My questions for the Coach Martin is getting it done crowd...

[Gamecockben1979]

I have no axe to grind with Coach Martin. That is why I posted this thread. If he stays 20 more years I am fine with it.
Interesting tho how many people here that do not care about results.
Nice to see folks being honest with themselves.

Not caring about results is BS. As someone posted on another thread, Mike Young had a losing record after 7 years at Wofford. Even Dean Smith and Coach K went through years where fans called for their heads.

You don’t care more just because you want a coach fired. In fact, I could consider it completely short sighted.....

 

[PC31]

Ben.
What you are saying is THIS YEARS RESULTS do not matter.
Am I wrong?
You are saying Frank Martins teams results at South Caroline are good enough.
Am I wrong?

 

[FCB 2013 treble]

I think if PJ Dozier and Rakym Felder had been part of the team this recent season, South Carolina would of not struggled in December and would of won at Oklahoma state. home against Alabama and on the road at Missouri.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Ben.
What you are saying is THIS YEARS RESULTS do not matter.
Am I wrong?
You are saying Frank Martins teams results at South Caroline are good enough.
Am I wrong?

Yes you are wrong. If Will Muschamp doesn’t win 7 games next year do you want to fire him? If not does that mean the results do not matter to you?

Am I happy we did not make the tournament? No. Does that mean we need to fire Frank Martin? Also no.

Frank did a hell of a job this season. Guess you have forgotten about all the injuries. Sometimes they happen. The team improved as the season went on. They lost too many early games and had to be flawless in conference to have a chance. They fought their way to the bubble in late January/early February until a 3 game losing streak took that off the table.

Last time I looked Frank Martin has taken USC to the Final Four. Last time I looked he has more 9 win conference seasons than any other coach at USC since joining the SEC. Last time I looked, we were in the top 5 in conference wins the last four seasons....3 of which you consider disasters because we didn’t make the tournament.

2nd winningest coach in program history behind Frank McGuire, right?

 

[USCAndy]

The language? Matters little, and is understood by most anyone in sports above the high school level. But I do love how some keep giving Frank more and more leash. Or almost look at it from the standpoint that USC just couldn't get anybody else, so just be satisfied with what the program is. A poster above mentioned that Frank should have two more years. For what? He has been here almost a decade. Recruiting two years off a final four appearance is not the least bit threatening to any of the powers that be in the SEC. Frank gets paid very handsomely and will go away a rich man if Ray ever decides to take a chance on somebody else. In fact, Frank is highly overpaid considering the overall results, save one fluky three week stretch where a team that was in the bubble for the dance got hot and made it to the Final Four. Other than that his tenure has been a steady diet of mediocrity. But it seems like many USC folks, and maybe Ray, are satisfied with that.

Look across the board, our whole athletic program is struggling other than women’s soccer, women’s tennis, and women’s basketball. Heck, the softball team is suppose to be really really good this year and they’re off to an 0-4 start in SEC play. It’s downright pitiful how bad of a shape we’re in in most sports. Something has to give at some point. How long will the athletic department put up with this mediocrity? Fans aren’t showing up anymore. Oh sure the paid attendance looks good and everything, but look at the real story of how many people are in those seats. Really really discouraging. Tanner are you listening!

 

[jeff2001]

1 tournament team in 7 years. He needs to step down.

 

[king ward]

Yes you are wrong. If Will Muschamp doesn’t win 7 games next year do you want to fire him? If not does that mean the results do not matter to you?

Am I happy we did not make the tournament? No. Does that mean we need to fire Frank Martin? Also no.

Frank did a hell of a job this season. Guess you have forgotten about all the injuries. Sometimes they happen. The team improved as the season went on. They lost too many early games and had to be flawless in conference to have a chance. They fought their way to the bubble in late January/early February until a 3 game losing streak took that off the table.

Last time I looked Frank Martin has taken USC to the Final Four. Last time I looked he has more 9 win conference seasons than any other coach at USC since joining the SEC. Last time I looked, we were in the top 5 in conference wins the last four seasons....3 of which you consider disasters because we didn’t make the tournament.

2nd winningest coach in program history behind Frank McGuire, right?

Frank won't be fired this season. He won't be fired from here ever, irrespective of record. You should be perpetually happy.

 

[jimnasium]

Everyone on here wants good results why else would we be on here taking about it? Next year will be a crucial year for Frank IMO and he has to know that.

 

[Gamecockben1979]

Frank won't be fired this season. He won't be fired from here ever, irrespective of record. You should be perpetually happy.

Not looking for a lifetime contract. You do realize he’s a rumored candidate for UNLV. If he couldn’t coach, Frank Martin wouldn’t have options.

