40, and they were bringing in players with 750 board scores while ours had to have 850. That was the catalyst right there.
Once again, the Grosso deal with the acc requirements started the whole thing. Dietzel agreed and pushed it through.
Maryland, of course, left the ACC since that was written.
Left to his own devices, I doubt McGuire would pushed for leaving the ACC. He feuded with the league while at Chapel Hill, and resigned under pressure.
While coaching the Holes, Frank complained about the ACC tournament. He felt that if you finished first in the regular season, that should be enough to go dancing. To his credit, he complained about this years before the debacle in the 1970 finals.
With that background, why would he accept a coaching position at another ACC school if he wanted out?
But we were competing with 40/800 (fellow ACC schools), not 90/750 (our SEC neighbors to the west). Nice spin by Pepsodent.
SEC teams won national championships. ACC teams didn't. Dietzel knew what a national championship was.
