Change my mind

vacock#

Well-Known Member
Oct 26, 1998
33,127
3,492
113
It is weird as Spurrier had better defense and he was an offensive genius. And Muschamp has had better offense than his defense. And he is a defensive genius.
Interesting and correct. I think SOS knew both sides and pushed his defensive coaches to be better. Probably during meetings with the coaches.
 

vacock#

Well-Known Member
Oct 26, 1998
33,127
3,492
113
Where is there any great defense in college football now? Legalized pick plays, bubble screens, and targeting have moved offenses unreachability ahead of defenses. Even Alabama can't shut down a really good offense now.
You didn’t mention legalized holding, something that our players don’t get or haven’t been taught.
 

Gamecock Lifer

Well-Known Member
Oct 8, 2008
7,450
3,388
113
If CWM were a defensive genius, then our defense would be better. Or our talent level is low. Please change my mind; how is CWM a defensive genius?
Our defense is pretty good if the UT game is an indication. We had about three blown coverages, one helped by an uncalled OPI. Besides that we played well most of the game. D was pretty good IN THE FIRST HALF OF GAMES last year too! By the third quarter they were usually so gassed from being on the field the whole game and so dejected from realizing the O had zero chance of doing anything, they would eventually break. Muschamp did not build his rep here though. He built it at places like LSU, Auburn and Texas. He coached one of the best defenses in SEC history the year LSU won the Natty while he was there... His Texas defenses were consistently the best in the Big 12 in numerous factors (tallest midget but still) and his first multi-year stint at Auburn he was very successful. Even at UF, they had up and down results but his defenses were ROCK SOLID, and the defense he built/players he recruited fueled the success they had for years after he left. Mckwain was an offensive guy, it was WILL’S D that won then the East the first couple years Jim got there.

That is all truth, he is a great DC! Fantastic- one of the best in the game. If you truly believe he can’t coach Defense when faced with so much evidence that he most certainly can, that is on you Va, but you are being intentionally obtuse. Sour grapes after a bad season is understandable, but I guarantee if we fire him, he will find a job as a DC at big time program and it will happen FAST!
 

king ward

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 1999
29,023
20,966
113
69
Lancaster, SC
You didn’t mention legalized holding, something that our players don’t get or haven’t been taught.
It is a factor, but it isn't exactly recently added factor. Been seeing it for years. In fact, when I was in high school, I remember being at practice and watching coaches teaching offensive linemen how to grab and hold defensive linemen with their legs if they found themselves on the ground. That was a long time ago.
 

DeBoer31

Member
Gold Member
Jun 19, 2015
297
293
63
Where is there any great defense in college football now? Legalized pick plays, bubble screens, and targeting have moved offenses unreachability ahead of defenses. Even Alabama can't shut down a really good offense now.
you hit the nail on the head....like most sports...football has bastardized itself toward the side of finesse and scoring. We all know why (money).
Also...who ever said WM was a defensive "genius"? They're are like 2-3 of those the last 40 years in all of football...and WM ain't one of 'em.
 
  • Like
Reactions: king ward

KA Martin

Member
Jun 29, 2020
91
144
33
Where is there any great defense in college football now? Legalized pick plays, bubble screens, and targeting have moved offenses unreachability ahead of defenses. Even Alabama can't shut down a really good offense now.
Watch Clemson play.
 

Lurker123

Member
May 4, 2020
529
427
63
It is a factor, but it isn't exactly recently added factor. Been seeing it for years. In fact, when I was in high school, I remember being at practice and watching coaches teaching offensive linemen how to grab and hold defensive linemen with their legs if they found themselves on the ground. That was a long time ago.
I remember Taneyhill complaining after a non conference game about holding calls. I think his quote was something like "we dont call holding in the SEC."

Meaning, yeah, it's been around a while.
 
  • Like
Reactions: king ward

DeBoer31

Member
Gold Member
Jun 19, 2015
297
293
63
Watch Clemson play.
I have watched Clemson play. I think they are a pack of mouth breathers with bateful thoughts in all male locker rooms. Seriously though...they run a version of Saban's defense. It isn't a secret what they do. They do get high quality student-athletes of late...and also they play in the ACC. So.....the ACC = less competition, less injuries, less requirement to go to battle EVERY Saturday in conference....
also I'm not bitter. One last thing though...they openly saunter around and skip about wearing orange and purple....so there is a lot of irony in their not liking us gameCOCKS.....not that there is anything wrong with that!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tmac069

lostcock

Active Member
Sep 28, 2006
1,858
1,353
113
Cola Town
Offense sells tickets, and SOS knew that at UF, hence the birth of the Fun -n- Gun, but I think people forget how good their defense(s) were, and the same can be said for Miami and FSU from 1990-2001 but that’s what happens when those 3 locked down the entire state of Florida for the same decade. Interestingly enough, 1 of those 3 schools (and 2 of them one year) was involved in every MNC for that entire period. Insanity. You will never see that again.
 

king ward

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 1999
29,023
20,966
113
69
Lancaster, SC
Offense sells tickets, and SOS knew that at UF, hence the birth of the Fun -n- Gun, but I think people forget how good their defense(s) were, and the same can be said for Miami and FSU from 1990-2001 but that’s what happens when those 3 locked down the entire state of Florida for the same decade. Interestingly enough, 1 of those 3 schools (and 2 of them one year) was involved in every MNC for that entire period. Insanity. You will never see that again.
Everything you said has merit, plus let's face it, he was a quarterback. But their best team - the one that won the NC, had an outstanding defense with Stoops coaching it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lostcock

lostcock

Active Member
Sep 28, 2006
1,858
1,353
113
Cola Town
Everything you said has merit, plus let's face it, he was a quarterback. But their best team - the one that won the NC, had an outstanding defense with Stoops coaching it.
After a quick check they scored about 5000 points, and the D was around 225 PA for an average of about 17 ppg scored against. The odd thing is they only gave up 30 to LSU, Auburn, and UGA combined, with only both Tigers being ranked, and 29 to UT (good UT with Manning), 21 to Vandy, and 25 to us. 75 of the 225ish (3 out of 13) games. I get the feeling they subbed a lot of D in those games they scored 50-60 points in (7 out of 13) and I can’t remember our game at all that year.
 
  • Like
Reactions: king ward

843tjsdad78

Well-Known Member
Gold Member
Aug 13, 2017
3,969
3,916
113
38
Watch Clemson play.
The same Clemson that came in ranked number 1 in the country in defense and BMac lit their ass up for 600 yards.....or the Clemson that sends half of the ACC draft picks each year. When was the last time Georgia Tech had player drafted?