 

[king ward]

Not looking for a lifetime contract. You do realize he’s a rumored candidate for UNLV. If he couldn’t coach, Frank Martin wouldn’t have options.

If they are still interested, he needs to jump on it. Nobody said he can't coach. But his juju is bad. His second best team collapsed with two weeks to go in the regular season; his best team had its star get sick on the cusp of the national championship; he lost a promising group of players to BB-gun shenanigans; this year's team never had over eight able-bodied players available due to a variety of causes. Arguably the best player he ever brought on campus never suited up for us. He needs to get that juju on out of here - maybe for his own sake..

 

[PC31]

Everyone on here wants good results why else would we be on here taking about it? Next year will be a crucial year for Frank IMO and he has to know that.

Of course we all want good results.
Do results matter?
It's clear the answer is no to some here.
We want good results but we accept excuse after excuse after excuse for not getting them until NEXT YEAR. Next year the results count......maybe

 

[king ward]

Coach Martin has legitimate reasons for failing every year.
So unlucky.

juju

 

[king ward]

Injuries he couldn't help this year. Fully agree! Losing to Wyoming, Stoney Brooke, Ok St fall on him. The collapse at the end of Feb, has happened every year he's been here (even our final four year, we limped into the tourney as a 7 seed) I think you'd agree, we've discussed BB on here for years, as well as most people who follow BB that you can be a genius when it comes to X and O coach, but if you can't adapt your style to fit your talent on the team, you'll continue to lose. I remember early in the season, Frank almost boasted about taking loses if it meant teaching the guys to play his style of ball... I thought that's supposed to happen in practice and in the summer not during a season when you need every win you can get

juju

 

[uscnoklahoma2]

Look across the board, our whole athletic program is struggling other than women’s soccer, women’s tennis, and women’s basketball. Heck, the softball team is suppose to be really really good this year and they’re off to an 0-4 start in SEC play. It’s downright pitiful how bad of a shape we’re in in most sports. Something has to give at some point. How long will the athletic department put up with this mediocrity? Fans aren’t showing up anymore. Oh sure the paid attendance looks good and everything, but look at the real story of how many people are in those seats. Really really discouraging. Tanner are you listening!

I thought of this very thing tonight at the baseball game. The excitement is gone. There's zero energy. I feel like the gloom is knocking on the door.

 

[jimnasium]

Of course we all want good results.
Do results matter?
It's clear the answer is no to some here.
We want good results but we accept excuse after excuse after excuse for not getting them until NEXT YEAR. Next year the results count......maybe

Well, this year is behind us and the results are in I'm on board with collecting coaching applications if next year doesn't get better but I think it will. If we have to say goodbye to Frank then the whole process starts over that's what makes it so &&@! aggravating. A coach can be a good recruiter but the fact remains the big timers are signing with Duke...UNC...Kentucky etc. because they are renowned basketball schools. Next year's team looks promising on paper but I'll wait and see. I thought we had a shot at Zion and he would have been the missing leak but Duke got him at the last moment (ain't it funny how that happened)?. Anyway, I'll be right here next season hoping for the dance. I haven't given up PC31 I've learn to live with the results and not let it define my life.

 

[drawplay000]

Thank you Ben
Not trying to argue here.....just want to see what people think
So you are saying results don't matter this year or next, correct?
Firing Coach Martin would set us back but him taking another job not so much.
You are OK with Coach Martin acting like a raving insane out of control lunatic and cussing out the players IF the players still love him. Well I'm not. That gets on my last nerve. I am sick of his weak out of control ass doing that. Embarrassing IMO.

Set us back? Lol. How much furthe back can we get.? Hell we never beat clemson and hardly ever make the tourney..

 

[drawplay000]

The language? Matters little, and is understood by most anyone in sports above the high school level. But I do love how some keep giving Frank more and more leash. Or almost look at it from the standpoint that USC just couldn't get anybody else, so just be satisfied with what the program is. A poster above mentioned that Frank should have two more years. For what? He has been here almost a decade. Recruiting two years off a final four appearance is not the least bit threatening to any of the powers that be in the SEC. Frank gets paid very handsomely and will go away a rich man if Ray ever decides to take a chance on somebody else. In fact, Frank is highly overpaid considering the overall results, save one fluky three week stretch where a team that was in the bubble for the dance got hot and made it to the Final Four. Other than that his tenure has been a steady diet of mediocrity. But it seems like many USC folks, and maybe Ray, are satisfied with that.

Thank you...finally someone who gets it..tired of all these frank apologist..

