Big 3 mens sports...

[WOFJRP]

Steve Spurrier's last 3 years of recruiting were all top 20 classes, 2 of the 3 were ranked higher than Clemson's. His last full season we beat #5 Georgia; lost by a touchdown to #6 Auburn at Auburn, beat Florida at Florida and we won our 4th straight bowl game. If you think Eric Hyman would have fired Spurrier at that point you are nuts.

 

[FORKCOCK]

I assure you, it was not tongue and cheek. Several others on this board heard the interview.

Whatever it was, it doesn't matter, because the coaches, Muschamp in particular, have said that whatever they ask for, they get.

They might now. Doesn't change what might have caused us to get in this situation. A head coach that quit working and an AD that was blind.

 

[polo-loco]

The idiocy on this board never ceases to amaze.
Football: bad end to the year, but Muschamp has re-energized a 3-9 program ... 3 straight bowl trips. It's not a dumpster fire. Uphill mountain this coming season with the schedule. But our football program in its history has an overall .500 record (give or take a game or 2), so to say this is its lowest point is dumb. We don't have the history you think we do.

Basketball: Same thing. Some great moments in our history 50 years ago. Not much in between. Disappointing losses in Nov. and Dec., but if you can't see the exciting young players we have coming back and the ones who could not play this year, then you're missing out. Again, not much of a good history with the program, but since joining SEC in '92, USC has 6 winning seasons in conference play.... 3 of those have come in the last 4 years. We are 2 years removed from our first trip to Final 4 and first win in NCAA Tournament in a generation... and you want to fire that coach?

Baseball: Team is not very good this year. This is certainly the program with the most history. With limited scholarships in the sport it's probably the most difficult to be consistently elite. Makes you appreciate how good Tanner was as a coach. Kingston brought team to Supers JUST LAST YEAR! In recruiting sports such as baseball and softball, most of those kids commit early in high school careers. His best players are not going to be the ones that committed last year, this year or next year. The best ones are probably still freshman or sophomores in high school. Right now he's patching it together. Oh, and the man did bring the team to Super Regionals last year. Team may not be good this year, but that doesn't make the program at an all-time low.

So, we've sucked in the past and we should accept that outcome for now and forever. Got it.

 

[Kitchenlabs]

They might now. Doesn't change what might have caused us to get in this situation. A head coach that quit working and an AD that was blind.

Blind to what? You are just looking for excuses to bash Tanner.

 

[WOFJRP]

They might now. Doesn't change what might have caused us to get in this situation. A head coach that quit working and an AD that was blind.

Ray Tanner said that because in spite of the low expenditures, Spurrier's recruiting classes were consistently ranked high, in spite of the FGF mythology to the contrary.

RECRUTING RANKINGS

2011: SC 14 Clemson 11 (SC brought in the #1 ranked recruit this year)
2012: SC 15 Clemson 23
2013: SC 15 Clemson 18
2014: SC 16 Clemson 24
2015: SC 20 Clemson 9

When the wheels fell off we were a season removed from finishing 4th in the final poll. If you saw the precipitous fall coming you are the nation's foremost football expert.

 

[FORKCOCK]

They might now. Doesn't change what might have caused us to get in this situation. A head coach that quit working and an AD that was blind.

Blind to what? You are just looking for excuses to bash Tanner.

Tanner, great baseball coach. Maybe best coach ever at Carolina. As an AD, it has been pretty bad for the top 3 men's sports.

 

[rogue cock]

Steve Spurrier's last 3 years of recruiting were all top 20 classes, 2 of the 3 were ranked higher than Clemson's. His last full season we beat #5 Georgia; lost by a touchdown to #6 Auburn at Auburn, beat Florida at Florida and we won our 4th straight bowl game. If you think Eric Hyman would have fired Spurrier at that point you are nuts.

Look at their offers. We are getting 3-star players now that have more offers from top teams than some of those 4-star. A few were in more than one of those recruiting classes because they failed to make it in school. We were getting low-hanging fruit that were marginal academically or not as good as their "stars."

