Would you rather have Jason Brown your starting QB next season or Gauthier? Who would you think would have a better chance to succeed?
Another Damn Recruiting Thread
- Thread starter Joe MorrisonLives
- Start date
The problem is he fell off the face of the Earth this year when a new WR came in. I hope it works out because our WR corp is a definite weakness.
I'm actually more intrigued with the WR from St. Francis. I swear I would play him some at TE. I dont see too many LBs covering him.
I think they are going to move him around a bunch I think one thing we can expect from these coaches is creativity
Also note to his drop in production was with a new QB the one the previous year was much more successful throwing
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We have half their numbers, I didn't say that's where the best talent comes from and you're still not laying out a realistic path to how we could realistically get better talent. We kept the QB that was starting at the end of the year. We have talent that did it in college coming in instead of gambling on prospects we can't scout.
Another way to view it is we lost a lot of talent that was held back by a system that is anachronistic. Our safeties couldn't play fast because Muschamp's system put too much on them, we have a 4-star juco LB coming in, Brown is coming back from injury, we lost a lot of culture cancer and we axed the head coach that got all of our players injured over the year.
The injury issue alone is a big deal. Maybe we won't have the talent to knock off a top 5 team this year, which Champ could do but maybe we'll stay healthy enough and use the talent we have well enough to go bowling this year and kick off the next couple of recruiting classes.
I addressed all of your points, you didn't even address all of the ones a made to that point. If you want to argue than stop ignoring the arguments.
What's controlling about saying you shouldn't argue with addressing the counter arguments. Our class is bad because we were asking for dates a day before prom and all the good ones were taken. We hit the transfers and did good considering we weren't going to beat out Oklahoma and FSU, because it was the best option we had. That's the argument. What's wrong with putting that context out there?
You sure you wouldn't rather have a short and show 3-star that signed with Vandy over the St Francis guy?
I'm hoping we'll have better coaching in a more WR friendly system because there is no good reason why the guys we have in campus should be this bad. Maybe if just one guy can turn it on we won't have to. Between Powers, Caldwell and Leggette, someone should put it together, but they haven't to this point. However, if just one can become a real threat, I don't think we'll have to move him around. One can dream.
Your arguments don't hold water. We are the only SEC school that picked up all its transfer portal players from no name teams like Belmont. There were a ton of portal transfers from big P5 schools as well as other FBS schools. Why did we not land ANY of these? Did we even try? Florida St picked up our best Dlineman off the portal and they certainly have been no big powerhouse over last 6 or 8 years. We did not pick up anyone of that caliber. If you think we can be competitive in the SEC by filling our roster with FCS transfers then you are delusional.
Blaming the lack of talent on Muschamp is ignorant. He may not have coached the players properly, but I don't believe you were at ANY of their practices, so you don't know what he did or didn't do. You also don't know if this staff will do any better in that department as there is little body of work to judge that on. All we know is what we have here and now. All you do is speculate. I'm not in the business of speculation, only looking at facts, and so far you have few to argue.
You act as though we are the only school who has had to deal with recruiting issues related to the pandemic. Every other school has had to deal with those same issues. Every other school has had to deal with injury issues as well. Several other schools had coaching changes as well, with some new hires occurring after ours. Yet we have the lowest ranking in recruiting of any other SEC school and not by a narrow margin.
I'm not blaming all this on Beamer. He did inherit a mess. But so did other schools and we are at the bottom. As I have stated several times in different threads the real test will come in the 2022 and 2023 seasons and recruiting cycles. Maybe he can turn this around, but you cannot just ignore the current situation and just think this is all going to work out peachy at this point without having skepticism. If he doesn't have a significant improvement in recruiting over the next 2 cycles, the writing will be on the wall. We shall see. I sincerely hope he does, but at this point I have doubts. Anyone with half a brain should as well.
Quite honestly, I’d say it’s too early to tell.
They basically kept all of Mason’s commits, likely because a lot of guys go to Vandy first and foremost for academics. Nothing wrong with that.
Contrast, the commits we lost were snapped up immediately when they decommitted.
