My understanding of the UNC scandal

[gradyjl]

The AFAM program was established at UNC in the early 80’s concommitant with a movement by black students insisting on having a Black cultural union. An AFAM studies curriculum was a natural outgrowth of this movement. The program received national attention and served as a model for other colleges and universities. The AFAM prgram morphed into a full-fledged department with its own department head. The department flourished and operated in a very independent manner. In short, Arts and Sciences left it to its own devices. Many black students chose AFAM as their major. The fact that grades given out in this department were generally higher than grades given out in other departments went unchallenged, if not unnoticed, or even ignored. Things began to derail somewhat in the late 1980’s and later, when department head, Professor Julius Nyang’oro allowed the creation of AFAM courses which did not require the students to physically attend class. These courses were custom tailored in many cases to satisfy the time requirements of students who also had jobs, marriied and single-parent students, and student athletes who found it difficult to juggle classtime to allow for participation in athletics - particularly, football and basketball. At some point Nang’oro relinquished administration of these courses to his secretary, Deborah Crowder, a 1975 UNC graduate. While possessed of good intentions, Crowder nonetheless began to succumb to personal requests from students and athletic advisory staff personnel to make these courses available almost ad-hoc. At the same time she lowered the grade standards for these courses which generally only required the equivalent of a term paper in order to receive credit for a course. Papers which passed optics invaribly received high grades, though many were plagarized, and were often recycled among students. While the Wainstein report, commissioned by the University to investigate these “paper courses”, revealed egregious shortcomings in the subject courses, it concluded that while athletes populated these courses in inordinate numbers, there was no evidence that the paper classes were established for the purpose of keeping student athletes academically eligible for continuing their study from semester to semester. The Wainstein Study also found no evidence that UNC coaches encouraged abuse of these courses to keep student athletes academically eligible. (It is only logical that coaches were aware of the easy grades given out in the AFAM courses, and relied on them to help keep their athletes academically eligible. After all, even non-athletes seek out professors who give inflated grades to pad their GPA, and often to remain academically eligible.).

While the NCAA was on the hot seat, and under pressure, to sanction UNC in this instance, it could not. First of all the NCAA is not authorized to assess whether or not courses offered by a university meet standards for academic rigor. SACS was the responsible entity in this case, and it indeed placed UNC on one year’s probation. And secondly, and what has never been discussed, UNC granted degrees for many years to students, primarily black students, whose academic transcripts reflected credits for AFAM courses, to include credits for “paper courses”. In many cases, without the high grades given for said courses, the students might not have graduated. There was no scenario in which the NCAA could declare indivdual student athletes ineligible because they received high grades in courses which it deemed to be unworthy of academic credit. This was particularly disengenious since no one from the NCAA ever examined a single paper written by a student athlete for a paper course. And furthermore, the NCAA could not discredit the student athlete’s paper courses, when non-athletes had received credit for such courses for years and gone on to graduate.

 

[Gaimcock]

The AFAM program was established at UNC in the early 80’s concommitant with a movement by black students insisting on having a Black cultural union. An AFAM studies curriculum was a natural outgrowth of this movement. The program received national attention and served as a model for other colleges and universities. The AFAM prgram morphed into a full-fledged department with its own department head. The department flourished and operated in a very independent manner. In short, Arts and Sciences left it to its own devices. Many black students chose AFAM as their major. The fact that grades given out in this department were generally higher than grades given out in other departments went unchallenged, if not unnoticed, or even ignored. Things began to derail somewhat in the late 1980’s and later, when department head, Professor Julius Nyang’oro allowed the creation of AFAM courses which did not require the students to physically attend class. These courses were custom tailored in many cases to satisfy the time requirements of students who also had jobs, marriied and single-parent students, and student athletes who found it difficult to juggle classtime to allow for participation in athletics - particularly, football and basketball. At some point Nang’oro relinquished administration of these courses to his secretary, Deborah Crowder, a 1975 UNC graduate. While possessed of good intentions, Crowder nonetheless began to succumb to personal requests from students and athletic advisory staff personnel to make these courses available almost ad-hoc. At the same time she lowered the grade standards for these courses which generally only required the equivalent of a term paper in order to receive credit for a course. Papers which passed optics invaribly received high grades, though many were plagarized, and were often recycled among students. While the Wainstein report, commissioned by the University to investigate these “paper courses”, revealed egregious shortcomings in the subject courses, it concluded that while athletes populated these courses in inordinate numbers, there was no evidence that the paper classes were established for the purpose of keeping student athletes academically eligible for continuing their study from semester to semester. The Wainstein Study also found no evidence that UNC coaches encouraged abuse of these courses to keep student athletes academically eligible. (It is only logical that coaches were aware of the easy grades given out in the AFAM courses, and relied on them to help keep their athletes academically eligible. After all, even non-athletes seek out professors who give inflated grades to pad their GPA, and often to remain academically eligible.).