 

[kbradsher]

That Final 4 run wasn't a fluke. They should've been to the tournament the year before. Some fail to realize that both PJ Dozier, Sindarius Thornwell and Chris Silva were National recruits. Duane Notice was highly regarded as well in Canada. What actually helped them out that year was having additional shooting from the outside in Rah Felder. Frank is a great X's and O's coach that gets the most out of his players. What hurts him is his on court antics with his players. That's the main reason he misses on the high level SC kids. This is still the bible belt. I talked to a coach the other day that has a kid they may be a promising player in a few years and he said,"I can't have a Coach talking like that to my kid. I will have a major problem with that".

I agree. Yesterday after he was going off the court, he was interviewed and just threw Silva under the bus and then ran over him. I get it that his players love him but a parent watching him on television is not going to want their child to play for him. South Carolina had a gold mine of players this past year in high school and we land one 3 star recruit.

 

[crouterhead]

The results do matter. The results are good. The Gamecocks had a good year, in terms of wins and losses, this year. That's why he has the job and will keep it going forward.

 

[jeff2001]

The results do matter. The results are good. The Gamecocks had a good year, in terms of wins and losses, this year. That's why he has the job and will keep it going forward.

500 is good with 1 of those wins being North Greenville? After the final 4 run, we are 1 game above 500 in the last 2 years.

 

[dcdayday]

That Final 4 run wasn't a fluke. They should've been to the tournament the year before. Some fail to realize that both PJ Dozier, Sindarius Thornwell and Chris Silva were National recruits. Duane Notice was highly regarded as well in Canada. What actually helped them out that year was having additional shooting from the outside in Rah Felder. Frank is a great X's and O's coach that gets the most out of his players. What hurts him is his on court antics with his players. That's the main reason he misses on the high level SC kids. This is still the bible belt. I talked to a coach the other day that has a kid they may be a promising player in a few years and he said,"I can't have a Coach talking like that to my kid. I will have a major problem with that".

I agree. Yesterday after he was going off the court, he was interviewed and just threw Silva under the bus and then ran over him. I get it that his players love him but a parent watching him on television is not going to want their child to play for him. South Carolina had a gold mine of players this past year in high school and we land one 3 star recruit.

The parent/coach that made this comment to me is a hall of fame player at a instate University.

 

[mUSiC-man]

Frank Martin can recruit!. His players become All Americans when they are injured and miss playing time!

 

[polo-loco]

The results do matter. The results are good. The Gamecocks had a good year, in terms of wins and losses, this year. That's why he has the job and will keep it going forward.

Wait, what?

 

[Thigh Man]

We've heard this before. "Wait 'til next year".

Buddy, you are listening on the wrong frequency. The "Give him 2 more years" idiots are already out and offering excuses.

This year they are whining about injuries, injuries, injuries. TO WHO???
Minyah??? What the hell was Minyah going to change??? Bullshit to those who are already deifying players who have done nothing.

The same stuttering fools already have decided next year their battle cry will be "But, but, but we lost Silva." Grow Up Fools!

But, the funniest of them all is the ... "If we fire Fat Frank, we're setting ourselves back again."... FROM WHAT??? MEDIOCRITY??? From losing to teams like Stoney Brook? ... Wyoming (8-24)? ... Wofford? ... Clemson? ... back-to-back years???

 

[Harvard Gamecock]

You've just observed, or will observe upon his retention, their maximum level of importance. Win more conference games than you lose and the overall record doesn't matter. Dancing doesn't matter.

If only I had the same criteria during my career in the corporate world. Results matter little, future results matter little, just show up and you'll get paid. Handsomely

 

[uscg1984]

Of course we all want good results.
Do results matter?
It's clear the answer is no to some here.
We want good results but we accept excuse after excuse after excuse for not getting them until NEXT YEAR. Next year the results count......maybe

I am not in the "Coach Martin is getting it done crowd," but I think you are mistaking "results don't matter" for a difference of opinion about what constitutes "good results." I think even the most ardent Martin defenders agree that had the trajectory of this team in December continued on into the SEC schedule, he might very well be gone. At that time, we had serious discussions about where we would find any SEC wins. Had the Gamecocks gone 2-16 in the conference, I don't think Martin would have a lot of defenders.

However, instead of the season turning into an absolute dumpster fire, the team managed to have a pretty good SEC season and finished as a .500 team. For the "wait til next year crowd," those results are good because it gives them reason to think that perhaps an NCAA tournament caliber season is right around the corner. For this crowd, as long as they have some inkling of hope going into next season, they don't want to risk jeopardizing that by firing the coach. They will never support a coaching change without one of those "dumpster fire" kind of seasons. Look at Brad Scott's career here if you want an example. Had Scott gone 5-6 or 6-5 his last season here instead of 1-10, he probably wouldn't have been fired.

So, it's not that results don't matter. They just define results different.

 

[ConKreteCock]

Surely at SOME POINT, results will matter?
That's all I am asking. When will that be?
When will wins be important?