Would that happen with Vandy commits? Not so sure. They signed a guy from Sumter who, quite honestly I’d never seen mentioned in recruiting talk. I’ve never even heard his name mentioned at all before reading that article. I’m not sure we offered him, and I don’t think Clemson offered him.
I think some of our transfers are intriguing. The two St Francis guys weren’t recruited heavily in HS, the QB due to injury and the WR mainly being a 185lb basketball player who couldn’t gain weight. The QB appears to be pretty fundamentally sound, the WR is now 235lbs with room to add more. Watching his film reminds me somewhat of Alshon, with his basketball background he really uses his body to block out defenders.
The DE from Ga St wasn’t recruited out of HS because he was also ballpark of 185 lbs. He walked on, is now in the 220 range, led the nation in sacks, and again, in a good S/C and nutrition program can add more good weight.
The LB from Delaware was an undersized tackling machine in HS. He’s reportedly working out like crazy, he stands to add good weight and he reportedly loves to hit.
Hated losing the transfers we lost, but if they didn’t want to be here are we really worse off?
Most if not all transition schools picked out of the same two pools.
two kind of transfers: ones that underperformed at their current equivalent level school or pick players that over preformed at a lower level school
If you want to do your homework and look it up the majority of transfers to transition p5 schools fall into these camps. A very rare outlier of successful p5 player moving to another p5 team that is in transition.
I was going to list them all out but just look at Texas if you want to see how even they couldn’t attract high p5 transfers
two kind of transfers: ones that underperformed at their current equivalent level school or pick players that over preformed at a lower level school
If you want to do your homework and look it up the majority of transfers to transition p5 schools fall into these camps. A very rare outlier of successful p5 player moving to another p5 team that is in transition.
I was going to list them all out but just look at Texas if you want to see how even they couldn’t attract high p5 transfers
Rivals rated the recruiting effort an A and while they are guessing as much as anything I still think the class is better than the F some posters on here are calling it. When only 13 players make up your score compared to everyone else’s 20 players it’s hard to overcome that many zeros.
Not with 4.5 speed. And at 6’8 not many people will out-jump him for a ball.
Man this is a tuff one. I think either one is a great choice but Jason has a little experience at a lower college level but I would let this play out during the spring I think we can win with both. Great question tho.....
Okay, I'm willing the acknowledge we've only gotten players from places like GT and Nebraska. 6 of FSU's 8 transfers were Florida boys. Name one other school that had 9 commits and a new coach on December 6th with a week and a half to find and SCOUT QUALITY recruits while coming off of a 2-win season.
Also we have been the most injured SEC team over the last 3 years and that's not a question. Alabama was similarly injured 2018 and 2019 and got a new s&c coach and stayed healthy last year, don't know why our new hire didn't work out for us.
Also, I didn't say Muschamp couldn't coach, I said safety is notoriously hard to play in his system and our safeties have plainly not played to their talent. Muschamp has said safety is really demanding in his system and it was the weak link on defense every year despite bringing in good opponents.
So you told me a bunch of things I didn't say, ignored must of the real scenario I did paint, only acknowledge the 3 players that came from lower divisions to suit your point, said we haven't had unusual injury rates when we barely ended any of the last 3 years with starters left and after all of that stupid crap called me brainless.
I didn't think we just topped the 2010 class, this isn't a very good class, what I said was we did what could be expected given the circumstances, all of them not just the ones you acknowledge, we did the best one could reasonably expect and it isn't proof that Beamer is already a wash.
I know what we lost, I know we had more talent last year, but with two 5-star DL and two early round NFL DBs our defense sucked, which means we didn't maximize that talent. A couple of years ago we had 3 NFL WRs and some pro talent on OL and didn't maximize that talent, unless you think that 2018 offense should'nt have been capable of more. So I stand by it, we're replacing a defense that is too complicated to play fast and was made to beat pro-style and are replacing it with a cutting edge defense that is built for modern offenses and an offense the coaches are trying to structure around the concepts of the two most cutting edge offenses in recent years.
Forgive me if I feel people are wrong for not giving Beamer a chance before we even have Spring Practice because that's what this is about.
I started this thread to just highlight everything that was working against a coach that doesn't even get to have a grace period prior to coaching his first spring game asking people critical of him how he could've done better that isn't just "he should've done better" and a line of people have ignored half of the mitigating factors I brought up while calling me brainless. A lot of y'all gotta figure some stuff out of this is the way you act.
