I've asked this question on the UGA board but most folks over there don't really have an answer and you'd never get a good answer on the Clemp site so maybe I should ask some of you who live in South Carolina. That program while yes had been consistent became a juggernaut in 2015. The year before they went 10-3 but had blowout losses to UGA & GT and even in the years before that they would have nice records but blowout losses to you guys & usually FSU or someone. So my question is how did they turn it around so quickly? They've had the OC/DC for years. Elite players for years. Did they just sell there soul or something?
How did Clemson become elite overnight?
- Thread starter KirbysDawgs
- Start date
Thad Turnipseed. That’s exactly how.
back to back generational quarterbacks!
But that Defense though. That was there Achilles heel. Boyd was very good. Remember when they lost 70-33 to WVU in the Orange Bowl? Lol
Get ready for back to back to back generational QBs.
Yet some on here argue recruiting isn’t a big part of success. Blows my mind.
They played Russian roulette, laundering money to recruits via New Spring Church, and they won.
Now they run a clean program, straight up rollin'
Now they run a clean program, straight up rollin'
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After 5 straight Carolina wins ending in 13’ they broke out the check book.
New Spring has a lot to do with it.
How did they get those QB’s? How did they get those players around those QB’s? Don’t you know about Clemson’s resources?
Flipped a few FLA players some that never even came to campus. Led me to believe that they have some heavy money exchanging up there.
Every school does it, i think they just did it harder and more overtly than everyone else. At that time, they had really nothing going for them that would suggest that increase in recruiting.
Some point to Newspring church in funneling money since the church provides a smoke screen due to tax laws and such. That might be true but hard to prove.
Every school does it, i think they just did it harder and more overtly than everyone else. At that time, they had really nothing going for them that would suggest that increase in recruiting.
Some point to Newspring church in funneling money since the church provides a smoke screen due to tax laws and such. That might be true but hard to prove.
They fired the DC that year and went out and got Venables. That was the turning point for their defense. At the time I wasn't sure he was a good hire coming from Oklahoma and the Big 12 where everyone was putting up big offensive numbers. Their recruiting classes have become more elite. Ten years ago, Clemson and USC's classes were in similar positions rankings wise and we beat them 5 years straight. During that time they were still playing for ACC championships and going to BCS bowls. That boosted their recruiting while we dropped the ball instead of taking advantage of our success.
Some on here say muschamp is a great recruiter. Blows my mind
They also dumped a “buddy” OC hire quick then another OC and I believe then went and found chad Morris. We would never do that type of thing. Dabo didn’t hold onto weak links in the chain until the board made him do something like we do
Same way they did in the 1970s and 1980s. Bubbas with money paying off players to come to clemsin....
They didnt become elite overnight....
They became elite slowly and during the midst of us beating them 5 years in a row...they laid a foundation of winning despite some failures and THEN they burst through and havent looked back.
If you think it was overnight though, you're wrong.
They became elite slowly and during the midst of us beating them 5 years in a row...they laid a foundation of winning despite some failures and THEN they burst through and havent looked back.
If you think it was overnight though, you're wrong.
Venables was being run out of town in Oklahoma though. They had putrid defenses.
Many on here believe it has to do with the 5 losses in a row to USC and that couldn’t be further from the truth. It started with Dabo’s recruitment of CJ Spiller and then the promotion of Dabo to head coach. Unlike many coaches who simply want to win, Dabo had a vision and every single move he made was a step toward accomplishing that vision. He was able to sell that vision to players and coaches. Then he made 2 perfect hires. First Chad Morris that enabled Clemson to build a new offensive identity which continues today, and then of course Venables who is far and away the best DC in college football. Unlike most coaches who have a system, Venables restructures his system every year around his players. With that framework as well as top notch recruiting, making players feel like they are part of a family and having each one truly buy in to his vision, Dabo’s plan came together.........Not to mention having the Board of Trustees sold on his vision.
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The ACC schedule can't be underestimated. Going back to the 80s, before FSU, Clemson DOMINATED the ACC. It's really astounding they only won a single NT back then. The 90s were rough but they had established a tradition of conference titles the decade before. Also, I think most of us have thoughts about what began to happen (again) under Tommy Bowden... see CJ Spiller's recruitment if you really want to see the roots of this thing.
To go back to my original point, there have been DOZENS of years when the ACC got Clemson 3 or 4 more wins than they would have gotten in the SEC or another conference, both in the 80s and in the 2010s... not every year, but by and large.