 

[rogue cock]

I assure you, it was not tongue and cheek. Several others on this board heard the interview.

The money was there for Spurrier's asking. Muschamp's budget is much greater than Spurrier's and you can see the impact. Spurrier nor his staff were 24/7/365 recruiters...so he didn't need or ask for the budget to do so. I wouldn't be surprised that Staley on a per player basis significantly outspent Spurrier.

 

[rogue cock]

Tanner, great baseball coach. Maybe best coach ever at Carolina. As an AD, it has been pretty bad for the top 3 men's sports.

Correlation does not equal causation.

 

[MTsumner92]

We will be better at all three next year.

 

[MookieBlaylock9]

Looks at records of three men's sports...

AD must be bad.

Brilliant.

 

[WOFJRP]

Look at their offers. We are getting 3-star players now that have more offers from top teams than some of those 4-star. A few were in more than one of those recruiting classes because they failed to make it in school. We were getting low-hanging fruit that were marginal academically or not as good as their "stars."

You'll have to show me the "low-hanging fruit". Marcus Lattimore, Jadaveon Clowney, Stephon Gilmore, DeVontae Holloman, Shaq Davidson, Shaq Roland, Chris Culliver, O.J. Murdoch, C.C. Whitlock, Quay Lewis, Abu Lamin, Dante Sawyer, Connor Mitch, Brandon McIlwain, Cliff Edwards, Alshon Jeffrey, David Williams, to name a few, had offers from a lot of the big programs. Several of those didn't pan out. All you have to do is look at the number of players that came through here while Spurrier coached that made it to the NFL and there's a mixed bag, there are 4 stars that made it and there are players that THEY developed that made it to the NFL.

Lou Holtz once said "Steve Spurrier can take his players and beat you and he could take your players and beat you". This constant Spurrier bashing on here is ridiculous. The guy did more for SC football than anyone in the school's history.

 

[polo-loco]

Blind to what? You are just looking for excuses to bash Tanner.

No excuses necessary.

 

[rogue cock]

You'll have to show me the "low-hanging fruit". Marcus Lattimore, Jadaveon Clowney, Stephon Gilmore, DeVontae Holloman, Shaq Davidson, Shaq Roland, Chris Culliver, O.J. Murdoch, C.C. Whitlock, Quay Lewis, Abu Lamin, Dante Sawyer, Connor Mitch, Brandon McIlwain, Cliff Edwards, Alshon Jeffrey, David Williams, to name a few, had offers from a lot of the big programs. Several of those didn't pan out. All you have to do is look at the number of players that came through here while Spurrier coached that made it to the NFL and there's a mixed bag, there are 4 stars that made it and there are players that THEY developed that made it to the NFL.

Lou Holtz once said "Steve Spurrier can take his players and beat you and he could take your players and beat you". This constant Spurrier bashing on here is ridiculous. The guy did more for SC football than anyone in the school's history.

Start with 2013....Na'Ty Rogers, Dante Sawyer, Dexter Wideman, Devin Washington, David Johnson, Jalen Christian, Octavis Johnson, Dennis Daley, Devonte Covington, there were a lot in 2015. And there were a lot more that never lived up to their rating or offers.

 

[WOFJRP]

Start with 2013....Na'Ty Rogers, Dante Sawyer, Dexter Wideman, Devin Washington, David Johnson, Jalen Christian, Octavis Johnson, Dennis Daley, Devonte Covington, there were a lot in 2015. And there were a lot more that never lived up to their rating or offers.

Start with 2013....Na'Ty Rogers, Dante Sawyer, Dexter Wideman, Devin Washington, David Johnson, Jalen Christian, Octavis Johnson, Dennis Daley, Devonte Covington, there were a lot in 2015. And there were a lot more that never lived up to their rating or offers.

