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We're not doing Joyner any favors.

ConKreteCock

ConKreteCock

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Oct 11, 2008
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Joyner is never going to get any meaningful snaps at QB for us. I know there are many fans out there who will whine, bitch and moan and continue to speculate wildly about how, when and if Joyner will get his shot but the bottom line is: he won't. He's not a QB.

So......... with that said, how sad is it that our coaching staff won't be straight with the young man and tell him that? You could make a case that our coaching staff is honoring their word by *allowing* him to remain at the QB slot.......... but since he's never gonna be our QB, then you can make an argument that he's just taking up a spot on the the roster. In that case, our coaching staff is just hurting the team. Just because a kid has delusions of playing QB doesn't mean the rest of us, or our coaching staff has to pretend right along with him.

Never gonna happen. Ergo: wasted spot.
 
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Joyner made a statement this weekend that if he wanted to play any position besides QB then he definitely would not have come to USC . He said if he wanted to play another position he would be at Bama or Clemson . That’s pretty cut and dry . If our staff tried to force him to change positions they would lose all credibility with other high profile recruits . If Hilinski wins the job ( which is absolutely no guarantee) Joyner will transfer out to a School where he can QB . It’s his decision ultimately. Also who knows what will happen . If we have no playmakers and a suspect OL then Hilinski will be a liability . Dak proved he can move the chains with his scrambling ability . Either way it will be interesting .
 
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BobbyB1975 said:
Joyner made a statement this weekend that if he wanted to play any position besides QB then he definitely would not have come to USC . He said if he wanted to play another position he would be at Bama or Clemson . That’s pretty cut and dry . If our staff tried to force him to change positions they would lose all credibility with other high profile recruits . If Hilinski wins the job ( which is absolutely no guarantee) Joyner will transfer out to a School where he can QB . It’s his decision ultimately. Also who knows what will happen . If we have no playmakers and a suspect OL then Hilinski will be a liability . Dak proved he can move the chains with his scrambling ability . Either way it will be interesting .
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I think he's on track for the portal. He might even play the hardship card to become eligible somewhere else in 2020. It won't be Ohio State. Maybe Ohio University.
 
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BobbyB1975 said:
Joyner made a statement this weekend that if he wanted to play any position besides QB then he definitely would not have come to USC . He said if he wanted to play another position he would be at Bama or Clemson . That’s pretty cut and dry . If our staff tried to force him to change positions they would lose all credibility with other high profile recruits . If Hilinski wins the job ( which is absolutely no guarantee) Joyner will transfer out to a School where he can QB . It’s his decision ultimately. Also who knows what will happen . If we have no playmakers and a suspect OL then Hilinski will be a liability . Dak proved he can move the chains with his scrambling ability . Either way it will be interesting .
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Dak proved to be inaccurate when slinging the ball around. He had the one pick in the red zone by the Southern Cal transfer, and several that were almost picked off. Yes, he might move the chains a little with his legs. But how many INT’s will he throw? I think Hilinski looked better throwing. Just my opinion.
 
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ConKreteCock said:
Joyner is never going to get any meaningful snaps at QB for us. I know there are many fans out there who will whine, bitch and moan and continue to speculate wildly about how, when and if Joyner will get his shot but the bottom line is: he won't. He's not a QB.

So......... with that said, how sad is it that our coaching staff won't be straight with the young man and tell him that? You could make a case that our coaching staff is honoring their word by *allowing* him to remain at the QB slot.......... but since he's never gonna be our QB, then you can make an argument that he's just taking up a spot on the the roster. In that case, our coaching staff is just hurting the team. Just because a kid has delusions of playing QB doesn't mean the rest of us, or our coaching staff has to pretend right along with him.

Never gonna happen. Ergo: wasted spot.
Click to expand...