It can't be stated enough that when we were good enough to beat them five times in a row by 10 points or more, we weren't good enough to even make the SEC title game more than one time (at which we got murdered) while Clemson was back to winning the ACC and playing in BCS bowls.
The Carolina/Clemson rivalry does not matter outside of this state. It didn't matter that we beat them... they were the ones winning because their schedule allowed them to garner national attention even when losing to us. I honestly believe if you took a national poll asking who Clemson's primary rival is most folks across the nation would say Alabama.
I think @DocSmith89 nailed it. Vision is critical to be a leader, and to get people aligned behind leadership. It is clear that Dabo sells his vision, and implements his vision. And his vision is not just about winning. That helps immensely in recruiting and in building the culture.
Having said that, though, Dabo is also an excellent evaluator of coaching talent. The odd notion of taking a DC from the Big 12 (and from a team with not a good defense) and having that coach become one of (if not THE) best DC in college football has already been mentioned, and is remarkable.
But, even more remarkable in my view is the hiring of Chad Morris. Morris was an assistant coach at Tulsa and was one year --- ONE YEAR --- removed from being a high school coach! He relied on recommendations from people he trusted to make that hire.
Do WE have anyone who would make a hire like that?
Having said that, though, Dabo is also an excellent evaluator of coaching talent. The odd notion of taking a DC from the Big 12 (and from a team with not a good defense) and having that coach become one of (if not THE) best DC in college football has already been mentioned, and is remarkable.
But, even more remarkable in my view is the hiring of Chad Morris. Morris was an assistant coach at Tulsa and was one year --- ONE YEAR --- removed from being a high school coach! He relied on recommendations from people he trusted to make that hire.
Do WE have anyone who would make a hire like that?
It happened over a long time.
Lots on here don’t want to hear it ( and constantly defend cu to no end - which is sickening), but it starts with the weak conference they play in.
1> year in and year out, they play a weak in-conference schedule which allows them to; a>rest starters, b> help avoid injury to said starters, and - perhaps most importantly - c> GET BACKUPS LOTS OF MEANINGFUL EXPERIENCE. This builds quality DEPTH!
2> early on in dabo’s tenure, cu loaded up on skill players. Skill players and the new Chad Morris offense made for an exciting brand of football. Good players took notice, and wanted to come play in that style offense (which was scoring points and winning games).
3> after losing to us 5yrs in a row, I believe cu finally started - or maybe in the midst of the 5 - to pay attention to athletes in the trenches. They greatly improved the quality of those guys to compliment their skill position talent
4> Cheating. Do they do it? Some say everybody does (if WE do, we’re apparently really, really, REALLY bad at it). There is the fact of positive test results for ostarine. Argue that fact if you like. I’ll leave the Newspring issue out of my reasons since there’s no absolute smoking gun. But I believe bending the rules plays a part up thar.
At this point, they have a system that just feeds and sustains itself. Winning begets winning. And at this point, going back to point #1, having an easy 8-10 wins per year makes it easy to sustain.
Lots on here don’t want to hear it ( and constantly defend cu to no end - which is sickening), but it starts with the weak conference they play in.
1> year in and year out, they play a weak in-conference schedule which allows them to; a>rest starters, b> help avoid injury to said starters, and - perhaps most importantly - c> GET BACKUPS LOTS OF MEANINGFUL EXPERIENCE. This builds quality DEPTH!
2> early on in dabo’s tenure, cu loaded up on skill players. Skill players and the new Chad Morris offense made for an exciting brand of football. Good players took notice, and wanted to come play in that style offense (which was scoring points and winning games).
3> after losing to us 5yrs in a row, I believe cu finally started - or maybe in the midst of the 5 - to pay attention to athletes in the trenches. They greatly improved the quality of those guys to compliment their skill position talent
4> Cheating. Do they do it? Some say everybody does (if WE do, we’re apparently really, really, REALLY bad at it). There is the fact of positive test results for ostarine. Argue that fact if you like. I’ll leave the Newspring issue out of my reasons since there’s no absolute smoking gun. But I believe bending the rules plays a part up thar.
At this point, they have a system that just feeds and sustains itself. Winning begets winning. And at this point, going back to point #1, having an easy 8-10 wins per year makes it easy to sustain.
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Recited to the tune of "hold that tiger".