Not really sure what your point is there, Na'Ty Rogers was the 27th ranked OL in the country, Dante Sawyer and Dexter Wideman both had offer lists a mile long, David Johnson was 18th ranked DE in the country, Dennis Daley will probably get a shot at the pros. In that same class Skai Moore and Pharoh Cooper were 3 star recruits, both have started in the NFL. During the last 5 years of Spurrier's tenure we had far more early departures for the NFL than Clemson did. Whatever recruiting shortcomings there may have been those early departures hurt way worse.

Every team recruits duds. Of the highest ranked class of Clemson (2015) that I mentioned, of the 10 4 star recruits they signed, 3 of them either never played a down or saw limited action in their college careers. 2013, 8 4 star signed 3 of them saw limited or no action in their careers.

 

[rogue cock]

Not really sure what your point is there, Na'Ty Rogers was the 27th ranked OL in the country, Dante Sawyer and Dexter Wideman both had offer lists a mile long, David Johnson was 18th ranked DE in the country, Dennis Daley will probably get a shot at the pros. In that same class Skai Moore and Pharoh Cooper were 3 star recruits, both have started in the NFL. During the last 5 years of Spurrier's tenure we had far more early departures for the NFL than Clemson did. Whatever recruiting shortcomings there may have been those early departures hurt way worse.

Every team recruits duds. Of the highest ranked class of Clemson (2015) that I mentioned, of the 10 4 star recruits they signed, 3 of them either never played a down or saw limited action in their college careers. 2013, 8 4 star signed 3 of them saw limited or no action in their careers.

I know they were rated fairly high. My point was and is that their offer lists weren't what they should be based on their rating. Due to qualifying issues, Sawyer and a couple of others also counted in more than one class, thereby inflating one of those two classes they were erroneously counted in.

 

[Kitchenlabs]

No excuses necessary.

 

[SomebodyLookatThis]

You mean the Clemson which has won two national championships during Muschamp's three year tenure at USC? It's good to have high expectations. Unreasonable expectations are a different thing altogether. Like it or not, Clemson has become an elite program over the last three years. One of the two best programs in the country, as much as it pains me to say.

And I would argue that Carolina was competitive with Clemson this last November. Carolina had two first and tens stall with zero points. Convert those to even field goals and the complexion of the game is vastly different. And Clemson had a late trash time touchdown to extend the margin from 14 to 21. Anyone who watched the game knows Carolina was competitive.

Granted, 21 point losses to our arch rival, no matter how good they are, won't get it moving forward, and Muschamp does need to begin wracking up some quality wins. And God knows that debacle against UVA was inexplicable. But three years in, considering what he inherited, I am generally pleased with Muschamp.

While that is true, Clemson did go on a 49-14 run after the opening TD and led by 28 going into the 4th. it's not like it was a 2 TD game the whole time, they basically just put it back where it was. They also had a TD called back before the half. I would say they just never gave up more than it was competitive. Clemson was never worried about losing at any point. If anything all it did was piss off the defense for what they did the remaining 3 games. 4th qtr was just a wash all together.

 

[polo-loco]

While that is true, Clemson did go on a 49-14 run after the opening TD and led by 28 going into the 4th. it's not like it was a 2 TD game the whole time, they basically just put it back where it was. They also had a TD called back before the half. I would say they just never gave up more than it was competitive. Clemson was never worried about losing at any point. If anything all it did was piss off the defense for what they did the remaining 3 games. 4th qtr was just a wash all together.

The notion a three touchdown loss was anything but an ass whipping is proof how far apart our programs are currently.

 

[king ward]

The notion a three touchdown loss was anything but an ass whipping is proof how far apart our programs are currently.

How anyone could dispute this is mystifying to me.

 

[jonesz21]

The idiocy on this board never ceases to amaze.
Football: bad end to the year, but Muschamp has re-energized a 3-9 program ... 3 straight bowl trips. It's not a dumpster fire. Uphill mountain this coming season with the schedule. But our football program in its history has an overall .500 record (give or take a game or 2), so to say this is its lowest point is dumb. We don't have the history you think we do.