Not saying that this will happen but if Jake gets hurt early are you burning Hilinski's redshirt
 
Dakereon Joyner would start right now at a division 2 school but he will struggle in division 1 and it doesn’t matter what conference, but for some reason I believe he could win on this level if he sticks it out another year, and trains under a good coach. There’s something about him that says leader/Winner but it’s apparently clear that he’s not ready to be number 2 at this level right now! And I don’t think RYAN HILINSKI is either to tell you the truth; those short passes don’t impress me much and I think he’s “Overrated” but hopefully I’m wrong! JAY Urich needs to stay at the QB position, but I don’t I believe he’s getting a fair shot.
 
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ConKreteCock said:
Joyner is never going to get any meaningful snaps at QB for us. I know there are many fans out there who will whine, bitch and moan and continue to speculate wildly about how, when and if Joyner will get his shot but the bottom line is: he won't. He's not a QB.

So......... with that said, how sad is it that our coaching staff won't be straight with the young man and tell him that? You could make a case that our coaching staff is honoring their word by *allowing* him to remain at the QB slot.......... but since he's never gonna be our QB, then you can make an argument that he's just taking up a spot on the the roster. In that case, our coaching staff is just hurting the team. Just because a kid has delusions of playing QB doesn't mean the rest of us, or our coaching staff has to pretend right along with him.

Never gonna happen. Ergo: wasted spot.
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I hope Dak Joyner will do what is best for him. 3 or 4 years of making $300-400k in the league would not be bad. Surely he would keep that in mind and find the position he is most marketable in.

Dak is a heck of an athlete, and I wish him the very best. We all have to compromise with the reality we are presented with.
 
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gr8spur said:
Dak proved to be inaccurate when slinging the ball around. He had the one pick in the red zone by the Southern Cal transfer, and several that were almost picked off. Yes, he might move the chains a little with his legs. But how many INT’s will he throw? I think Hilinski looked better throwing. Just my opinion.
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Exactly. Ten of 23 in a glorified scrimmage is not good on any level....and many who were praising DJ for his performance were criticizing JB for a 9-14 performance in limited action. Also agree that Hilinski looked very good slinging the ball around and actually showed some wheels on a couple of plays.
 
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Either Joyner himself, or whomever has his ear, just isn't thinking about this properly if it is to be believed that he only wants to be a QB and that is why he came to Carolina. He has had a year to develop at this level. And from what was seen in the spring game I think it is highly unlikely that he will ever be a starter at QB. Now he might decide to transfer. Who knows? But he could be hurting himself with this type of thinking if it does indeed exist. He is a great athlete. Possibly could find a career in the NFL as a wideout, or cornerback. But the chances of him having a possible future as a QB in the pros are nil. If he is inflexible about moving from the QB position he really is only hurting himself.
 
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I hope Jake stays healthy because I don’t wanna see Hilinski thrown into the fire before he’s ready. He needs a lot of work and I hope he gets some playing time to build on where he’s at now,
 
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The best QB we've ever had Connor Shaw was not the world's most accurate passer as a freshman and sophomore! Posters on this very forum swore he wasn't SEC material as a freshman and wanted to move him to wr. But we fans never know what we don't know! Have enough patience and class to let the young man compete and grow.
 
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Brace1 said:
I hope Jake stays healthy because I don’t wanna see Hilinski thrown into the fire before he’s ready. He needs a lot of work and I hope he gets some playing time to build on where he’s at now,
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Agree, I don't want Hilinski thrown to the wolves either, but I think he is a lot more ready for it than Jake was when he got thrown to the wolves.
 
lawcalcock said:
Please Jake played like freshman in half our games last year!
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Yes he did but he also played pretty well in half of them. I know you may be excited from what you saw from Hilinski in the spring game, but that was a mirage in my opinion. Will Muschamp has a way of making mediocre QBs look good in spring games; look at how good he made Brandon Mcllwain look in the 2016 spring game. Yesterday didn’t show me anything to make me believe Ryan Hilinski is ready to win a SEC football game!
 