While the NCAA was on the hot seat, and under pressure, to sanction UNC in this instance, it could not. First of all the NCAA is not authorized to assess whether or not courses offered by a university meet standards for academic rigor. SACS was the responsible entity in this case, and it indeed placed UNC on one year’s probation. And secondly, and what has never been discussed, UNC granted degrees for many years to students, primarily black students, whose academic transcripts reflected credits for AFAM courses, to include credits for “paper courses”. In many cases, without the high grades given for said courses, the students might not have graduated. There was no scenario in which the NCAA could declare indivdual student athletes ineligible because they received high grades in courses which it deemed to be unworthy of academic credit. This was particularly disengenious since no one from the NCAA ever examined a single paper written by a student athlete for a paper course. And furthermore, the NCAA could not discredit the student athlete’s paper courses, when non-athletes had received credit for such courses for years and gone on to graduate.

^^^ BOOK!!!

 

[HI Cock]

cliff notes?

but more likely this is a troll

 

[Conway Gamecock]

Blah blah blahbity blah

This is highly incorrect. In the Wainstein Report, it is determined through findings:

- That nearly half - over 47% - of the some-3,100 total students that received grades from the fake paper classes were student-athletes, despite only 4% of the UNC undergraduate student body every year consisted of students engaged in athletic programs.

- That non-athletic students were assigned to the fake paper courses by academic advisors after those advisors were "advised" by Crowder and others of the classes' existence, but that those students had to go through the normal course sign-up process that amounted to "waiting in line", and that had no involvement from Crowder or Nyang’oro or their assistance, and further that those academic advisors outside of assistants within the AFAM department had NO knowledge that the paper classes were not being reviewed or graded by any faculty staff, nor that any faculty staff were even attending to any of the classes.

Meanwhile, the student-athletes were being specifically placed directly into the classes by Crowder and later Nyang’oro (after Crowder's retirement in 2009) without having to wait for seat openings, and did so at the specific direction of members of the athletic department, such as Associate Director of ASPSA (Academic Support Program for Student-Athletes) and Director of Football Cynthia Reynolds, academic advisor for men's basketball Wayne Walden, women’s basketball academic counselor Jan Boxill, and academic counselor for athletes Jaimie Lee, to name a few.

To summarize, while the classes served both student-athletes and non-athlete students at UNC, it was determined in the Wainstein Report that the non-athlete students were directed to the classes by academic advisors thinking the class was a properly facilitated course with instructors, while the student-athletes directed were done so by athletic advisors that KNEW the class was a fake paper class, and that Crowder and Nyang’oro directly and personally assisted in getting those student-athletes into those fake classes, preventing the class seats from being filled up by non-athlete students. And they had athletic advisors, counselors, and directors crawling all over them making sure this all happened.

- That Crowder regularly "added on" student-athletes into traditional lecture classes in the AFAM curriculum. These were actual existing classes taught by actual AFAM faculty members. Crowder would "add" a student-athlete to the class roll of a lecture class, but the student-athlete would never physically attend the class. At the end of the semester, the professor teaching the class would record a grade of "AB", which meant "absent from exam". Crowder would then give that student-athlete a paper assignment to turn in, and change the "AB" grade to a "A" or "B" grade, all outside of the course professor's knowledge.

Again, Crowder was NOT a faculty member at UNC, and was not supposed to unilaterally add students into classes, change grades, or assign course-work that was other than what the assigned faculty member was in charge of. Those student-athletes did not attend any lectures of those classes, didn't do a fraction of the work that the other students did, and invariably received better grades than the other students did who attended those classes, under this fake system.

- That with Crowder not being a faculty member at UNC, she nonetheless created the paper classes, assigned report topics for papers, and graded the papers turned in. The volume of evidence of the papers she graded indicated that she put very little diligence into reviewing or grading the work: essentially scanning quickly the beginning and end, and then blindly assigning "A"s and "B"s. It was so well known that the quality of the papers didn't matter, that students-athletes were just turning in copies of papers that were done previously - even years earlier - with only slight modifications, and they still got graded with "A"s and "B"s.

- This is an excerpt directly copied from the Wainstein Report, regarding the "Bifurcated Class" phenomenon:

d. Bifurcated Classes

In addition to the foregoing paper classes, we identified five classes that were bifurcated between two sets of students – those who were taught in the traditional lecture-class format and those who took the same class in a paper-class format. As Nyang’oro explained, these were standard lecture classes in which individual students were permitted to complete the class by simply turning in a paper, while the others had to attend class and complete all class assignments in the traditional manner. We discovered the bifurcated classes during our review of grade rosters with Nyang’oro,
who identified this phenomenon. He explained that there were a limited number of such instances.