The assistant that was fired from their basketball team says it all, after his attempted bribe of the Williams family. I believe his words were That's how the Football team does it. They will be covered by the NCAA (no investigations) which is basically run by ACC schools. It's easier to hide money deals out thar in them hills. USC is working against this network and will always be an uphill battle. We don't have a fair playing field to cheat on. Lol
Exactly! Even when we were beating them, I remember saying to my dad, “We beat Clemson’s best teams since 1981 five in a row.” Clemson was already building and getting good. Once they built great OL and DL trenches on top of the great position coaches, they overcame their weaknesses and they have kicked tail ever sense. But it was nowhere close to an overnight turnaround.
As far as Venables is concerned, everyone knows that the stoops boys had him handcuffed. There was no way they would allow some young guy to have full control and get the credit for success.
dabo hired and unleashed Mongo
dabo hired and unleashed Mongo
Back in the late 80’s, the businesses in downtown Clemson were mostly owned by boosters. Players would go in, order their food, pay with a $10 bill, and walk out with a $100 bill mixed in their change.
It never fails to amuse me that 1)USC fans somehow think Clemson losing to Carolina had anything to do with their rise to prominence. 2) when you support a floundering program you accuse others of cheating.
Very good points. Everyone likes to rag on the ACC and so be it. Does anyone really think Clemson wants to be in another conference? Is there a single USC fan that wouldn’t jump to the ACC if it meant they could win National Championships, or would they rather beat their chest chanting SEC each year they end up as the doormat in a “better” conference?
Besides the cheating, they decided they were going to have a high octane offense. Being in the ACC helped them get it going due to facing usually weak defenses most weeks. But still, they stuck with their game plan whether or not they were playing a pushover or an SEC team. Everybody ridiculed them saying their offenses wouldn't work in the SEC or against good defenses. Recruits at the skill positions took note and wanted to play in this fun high scoring offense. The OL followed and as they started getting better, the big time defensive players started piling up. I do believe they cranked up the money machine but they still had to stick with their plan and make the program attractive. What do our coaches do? They come here trying to get bowl eligible. Going in to living rooms making promises for the future doesn't compare to showing highlights from what's happening on the field.
I hate that we left the ACC. All of the matchups there are more natural and interesting to me. UNC and NC St or Mizzou and A&M? Please.
Lol....yup, the cult of National Championships.
. . . and don't forget re: Venables, that he's a 'never-will-be-a-Head-Coach' weirdo. I've heard that he may have a 'stage fright' complex, and man-oh-man does ole camera hog Dabo love it! He's got Venables locked for life.
ROFLMAO... 6 time champ Nick Saban says hi...
It is a wonder to me how many here attribute Clemson's success to unproven allegations and refuse to recognize the characteristics of their program that are right in front of their eyes.
And, then, accuse those of us with a more practical and pragmatic view of "defending" Clemson.
Go ahead. Refuse to recognize what they are doing right, and go for something different because, well, they're Clemson and we aren't.
Nose, meet face.
And, then, accuse those of us with a more practical and pragmatic view of "defending" Clemson.
Go ahead. Refuse to recognize what they are doing right, and go for something different because, well, they're Clemson and we aren't.
Nose, meet face.
I'm not sure how they did it, but they did it. They are elite. I don't always agree with what Dabo does or how he does it, but he is getting it done. After losing five in a row to us, he started making changes and (maybe) passing out some change... Ha!
Either way, Clemson is a national powerhouse right now. And the only way we can do something about it is to beat them. That's it. We have to win.
Look, I'll never cheer for Clemson. I'm a Gamecock through and through; however, I refuse to make fun of them while they are kicking our butt. I don't like it... but they are good. Really good.
Either way, Clemson is a national powerhouse right now. And the only way we can do something about it is to beat them. That's it. We have to win.
Look, I'll never cheer for Clemson. I'm a Gamecock through and through; however, I refuse to make fun of them while they are kicking our butt. I don't like it... but they are good. Really good.
They have the great fortune of being at the top of their league when the playoffs were created. Much like Bama and OSU, the rich got richer. Easy to recruit when you can sell playoff history imo. For the most part, the same schools get in year after year since its beginnings, with few exceptions. And they will continue to out recruit everyone else until a change is made to the playoff structure.
Nick won his first title at the age of 52. Dabo just now 50 and already has a 2 with a shot for a 3rd.