He should play - he adds a different element. Hopefully we will be creative and flexible enough to use him at times. If Jake stumbles, someone else needs to come in.
 
rogue cock said:
How it that? He had every opportunity to burn Grier's RS year but didn't.
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I’m saying that because you making it sound like William Muschamp has learned from his mistakes, and I beg to differ with you on that! Yes he made a mistake by not burning Grier’s redshirt but by no means did that make him any wiser! The man brought Kurt Roper here as his offensive coordinator after he was fired with him at Florida, and he kept him on staff after a disastrous first year as our offensive coordinator. Will Muschamp doesn’t learn lessons (IMO) he only reacts when the pressure comes down on him.
 
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Brace1 said:
I’m saying that because you making it sound like William Muschamp has learned from his mistakes, and I beg to differ with you on that! Yes he made a mistake by not burning Grier’s redshirt but by no means did that make him any wiser! The man brought Kurt Roper here as his offensive coordinator after he was fired with him at Florida, and he kept him on staff after a disastrous first year as our offensive coordinator. Will Muschamp doesn’t learn lessons (IMO) he only reacts when the pressure comes down on him.
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Roper was only at UF one year....and in that year their offensive productivity increased by a good bit. I can't blame him for bringing Roper based on that. It didn't work out and he changed OC's. Where in that scenario you get that he hasn't learned his lessons, I'm not sure....unless it is simply that you don't like Muschamp and aren't willing to give him credit for anything.
 
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I donot agree with many of the posters. Given the opportunity, this kid can be special. He can throw and he can move the ball with his legs. The one dimensional QB work when you have an array of offensive threats, which we do not have. We excelled when Connor Shaw ran our offense. He was a defensive headache. DJ would be a defensive nighmare.

These type of QB's drove us crazy.
 
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I swear that 75% of the jack@$$es who post here are Clemson fans in disguise. Joyner looked pretty good. Jamal Cook made a hell of a play on that INT otherwise, he leads us on 4 scoring drives.

Keep in mind that during the Spring game, a lot of people get reps, including receivers who aren't as talented, or who don't run the perfect routes, or who drop passes, or who just don't have the timing down with every QB.

Joyner's ability to scramble is definitely his best attribute, but the kid can sling it, and with experience may end up being an all SEC QB.

Yesterday, the coaching staff rolled him out of the pocket on over half of his snaps. That was by design but doesn't help his completion percentage.

The coaches want him on the edge with the option to run or pass. I believe that's what they're preparing him to do this season. I think he will get meaningful reps as a change of pace backup.

The rest of the speculation needs to stop. Hilinski and Doty are both talented young QB's and there's no telling how it will work out, but we have some great options. I'm cheering for all of them.
 
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dreuscock said:
I donot agree with many of the posters. Given the opportunity, this kid can be special. He can throw and he can move the ball with his legs. The one dimensional QB work when you have an array of offensive threats, which we do not have. We excelled when Connor Shaw ran our offense. He was a defensive headache. DJ would be a defensive nighmare.

These type of QB's drove us crazy.
Click to expand...
A couple of big differences: First, we don't run the zone-read as our primary offense anymore like we did when Shaw was QB. Second, Shaw was an accurate passer who completed around 69% of his passes....Joyner is no where close to being an accurate passer.
 
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rogue cock said:
Roper was only at UF one year....and in that year their offensive productivity increased by a good bit. I can't blame him for bringing Roper based on that. It didn't work out and he changed OC's. Where in that scenario you get that he hasn't learned his lessons, I'm not sure....unless it is simply that you don't like Muschamp and aren't willing to give him credit for anything.
Click to expand...

Respectfully, what does he deserve credit for at this juncture?
 
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lawcalcock said:
The best QB we've ever had Connor Shaw was not the world's most accurate passer as a freshman and sophomore! Posters on this very forum swore he wasn't SEC material as a freshman and wanted to move him to wr. But we fans never know what we don't know! Have enough patience and class to let the young man compete and grow.
Click to expand...

Amen brother. I'm really pulling hard for this kid to succeed.
 
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Wiles2 said:
Respectfully, what does he deserve credit for at this juncture?
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He's made good coaching changes. He is recruiting well...especially along the OL and DL lines...and is building depth. He changed to a tempo offenses, which despite our defensive struggles last year produced better offensive results than many expected. He's building the team...which you have to do before you can build a program.
 