These people will be miserable if these transfers end up being productive
Like I said. Some of same posters who never look at factors you brought up and never see the true facts
I could have told you these posters would go on attack mode
They are “ realist “ or something like that
Transfer from Nebraska and Ga. Tech. Ga. Southern and Ga. State are not that bad. They also have one from Ga. Military which USC has used plenty in the past. The guys from St. Francis can't be any worse than some from last year.
The fact you have to raise that scenario speaks volumes in and of itself. I'll leave it at that.
Actually we were the "realist" with the Muschamp mess, remind us again how wrong we were since you told us up until the day we canned him he was "turning it around and heading in the right direction". You have little credibility lecturing us about this topic.
Don't see why, Doty is the starter and if the pieces fall in around him he'll be a damn good one.
What's the deal with all these new posters on here that are over the top unrealistic and positive?
He's going to be given a chance to be successful.
The problem with you guys are trying to argue he's already been successful. Beamer is going to need to prove it on the field and more importantly in the Class of 2022. If he struggles in that class, we're done.
I didn't argue that, I argued he did the best that could be reasonably expected under the circumstances and it isn't the disaster some are claiming because we mined the transfers. What I've asked time and again is what realistic path could did have to get a better talent influx?
I used to be on cockytalk. The unrealistic expectations and constant negativity when I'm dropping by for information is what made be pissed enough to start here. What is unrealistically over the top and positive about saying we improved the WR position and did better with transfers than we would have signing a full recruiting class with the zero talent left uncommitted and no time to scout and build relationships?
Edit: honestly if you think this is me anointing us "back" then the only thing it proves is your reading comprehension blows.
Actually, Rivals didn't rate us an A. A kid, an independent contractor with Rivals, did. Just some 20 year old who wrote an article.
Positive is good. Ignoring the reality around you is bad.
It’s hard to even comment on this because the truth will be perceived/revealed/accepted as negative.
First off...you don’t have facts, you have opinions.
also-your assumption is that a random 3 star recruit is a “warm body”just like your assuming that these FCS transfers are great pickups and not warm bodies. My argument is this: go look at the majority of our best players ever have been the last 40 years....3 star players. Meaning- we have had many more solid 3star contributor recruits than we have 4/5 stars...and more solid 3 star guys than all 2 star and unrated combined players . So I hate your usage of random 3 star players as warm bodies. USC is a 3 star football program...mixed in with some higher profile guys.
secondly- the whole which other coach could’ve done better. Obviously there is no way to answer this because literally nobody else was the HC for usc in late 2020 into 2021 to compare against. You are obviously set on defending him without reason or analyzation being applied. We will see how he does because whether you like it or not- one big fact is a HCs record IS what he is in college football. The reasons, excuses and scenarios don’t matter...results do and he will need them to keep this job.
I noticed You didn’t answer the question, that speaks volumes on the crux of your whole argument.
Well pal....we just had about 5-6 starters from fcs teams on last years team...how did you like it?
Apologies in advance for grouping c. Hill in with the other fcs guys....but he played like an fcs guy attempting to play in the SEC.
I didn’t like it....but they couldn’t compete. 2 wins says it all
You mean 80% of our recruits who are 3 stars turn out to sometimes be good players? Outstanding perspective.
Now look at the three stars in each class and see what percentage actually contributed meaningfully. My guess would be less than 20%
Care to name those 5-6? Were any of them all American candidates?
And you can’t link hill in there he was a d1 three star recruit that I bet Brown out performs
Yes this is right. I guess he went from running a 4.9 at 5’11 and after a year or two grew 8 inches and got NFL caliber speed.
I know nothing about this kid...but beside Harold carmichael...let me know when you come across a 6’7-6’8 receiver that does well in any level of football.
Ps- I know full well y’all don’t know who that is...and I think he was 6’6 ...but the point still stands
I'm not sure there was any chance he was going to be successful in the class of 2021, but it's far too early to say he was successful in transfer by signing a guy who couldn't play for Nebraska and kids from an FCS school we have never heard of before.