Basketball: Same thing. Some great moments in our history 50 years ago. Not much in between. Disappointing losses in Nov. and Dec., but if you can't see the exciting young players we have coming back and the ones who could not play this year, then you're missing out. Again, not much of a good history with the program, but since joining SEC in '92, USC has 6 winning seasons in conference play.... 3 of those have come in the last 4 years. We are 2 years removed from our first trip to Final 4 and first win in NCAA Tournament in a generation... and you want to fire that coach?

Baseball: Team is not very good this year. This is certainly the program with the most history. With limited scholarships in the sport it's probably the most difficult to be consistently elite. Makes you appreciate how good Tanner was as a coach. Kingston brought team to Supers JUST LAST YEAR! In recruiting sports such as baseball and softball, most of those kids commit early in high school careers. His best players are not going to be the ones that committed last year, this year or next year. The best ones are probably still freshman or sophomores in high school. Right now he's patching it together. Oh, and the man did bring the team to Super Regionals last year. Team may not be good this year, but that doesn't make the program at an all-time low.

Clemson should not own us in all 3 but they do. Why? Better facilities? No. More money? No. Better leadership? Hmmmm

 

[JasonScottinSC]

So, we've sucked in the past and we should accept that outcome for now and forever. Got it.

No, we've sucked in the past and things have actually been pretty good. You missed the point, completely.

 

[USCBatgirl21]

The question is why was our program allowed to slip so far why Clemson was stockpiling talent?[/B]

Because WE, the fans, gave SOS, the person who brought the 5 peat and 3 straight 11 wins seasons, a blank check to do whatever he wanted, no questions asked. WE let this happen by elevating him so high on a pedestal that no one dare question him. People would have hung CRT in effigy had he dare tried to do anything to change SOS before he quit on us.

 

[Legendary Cock]

Because WE, the fans, gave SOS, the person who brought the 5 peat and 3 straight 11 wins seasons, a blank check to do whatever he wanted, no questions asked. WE let this happen by elevating him so high on a pedestal that no one dare question him. People would have hung CRT in effigy had he dare tried to do anything to change SOS before he quit on us.

This is partly true. We definitely gave Spurrier the keys to the kingdom. But his direct supervisor was Ray. The average fan didn't have direct access to the program or say so over what the HBC did or didn't do. That's why leaders are paid to lead -- and paid handsomely.

 

[bucketdad]

Of the big three team sports, the only one IMO that resembles a team is Frank's team. They are unselfish and utilized appropriately. Unfortunately, they dug themselves too deep a hole to get out of. Result- top half of the SEC.
Football team plays semi-team ball. (Arguably by necessity or choice, take your pick). I say semi-team because we seem to be reluctant to go to the bench. If you're on the field, you seem to be the guy no matter what. Result- middle of the SEC pack.
Now to baseball. Nothing screams team about this product on the field right now. We have nine players playing as individuals in a team sport. If this was our basketball team, we'd be last in the conference in assists. All the team bonding in the world wont help if everyone want to be THE GUY when they step between the lines. You want to be THE GUY? Be the guy that does what the situation calls for... primarily, get on base and/or advance the runners. You want a HR? Great! Do it in a sac-fly situation. We have too many innings where all three outs are fly balls. No excuse for a fly ball with two outs. None. That's not team baseball. Result- bottom half of the SEC... and that's being generous.
My 2 cents.

 

[WOFJRP]

The fans didn't question Steve Spurrier? Is that a joke? The fans jumped off of that bandwagon in record time. Spurrier hadn't had a losing season in his entire college coaching career since his first season at Duke in 1987. There was a lot of reason for optimism starting the 2015 season. New defensive coordinator, a QB that had rewritten the N.C. high school record books. We beat a North Carolina team, a team that didn't lose again until the ACC championship game, in the season opener. 2nd game we're up 7-0 on Kentucky, Connor Mitch injures his shoulder and doesn't play again the rest of the year. We lose to Kentucky and the rest of the year the fans booed lustily and departed early. People on here called for Spurrier to be fired throughout the rest of his tenure and those same people were appalled when he quit.