While we identified five such courses, it is possible that there were more.
There were a total of 154 enrollments in the classes we identified. While we cannot definitively state which students had the paper class experience and which had the traditional lecture experience in each class, Nyang’oro estimated that between one-third and one-half of the enrollments of each bifurcated class had the paper class experience. According to Nyang’oro, virtually every one of the students who was designated for paper-class treatment was a student-athlete.

In other words, the fake paper class version of this bifurcated class - the easy one that required NO lecture hours, NO class attendance, and only ONE paper assignment - were designated for student-athletes, only.

I can go on and on, but I'm getting tired typing all this out.......

 

[gradyjl]

This is highly incorrect. In the Wainstein Report, it is determined through findings:

- That nearly half - over 47% - of the some-3,100 total students that received grades from the fake paper classes were student-athletes, despite only 4% of the UNC undergraduate student body every year consisted of students engaged in athletic programs.

- That non-athletic students were assigned to the fake paper courses by academic advisors after those advisors were "advised" by Crowder and others of the classes' existence, but that those students had to go through the normal course sign-up process that amounted to "waiting in line", and that had no involvement from Crowder or Nyang’oro or their assistance, and further that those academic advisors outside of assistants within the AFAM department had NO knowledge that the paper classes were not being reviewed or graded by any faculty staff, nor that any faculty staff were even attending to any of the classes.

Meanwhile, the student-athletes were being specifically placed directly into the classes by Crowder and later Nyang’oro (after Crowder's retirement in 2009) without having to wait for seat openings, and did so at the specific direction of members of the athletic department, such as Associate Director of ASPSA (Academic Support Program for Student-Athletes) and Director of Football Cynthia Reynolds, academic advisor for men's basketball Wayne Walden, women’s basketball academic counselor Jan Boxill, and academic counselor for athletes Jaimie Lee, to name a few.

To summarize, while the classes served both student-athletes and non-athlete students at UNC, it was determined in the Wainstein Report that the non-athlete students were directed to the classes by academic advisors thinking the class was a properly facilitated course with instructors, while the student-athletes directed were done so by athletic advisors that KNEW the class was a fake paper class, and that Crowder and Nyang’oro directly and personally assisted in getting those student-athletes into those fake classes, preventing the class seats from being filled up by non-athlete students. And they had athletic advisors, counselors, and directors crawling all over them making sure this all happened.

- That Crowder regularly "added on" student-athletes into traditional lecture classes in the AFAM curriculum. These were actual existing classes taught by actual AFAM faculty members. Crowder would "add" a student-athlete to the class roll of a lecture class, but the student-athlete would never physically attend the class. At the end of the semester, the professor teaching the class would record a grade of "AB", which meant "absent from exam". Crowder would then give that student-athlete a paper assignment to turn in, and change the "AB" grade to a "A" or "B" grade, all outside of the course professor's knowledge.

Again, Crowder was NOT a faculty member at UNC, and was not supposed to unilaterally add students into classes, change grades, or assign course-work that was other than what the assigned faculty member was in charge of. Those student-athletes did not attend any lectures of those classes, didn't do a fraction of the work that the other students did, and invariably received better grades than the other students did who attended those classes, under this fake system.

- That with Crowder not being a faculty member at UNC, she nonetheless created the paper classes, assigned report topics for papers, and graded the papers turned in. The volume of evidence of the papers she graded indicated that she put very little diligence into reviewing or grading the work: essentially scanning quickly the beginning and end, and then blindly assigning "A"s and "B"s. It was so well known that the quality of the papers didn't matter, that students-athletes were just turning in copies of papers that were done previously - even years earlier - with only slight modifications, and they still got graded with "A"s and "B"s.

- This is an excerpt directly copied from the Wainstein Report, regarding the "Bifurcated Class" phenomenon:



In other words, the fake paper class version of this bifurcated class - the easy one that required NO lecture hours, NO class attendance, and only ONE paper assignment - were designated for student-athletes, only.

I can go on and on, but I'm getting tired typing all this out.......

You have regurgitated the details of what I generaiized as the “egregious shortcomings” found by Wainstein, and which have been written about ad naseum. The overview of my thinking in para one was a synopsis of what had happened, while paragraph two represented my understanding of why the NCAA’s hands were tied and could under no circmstances rule on the legitimacy of the subject papers - the crux of thhis entire matter.