"Several more years" - haven't you heard. Our fans love watching re-runs...apparently. Year after year after freakin' year.

 

[king ward]

Eight years is plenty enough to get any program, be it baseball, football, basketball, etc., turned around. He needs to show consistency in play and in the ability to win next year.....and make the NCAA tourney.

Sweet 16 minimum.

 

[rogue cock]

Sweet 16 minimum.

Hey, I'd be happy just making it without being on the bubble.

 

[king ward]

Hey, I'd be happy just making it without being on the bubble.

I figure some recompense for two straight lousy years is due.

 

[SCexpat38]

Buddy, you are listening on the wrong frequency. The "Give him 2 more years" idiots are already out and offering excuses.

This year they are whining about injuries, injuries, injuries. TO WHO???
Minyah??? What the hell was Minyah going to change??? Bullshit to those who are already deifying players who have done nothing.

The same stuttering fools already have decided next year their battle cry will be "But, but, but we lost Silva." Grow Up Fools!

But, the funniest of them all is the ... "If we fire Fat Frank, we're setting ourselves back again."... FROM WHAT??? MEDIOCRITY??? From losing to teams like Stoney Brook? ... Wyoming (8-24)? ... Wofford? ... Clemson? ... back-to-back years???

So essentially, anyone who has an opinion differing from your's is either an idiot or a stuttering fool.

 

[MANAFOLD]

And let me preface this by saying I am fine with Coach Martin staying here many more years, because I don't think we will get a better coach when he leaves..... yes I am that guy.

1) At what point will results matter? I don't mean feel goods or teaching yadda yadda yadda ..... I mean wins and losses.
2) Do you guys think if Coach Martin was hired by LSU tomorrow, it would set our program way back? I don't. Does anyone think we are on the verge of some fantastic run?
3) Are you not sick of Coach Martin losing his sht EVERY FKN GAME acting like an embarrassing lunatic? I swear I am sick of that and the excuses people make for him not being able to control himself in public more than I am sick of the team losing.

Is he getting it done?

Amen

 

[Cocky4SC]

The results do matter. The results are good. The Gamecocks had a good year, in terms of wins and losses, this year. That's why he has the job and will keep it going forward.

I hope this is sarcasm-
16-16 counting a win against D2 North Greenville that doesnt factor into tourney consideration is pathetic.

 

[Thigh Man]

So essentially, anyone who has an opinion differing from your's is either an idiot or a stuttering fool.

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one and they all stink.
And the purpose of your your reply? Do YOU have an opinion of your own? Or are you going to wait and regurgitate what some else has already posted ... wait till next year? Or, excuses about injuries? ... Or, better yet, ... but his players LOVE him and HE loves South Carolina. LOL!!!

Yeah, we had a chance to go to the dance ... until we lost to teams like Stony Brook, Wyoming, Providence College, Clemson and Wofford. I sincerely DO want to here YOUR opinion when we get passed over by the NIT.

 

[bayrooster]

Wait, what?

So sayeth Crouterhead.

 

[polo-loco]

Frank will stay 1-2, see if the new guys give him a shot at the tournament. If we are in the same place, he has to have second thoughts about staying on. He can probably make a decent and stress free living on TV.

 

[BobbyB1975]

And let me preface this by saying I am fine with Coach Martin staying here many more years, because I don't think we will get a better coach when he leaves..... yes I am that guy.

1) At what point will results matter? I don't mean feel goods or teaching yadda yadda yadda ..... I mean wins and losses.
2) Do you guys think if Coach Martin was hired by LSU tomorrow, it would set our program way back? I don't. Does anyone think we are on the verge of some fantastic run?
3) Are you not sick of Coach Martin losing his sht EVERY FKN GAME acting like an embarrassing lunatic? I swear I am sick of that and the excuses people make for him not being able to control himself in public more than I am sick of the team losing.

Is he getting it done?

No , no and No . Only entertaining thing about Carolina BBall is watching Frank lose his Sht .

 

[Garnet chicken]

No , no and No . Only entertaining thing about Carolina BBall is watching Frank lose his Sht .

And that happens every game.

 

[Harvard Gamecock]

No , no and No . Only entertaining thing about Carolina BBall is watching Frank lose his Sht .

Well everybody, there you have it.

 

[uscg1984]

Sweet 16 minimum.

I wouldn't put a requirement on just far we have to go in the tournament just because there are so many variables that effect how far a team goes. Like Rogue said, I'd just like us to go to the tournament with the only question on selection Sunday being about our seeding. I'd like us to finish the season strong instead of limping down the stretch like we usually seem to do. That would be a definite sign of improvement.

If we went to the tournament a couple of years with premature exits, then we could start to talk about tournament performance.