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ConKreteCock said:
Joyner is never going to get any meaningful snaps at QB for us. I know there are many fans out there who will whine, bitch and moan and continue to speculate wildly about how, when and if Joyner will get his shot but the bottom line is: he won't. He's not a QB.

So......... with that said, how sad is it that our coaching staff won't be straight with the young man and tell him that? You could make a case that our coaching staff is honoring their word by *allowing* him to remain at the QB slot.......... but since he's never gonna be our QB, then you can make an argument that he's just taking up a spot on the the roster. In that case, our coaching staff is just hurting the team. Just because a kid has delusions of playing QB doesn't mean the rest of us, or our coaching staff has to pretend right along with him.

Never gonna happen. Ergo: wasted spot.
Click to expand...

I said the same thing about Jay U. When he stepped on campus. Thankfully they are finding a way to utilize him
 
rogue cock said:
A couple of big differences: First, we don't run the zone-read as our primary offense anymore like we did when Shaw was QB. Second, Shaw was an accurate passer who completed around 69% of his passes....Joyner is no where close to being an accurate passer.
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Suggesting Shaw was an accurate passer as a freshman is bizarre and revisionist history! I remember having to defend him from this same kind of lunacy. Comparing Joyner to the experienced Shaw is very unfair! From what I saw yesterday he is as accurate as Bentley was last season. He is competing with Jake not Connor!
 
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rogue cock said:
He's made good coaching changes. He is recruiting well...especially along the OL and DL lines...and is building depth. He changed to a tempo offenses, which despite our defensive struggles last year produced better offensive results than many expected. He's building the team...which you have to do before you can build a program.
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Maybe so. Personally, think he's decent at everything but winning. (e.g. holds serve in recruiting, etc) Just felt last year's effort was really poor. If we hadn't won last second games against Missouri (divine intervention), Ole Miss and UT - it would have been a total trainwreck.

We'll get a deep dish of his Coach-speak again leading up to the season. Life in a vacuum as they scramble to fill seats...then the games actually happen. Based on what we've seen so far, really feel we'll be lucky to get to 6-6. If so, it will be interesting to see if he gets that extension again.
 
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lawcalcock said:
Suggesting Shaw was an accurate passer as a freshman is bizarre and revisionist history! I remember having to defend him from this same kind of lunacy. Comparing Joyner to the experienced Shaw is very unfair! From what I saw yesterday he is as accurate as Bentley was last season. He is competing with Jake not Connor!
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??? Shaw completed 69.7% of his passes his freshman year and over 65% his sophomore year. His worst year for completion %age was his senior year.
 
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rogue cock said:
Roper was only at UF one year....and in that year their offensive productivity increased by a good bit. I can't blame him for bringing Roper based on that. It didn't work out and he changed OC's. Where in that scenario you get that he hasn't learned his lessons, I'm not sure....unless it is simply that you don't like Muschamp and aren't willing to give him credit for anything.
Click to expand...
The offensive Productivity increased at Florida because the year before was woeful and the only way to go was up! I watched a few of Florida’s games that year and they looked awful on offense, so I wasn’t impressed at all.” And I bet Roper would still be hear if not for the rumble of the fans. Muschamp was dug in on Kurt Roper and if he was smart he would’ve looked for a offensive coordinator with experience instead of hiring a Wide Receiver Coach with no play calling experience. I’m not big on the new coaches he hired either, because they were plucked from the “buddy buddy system.” And no I don’t hate Muschamp I just believe he beats himself when it boils down to it. He has coaches and players out of position and that’s the same way it went down in Gainesville. He’s improved some things since he’s been in Columbia so yes he deserves some credit!
 
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rogers2869 said:
Our coaches know best. This board is laughable.
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Yes they do! They showed us what was up when they went into that bowl game, against a bottom tier ACC team; who we were favorite “against” and got beat down! That was all on Muschamp and the coaching staff right there, they didn’t have the Team ready to play and there’s no excuse for that, and that’s a stain on Muschamps record!
 
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