 

[ansoncock]

The AFAM program was established at UNC in the early 80’s concommitant with a movement by black students insisting on having a Black cultural union. An AFAM studies curriculum was a natural outgrowth of this movement. The program received national attention and served as a model for other colleges and universities. The AFAM prgram morphed into a full-fledged department with its own department head. The department flourished and operated in a very independent manner. In short, Arts and Sciences left it to its own devices. Many black students chose AFAM as their major. The fact that grades given out in this department were generally higher than grades given out in other departments went unchallenged, if not unnoticed, or even ignored. Things began to derail somewhat in the late 1980’s and later, when department head, Professor Julius Nyang’oro allowed the creation of AFAM courses which did not require the students to physically attend class. These courses were custom tailored in many cases to satisfy the time requirements of students who also had jobs, marriied and single-parent students, and student athletes who found it difficult to juggle classtime to allow for participation in athletics - particularly, football and basketball. At some point Nang’oro relinquished administration of these courses to his secretary, Deborah Crowder, a 1975 UNC graduate. While possessed of good intentions, Crowder nonetheless began to succumb to personal requests from students and athletic advisory staff personnel to make these courses available almost ad-hoc. At the same time she lowered the grade standards for these courses which generally only required the equivalent of a term paper in order to receive credit for a course. Papers which passed optics invaribly received high grades, though many were plagarized, and were often recycled among students. While the Wainstein report, commissioned by the University to investigate these “paper courses”, revealed egregious shortcomings in the subject courses, it concluded that while athletes populated these courses in inordinate numbers, there was no evidence that the paper classes were established for the purpose of keeping student athletes academically eligible for continuing their study from semester to semester. The Wainstein Study also found no evidence that UNC coaches encouraged abuse of these courses to keep student athletes academically eligible. (It is only logical that coaches were aware of the easy grades given out in the AFAM courses, and relied on them to help keep their athletes academically eligible. After all, even non-athletes seek out professors who give inflated grades to pad their GPA, and often to remain academically eligible.).

While the NCAA was on the hot seat, and under pressure, to sanction UNC in this instance, it could not. First of all the NCAA is not authorized to assess whether or not courses offered by a university meet standards for academic rigor. SACS was the responsible entity in this case, and it indeed placed UNC on one year’s probation. And secondly, and what has never been discussed, UNC granted degrees for many years to students, primarily black students, whose academic transcripts reflected credits for AFAM courses, to include credits for “paper courses”. In many cases, without the high grades given for said courses, the students might not have graduated. There was no scenario in which the NCAA could declare indivdual student athletes ineligible because they received high grades in courses which it deemed to be unworthy of academic credit. This was particularly disengenious since no one from the NCAA ever examined a single paper written by a student athlete for a paper course. And furthermore, the NCAA could not discredit the student athlete’s paper courses, when non-athletes had received credit for such courses for years and gone on to graduate.

This article contains major b.s. Good intentions are no excuse for academic corruption. UNC had a veritable army of administrators, and coaches. Why did they not do their jobs and provide oversight in order to protect the academic reputation of their school?

The real protection of the school was done by UNC lawyers who got the school off Scott free, even though the school was guilty as sin. This should be a great advertisement for the UNC law school!

 

[Legendary Cock]

You have regurgitated the details of what I generaiized as the “egregious shortcomings” found by Wainstein, and which have been written about ad naseum. The overview of my thinking in para one was a synopsis of what had happened, while paragraph two represented my understanding of why the NCAA’s hands were tied and could under no circmstances rule on the legitimacy of the subject papers - the crux of thhis entire matter.

It read more like "glossing over" than generalizing.

 

[gradyjl]

It read more like "glossing over" than generalizing.

What’s your point? My intention was not to detail the “egregious” activity referenced in para one of my post. Everyone already knows the ins and outs in detail, yet you saw fit to regurgitate them, as if I was minimizing them. Para one of my post was aimed at providing a general backgound of the issue (glossed if you prefer). My intention was to point out, that despite all of that, the NCAA did not have the authorization to judge academic rigor, and even if they did, without examing individual “papers” , it (NCAA) could not arbitrarily declare certain student athletes academically ineligible, when hundreds of other regular students and student athletes (primarily black) had long since received credit for the same courses and used them toward graduation. It was not UNC lawyers that made the difference, it was the NCAA’s lawyers seeing the fallacy of levying sanctions under this scenario. It was too bad the NCAA took so long to figure this out. If you feel the NCAA could have acted differently, you just might be deluding yourself.

 

[gradyjl]

cliff notes?

but more likely this is a troll

Indeed! Para 1 was a “Cliff Notes” summary. Para 2 represents my understanding of why the NCAA could not rule on this issue. If you feel differently, so be it! You would lose.

 

[Conway Gamecock]

You have regurgitated the details of what I generaiized as the “egregious shortcomings” found by Wainstein, and which have been written about ad naseum. The overview of my thinking in para one was a synopsis of what had happened, while paragraph two represented my understanding of why the NCAA’s hands were tied and could under no circmstances rule on the legitimacy of the subject papers - the crux of thhis entire matter.

No, your post was still incorrect:

While the Wainstein report, commissioned by the University to investigate these “paper courses”, revealed egregious shortcomings in the subject courses, it concluded that while athletes populated these courses in inordinate numbers, there was no evidence that the paper classes were established for the purpose of keeping student athletes academically eligible for continuing their study from semester to semester.