People point to the Tennessee firing of Phil Fulmer as premature and the blueprint for the wrong way to fire a legendary coach, even he got two losing seasons. Ray Tanner firing Steve Spurrier would have made his job of replacing Spurrier even harder than it was. Who would have taken a job where the prior coach had won 4 straight bowl games, more games than anybody in school history, was 1 year removed from an 11-2, 4th in the nation finish and got fired because he went 7-6 playing in the SEC?

 

[coolcock2001]

I wish Ray Tanner would send me a card or do something personally for me. It's just tough to go on right now in life with our Big Three Men's Sports being at an ALL TIME LOW

 

[jonesz21]

The fans didn't question Steve Spurrier? Is that a joke? The fans jumped off of that bandwagon in record time. Spurrier hadn't had a losing season in his entire college coaching career since his first season at Duke in 1987. There was a lot of reason for optimism starting the 2015 season. New defensive coordinator, a QB that had rewritten the N.C. high school record books. We beat a North Carolina team, a team that didn't lose again until the ACC championship game, in the season opener. 2nd game we're up 7-0 on Kentucky, Connor Mitch injures his shoulder and doesn't play again the rest of the year. We lose to Kentucky and the rest of the year the fans booed lustily and departed early. People on here called for Spurrier to be fired throughout the rest of his tenure and those same people were appalled when he quit.

People point to the Tennessee firing of Phil Fulmer as premature and the blueprint for the wrong way to fire a legendary coach, even he got two losing seasons. Ray Tanner firing Steve Spurrier would have made his job of replacing Spurrier even harder than it was. Who would have taken a job where the prior coach had won 4 straight bowl games, more games than anybody in school history, was 1 year removed from an 11-2, 4th in the nation finish and got fired because he went 7-6 playing in the SEC?

You get the coach u want with $$$. Not history. There is a reason urban has jumped all around the country.

 

[rogue cock]

You get the coach u want with $$$. Not history. There is a reason urban has jumped all around the country.

Sure...if you make the contract long enough. Even Tennessee to get an unproven Jeremy Pruitt had to commit at minimum almost $4,000,000 for 7 years. And that will increase and be extended annually. If he doesn't succeed, UT has one hell of a payout to make.

 

[Legendary Cock]

Sure...if you make the contract long enough. Even Tennessee to get an unproven Jeremy Pruitt had to commit at minimum almost $4,000,000 for 7 years. And that will increase and be extended annually. If he doesn't succeed, UT has one hell of a payout to make.

True. But Tennessee put on a clinic on how not to conduct a coaching search that year. They pretty much had no choice.

 

[BobbyB1975]

I like him but jury is still out. We lose a lot of guys after 2019 too so 2020 excuse is now rebuilding. 2019 built in excuse is tough schedule.

Yeap , you nailed it . Last season injuries were the excuse , next year it will be the schedule , in 2020 it will be breaking In a new QB and inexperience . I was on board with Mushamp but last year was a wake up call . Not saying he’s unperforming , he’s just doing what is pretty much the norm at Carolina for the past 100 years . My biggest fear is that as long as we finish .500 or better , I seriously doubt any changes will be made . I think we are very much in the same position we have been for decades . Win the ones we are supposed to win but can’t hang with the big boys . Honestly my expectations for next year are as low as I can remember so hopefully I’m pleasantly surprised .

 

[WOFJRP]

You get the coach u want with $$$. Not history. There is a reason urban has jumped all around the country.

Good example, because as everyone knows Florida and Ohio State had no football history before Urban landed there.

 

[wdgamecock22]

Good example, because as everyone knows Florida and Ohio State had no football history before Urban landed there.

Also let's not forget Notre dame was prepared to throw the bank at him