First incorrection: the Wainstein Report makes ZERO final conclusions to one side or the other. It simply reports it's findings through exhaustive interviews and evidence.

Second incorrection: the Wainstein Report DOES in fact report on egregious incidents of actual attempts by the UNC administration - the AFAM faculty and staff and associates, plus various members of administration within the athletic department, only a portion of which I referenced above - to use the fake AFAM classes and to continue to use the fake AFAM classes after Crowder's retirement in 2009 SPECIFICALLY for the purpose of keeping UNC student-athletes academically eligible semester to semester.

Now, the question of "established" is made: was the AFAM fake paper classes "established" to perform this innapropriate practice for student-athletes at UNC? We won't know this for a while, as UNC has been refusing to publicly release any documentation of interviews/testimony that Nyang’oro has given to them outside of the Wainstein Report for going on 5-6 years now, to media requests - although they did release everything that Crowder testified to, which showed if nothing else, an extreme favoritism and bias from Crowder towards UNC athletics - NOT to overall UNC academics.

But the question of whether or not the AFAM fake classes were "established" for the purpose of keeping student-athletes academically eligible (I think they were) is made moot by the Wainstein Report, which shows very easily and egregiously that the AFAM fake classes were used towards that purpose for years if not decades, just the same....

 

[gradyjl]

Indeed! Para 1 was a “Cliff Notes” summary. Para 2 represents my understanding of why the NCAA could not rule on this issue. If you feel differently, so be it!

No, your post was still incorrect:



First incorrection: the Wainstein Report makes ZERO final conclusions to one side or the other. It simply reports it's findings through exhaustive interviews and evidence.

Second incorrection: the Wainstein Report DOES in fact report on egregious incidents of actual attempts by the UNC administration - the AFAM faculty and staff and associates, plus various members of administration within the athletic department, only a portion of which I referenced above - to use the fake AFAM classes and to continue to use the fake AFAM classes after Crowder's retirement in 2009 SPECIFICALLY for the purpose of keeping UNC student-athletes academically eligible semester to semester.

Now, the question of "established" is made: was the AFAM fake paper classes "established" to perform this innapropriate practice for student-athletes at UNC? We won't know this for a while, as UNC has been refusing to publicly release any documentation of interviews/testimony that Nyang’oro has given to them outside of the Wainstein Report for going on 5-6 years now, to media requests - although they did release everything that Crowder testified to, which showed if nothing else, an extreme favoritism and bias from Crowder towards UNC athletics - NOT to overall UNC academics.

But the question of whether or not the AFAM fake classes were "established" for the purpose of keeping student-athletes academically eligible (I think they were) is made moot by the Wainstein Report, which shows very easily and egregiously that the AFAM fake classes were used towards that purpose for years if not decades, just the same....

You are playing loose with what I said, attributing me with claims I did not make. My post stated that the Wainstein report concluded that student athletes populated the paper classes in inordinate numers - fact. Further, my post stated that the WR did not find that the courses were created to keep student athletes academicaly eligible (fact).

 

[Conway Gamecock]

You are playing loose with what I said, attributing me with claims I did not make. My post stated that the Wainstein report concluded that student athletes populated the paper classes in inordinate numers - fact. Further, my post stated that the WR did not find that the courses were created to keep student athletes academicaly eligible (fact).

Incorrect, once again. Did you not read the part about the bifurcated paper classes? The Report clearly showed those classes were created specifically for student-athletes' benefit: the development of a class with essentially A and B options - the A option was a normal lecture class that required class attendance, had instructors teaching, and required normal class assignments and work to be turned in, and the B option was a similar fake paper class that required NO attendance, NO instructors, and NO substantial work load beyond the typical lone paper submittal, that once again was NOT properly graded for quality, but was given rubber-stamp "A" and "B" grades, regardless of quality. This was a single course that had two "options" of how to complete it, and it was determined by Wainstein that the "B" option - the easy option - involved almost entirely student-athletes.

This bifurcated form of class was so unusual, that Wainstein referred to it as a "phenomenon". Why do you keep posting total factual untruths in regards to the Wainstein Report?? What agenda do you have here on this site??

 

[gradyjl]

Incorrect, once again. Did you not read the part about the bifurcated paper classes? The Report clearly showed those classes were created specifically for student-athletes' benefit: the development of a class with essentially A and B options - the A option was a normal lecture class that required class attendance, had instructors teaching, and required normal class assignments and work to be turned in, and the B option was a similar fake paper class that required NO attendance, NO instructors, and NO substantial work load beyond the typical lone paper submittal, that once again was NOT properly graded for quality, but was given rubber-stamp "A" and "B" grades, regardless of quality. This was a single course that had two "options" of how to complete it, and it was determined by Wainstein that the "B" option - the easy option - involved almost entirely student-athletes.

This bifurcated form of class was so unusual, that Wainstein referred to it as a "phenomenon". Why do you keep posting total factual untruths in regards to the Wainstein Report?? What agenda do you have here on this site??

Sure I read it, and I understood what I read. Nowhere did it suggest that any arm of the bifurcated courses was bifurcated so as to allow student athletes to remain academically eligible, but rather to allow student athletes to write a paper instead of attending class. You make a leap that even the NCAA did not make. Sure things were done to benefit the student athlete, to allow him to handle both sports and academics. Things that normal students do not require. This is only logical. But in your attempt to assign wrongdoing and exact a pound of flesh, You spin and twist to suit your agenda. I have no agenda other than to provide my take on why the NCAA was unable to sanction UNC. What is your agenda?

 

[Conway Gamecock]

Sure I read it, and I understood what I read. Nowhere did it suggest that any arm of the bifurcated courses was bifurcated so as to allow student athletes to remain academically eligible, but rather to allow student athletes to write a paper instead of attending class. You make a leap that even the NCAA did not make. Sure things were done to benefit the student athlete, to allow him to handle both sports and academics. Things that normal students do not require. This is only logical. But in your attempt to assign wrongdoing and exact a pound of flesh, You spin and twist to suit your agenda. I have no agenda other than to provide my take on why the NCAA was unable to sanction UNC. What is your agenda?

Things that normal students do not require??? Normal students would not require an easy class as to opposed to a harder one? Would not require a class that didn't require attendance, as to opposed to one that did? Would not require a class that only required one paper submitted, as opposed to needing to do homework and study hall research, and submitting multiple class work over the duration of the course? Would not require receiving a grade that always is an "A" or "B", regardless of whether they earned it or not, as opposed to only receiving a grade commiserate to what quality of work they turn in?

Now you're just being illogical, and rather obvious. Again, what agenda do you have by posting this nonsense here?

 

[hobcawcreekcock]

This article contains major b.s. Good intentions are no excuse for academic corruption. UNC had a veritable army of administrators, and coaches. Why did they not do their jobs and provide oversight in order to protect the academic reputation of their school?

The real protection of the school was done by UNC lawyers who got the school off Scott free, even though the school was guilty as sin. This should be a great advertisement for the UNC law school!

Sure, EIGHTEEN MILLION DOLLARS in legal fees, and a lawsuit against the NCAA later a small slap on the wrist. Who says cheaters never win, UNcarolina proved that wrong.

 

[gradyjl]

Sure, EIGHTEEN MILLION DOLLARS in legal fees, and a lawsuit against the NCAA later a small slap on the wrist. Who says cheaters never win, UNcarolina proved that wrong.

Much of that money went to commissions, such as the WR commission, which only served to point out where UNC had gone wrong. An early report was much kinder to UNC, but UNC subsequently commissioned Wainstein to do a more intensive study. I think UNC acted admirably ferreting out its mistakes for the whole world to see. It did not have to. UNC Chancellor and BOG wanted to make ammends. It’s not UNC’s fault that the NCAA concluded UNC did not violate its rules. By the way, provide link on UNC lawsuit against NCAA on this issue. Is this a fact, or are you making false assumptions? Not saying you are wrong, Im just not aware of UNC suing NCAA. Im sure you dont want to mislead those who are following this thread.

 

[Legendary Cock]

What’s your point? My intention was not to detail the “egregious” activity referenced in para one of my post. Everyone already knows the ins and outs in detail, yet you saw fit to regurgitate them, as if I was minimizing them. Para one of my post was aimed at providing a general backgound of the issue (glossed if you prefer). My intention was to point out, that despite all of that, the NCAA did not have the authorization to judge academic rigor, and even if they did, without examing individual “papers” , it (NCAA) could not arbitrarily declare certain student athletes academically ineligible, when hundreds of other regular students and student athletes (primarily black) had long since received credit for the same courses and used them toward graduation. It was not UNC lawyers that made the difference, it was the NCAA’s lawyers seeing the fallacy of levying sanctions under this scenario. It was too bad the NCAA took so long to figure this out. If you feel the NCAA could have acted differently, you just might be deluding yourself.

1. In my one sentence reply, I regurgitated nothing. I simply said you glossed over some of the pertinent charges in the case, which you freely admitted in this blithering response, in a clear attempt to alleviate UNCheat of any and all guilt.

2. The actual rebuttal to your self-serving rant was made another poster, with whom I wholeheartedly agree.

Have a nice day, Tarheel.

 

[Legendary Cock]

Things that normal students do not require??? Normal students would not require an easy class as to opposed to a harder one? Would not require a class that didn't require attendance, as to opposed to one that did? Would not require a class that only required one paper submitted, as opposed to needing to do homework and study hall research, and submitting multiple class work over the duration of the course? Would not require receiving a grade that always is an "A" or "B", regardless of whether they earned it or not, as opposed to only receiving a grade commiserate to what quality of work they turn in?

Now you're just being illogical, and rather obvious. Again, what agenda do you have by posting this nonsense here?

Thank you for your well-researched response to this blather. Would you mind sharing this with our two or three resident lawyers that insist UNC did nothing wrong simply because they "lawyered up?"

 

[gradyjl]

Thank you for your well-researched response to this blather. Would you mind sharing this with our two or three resident lawyers that insist UNC did nothing wrong simply because they "lawyered up?"

I’m still waiting on the link which confirms UNC sued the NCAA over subject academic scandal. If you lie about this, you’ll lie about other things.

 

[gradyjl]

1. In my one sentence reply, I regurgitated nothing. I simply said you glossed over some of the pertinent charges in the case, which you freely admitted in this blithering response, in a clear attempt to alleviate UNCheat of any and all guilt.

2. The actual rebuttal to your self-serving rant was made another poster, with whom I wholeheartedly agree.

Have a nice day, Tarheel.

Just to set the record straight. I neither deny that UNC A&S Deans and other administrators from academics dropped the ball and ignored proper governance over the AFAM Department and its egregious machinations involving the paper courses, nor do I languish over the matter. It happened, but ammends were made and UNC has moved on. I studied at UNC as a graduate and post graduate student, and later taught there. I know the truth about the rigors of study at UNC, and I do not need the opinions of an outsider, particularly an ABC’er, on UNC academics and sports. You are better served by taking your biased, misguided thinking to a like-minded audience.

 

[Legendary Cock]

I’m still waiting on the link which confirms UNC sued the NCAA over subject academic scandal. If you lie about this, you’ll lie about other things.

Lawyering up does not imply suing. It simply means that they hired lawyers to defend them against charges of wrongdoing. But if you want proof that they hired lawyers, here's just one example: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.si...tice-allegations-noa-tar-heels-academic-fraud

 

[gradyjl]

Lawyering up does not imply suing. It simply means that they hired lawyers to defend them against charges of wrongdoing. But if you want proof that they hired lawyers, here's just one example: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.si...tice-allegations-noa-tar-heels-academic-fraud

Did you simply misspeak earlier when you said UNC had brought suit against the NCAA?

 

[Legendary Cock]

Just to set the record straight. I neither deny that UNC A&S Deans and other administrators from academics dropped the ball and ignored proper governance over the AFAM Department and its egregious machinations involving the paper courses, nor do I languish over the matter. It happened, but ammends were made and UNC has moved on. I studied at UNC as a graduate and post graduate student, and later taught there. I know the truth about the rigors of study at UNC, and I do not need the opinions of an outsider, particularly an ABC’er, on UNC academics and sports. You are better served by taking your biased, misguided thinking to a like-minded audience.

Yeah, they moved on alright. After stalling and lying for an extra year, they got to keep competing and hang a banner when almost every other team would've been banned from postseason play.

Lol. You know "the truth." Funny how that "truth" wholly benefits your team, facts be damned.

As for my taking my thoughts to a like minded audience, you came to our neighborhood junior. Maybe you ought to go on back to your echo chamber where someone will believe your BS.

 

[Legendary Cock]

Did you simply misspeak earlier when you said UNC had brought suit against the NCAA?

Show me where I said unc brought suit against the NCAA?

 

[gradyjl]

Yeah, they moved on alright. After stalling and lying for an extra year, they got to keep competing and hang a banner when almost every other team would've been banned from postseason play.

Lol. You know "the truth." Funny how that "truth" wholly benefits your team, facts be damned.

As for my taking my thoughts to a like minded audience, you came to our neighborhood junior. Maybe you ought to go on back to your echo chamber where someone will believe your BS.

You don’t appear to be educated. Your argument is too passionate and strident, lacking in perspective and attributes of an open mind. (You are bigoted and boorish.)

 

[Legendary Cock]

You don’t appear to be educated. Your argument is too passionate and strident, lacking in perspective and attributes of an open mind. (You are bigoted and boorish.)

Lol. You still haven't refuted anything I've said. But, hey, you know what they say:

When you can't attack the charges, attack the person. Or better yet, when you have the facts, pound the facts. When you don't, pound the table. Don't hurt yourself, because you sure aren't my feelings with your petty insults.

Goodnight!

 

[gradyjl]

Show me where I said unc brought suit against the NCAA?

I apologize, this claim was made by an earlier poster. Let’s stop this, Ive embarrassed myself by attacking you personally. And in certain cases, it was due to my own confusion. I’m sorry.

 

[hobcawcreekcock]

Much of that money went to commissions, such as the WR commission, which only served to point out where UNC had gone wrong. An early report was much kinder to UNC, but UNC subsequently commissioned Wainstein to do a more intensive study. I think UNC acted admirably ferreting out its mistakes for the whole world to see. It did not have to. UNC Chancellor and BOG wanted to make ammends. It’s not UNC’s fault that the NCAA concluded UNC did not violate its rules. By the way, provide link on UNC lawsuit against NCAA on this issue. Is this a fact, or are you making false assumptions? Not saying you are wrong, Im just not aware of UNC suing NCAA. Im sure you dont want to mislead those who are following this thread.

There was never a lawsuit filed, but after the eighteen million dollars paid out to UNC's legal team, there definitely was the threat of a lawsuit vs. the NCAA if any further investigations or sanctions were brought forward.

You can spin this any way you want, but UNC got away with INSTITUTIONAL academic fraud, cost Black Santa Clause and Butch Davis their jobs. The WBB coach is next on the list, she'll be gone soon. Classes that no one attended, test scores that no one ever took, grades for courses never completed, and a UNC degree in AAS, that at one time carried a decent amount of prestige. If you're an UNC grad, you should be damned disgusted with this bullshit. It tainted your school, reputation, and without the multi millions supplied by a few foundations in Chapel Hill, a dose of NCAA PROBATION. Congrats UNC 'lawyered' your way out of INSTITUTIONAL academic FRAUD! It's really that simple tar heel.

 

[Legendary Cock]

I apologize, this claim was made by an earlier poster. Let’s stop this, Ive embarrassed myself by attacking you personally. And in certain cases, it was due to my own confusion. I’m sorry.

Apology accepted. I'm absolutely willing to move on from this.

 

[gradyjl]

Apology accepted. I'm absolutely willing to move on from this.

Thank you. I was more than embarrassed, i was ashamed. Hell, I dont even know you. If I attacked every person who doesnt share all of my views, I wouldn’t have any friends. Look forward to reading any future posts you make. -Jeff

 

[Silverspur02]

I started reading all of this and then I thought.... I don't care....

Go Cocks!! Screw clemsux! Screw Dook!! Screw UNC!!

 

[gradyjl]

I don't care....

Go Cocks!! Screw clemsux! Screw Dook!! Screw UNC!!

And screw Cherry Grove while we’re at it!

 

[Conway Gamecock]

But in your attempt to assign wrongdoing and exact a pound of flesh, You spin and twist to suit your agenda. I have no agenda other than to provide my take on why the NCAA was unable to sanction UNC. What is your agenda?

You want to see some REAL spin and twisting?

Further, my post stated that the WR [Wainstein Report] did not find that the courses were created to keep student athletes academicaly eligible (fact).

Directly from the Wainstein Report:

- A high average class grade, as the grade rosters for irregular paper classes typically included only As and Bs, whereas regular courses taught by Nyang’oro often included grades of C or lower; and

- The scheduling of the class during summer session when Nyang’oro was
working on a research or consulting project away from campus, which were
times when Crowder was more likely to arrange a paper class.

c. Post-Crowder Paper Classes

Immediately after Crowder retired, Nyang’oro hoped to limit or even eliminate the paper classes in the AFAM Department. His commitment to that objective was short-lived, however, as it faltered in the face of football counselor Lee’s focused effort to persuade him to keep them going. As the email traffic reflects, Nyang’oro quickly gave in to Lee’s entreaties, and ultimately offered two paper classes and one independent study paper class (along with three bifurcated classes) between Crowder’s retirement in 2009 and the summer of 2011.

The paper classes and independent study paper class were AFAM 428: AFAM Bioethics in Fall 2010, AFRI 396: Independent Studies in Summer Session I 2011, and AFAM 280: Blacks in North Carolina in Summer Session II 2011. There were a total of 44 student enrollments in these three classes, of whom 33 were student-athletes – 32 football enrollments and one women’s basketball enrollment.

In addition, he offered two bifurcated classes in which between one-third
and one-half of the enrolled students took a paper class in lieu of a regular lecture class.

The three paper classes were identical to the paper classes offered before Crowder’s retirement in that they never actually met and involved no meaningful professorial contact. They were different, however, in that Nyang’oro – and not Crowder – graded the submitted papers.

Despite this important difference, we feel comfortable counting these among the paper classes due to Nyang’oro’s admission that the grades he assigned were based not on the quality of the paper but on his assessment of the grade each student needed in order to remain academically or athletically eligible. As Nyang’oro explained to us, he was very lenient in grading these post-Crowder paper classes, and would typically just skim the papers. He asked [AFAM administrative associate Travis] Gore to provide him the GPAs of all the students, and would then assign grades based largely on his assessment of the impact that grade would have on the student’s ability to remain eligible. The result was an average grade of 3.37 across the three paper classes he offered after Crowder’s retirement.

Just go away, Tarheel. No one is going to side with your blind spins and dodges of outright cheating.....

 

[Silverspur02]

And screw Cherry Grove while we’re at it!

Oooh.. that hurt...